IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #27

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An injury to the head can cause memory loss. So can taking alcohol with certain medications/drugs. If CR does have memory loss, he isn't going to know what caused it, is he.
One reason I don't believe that CR experienced memory loss is partly due to a peculiar comment he told the media early on. I don't have a link right now, but it was something like, "I have a theory of what happened, I hope police check into it..." something like that.

Now how would he have developed a theory about what happened that night if he had amnesia or was blacked out?
 
One reason I don't believe that CR experienced memory loss is partly due to a peculiar comment he told the media early on. I don't have a link right now, but it was something like, "I have a theory of what happened, I hope police check into it..." something like that.

Now how would he have developed a theory about what happened that night if he had amnesia or was blacked out?

That was his attorney who said that. Not him.
 
One reason I don't believe that CR experienced memory loss is partly due to a peculiar comment he told the media early on. I don't have a link right now, but it was something like, "I have a theory of what happened, I hope police check into it..." something like that.

Now how would he have developed a theory about what happened that night if he had amnesia or was blacked out?

Backround information? Rumors? Things that he remembers from earlier in the night?
 
http://z13.invisionfree.com/PorchlightUSA/ar/t18950.htm

"Spierer was last seen rounding a corner on her way back to her apartment -- a half-mile away � about 4:15 a.m. Salzmann said Rossman was not the last one to see Spierer that morning; three or four others saw her after Rossman.

Asked what he thinks happened to Spierer, he said, "I have my theory.

"I hope they follow all the leads we've given."
 
^^ this comment tells me that CR remembers SOMETHHING from that night, no?

Considering it was not CR but his lawyer who made that statement, then no.
Lawyer could have obtained some information from other sources in order to defend his client.
 
An injury to the head can cause memory loss. So can taking alcohol with certain medications/drugs. If CR does have memory loss, he isn't going to know what caused it, is he? Obviously his lawyer is going to present it in a best possible light for CR.
It's not like it can be proven one way or the other.
And if LS didn't go missing and said the next morning that she doesn't remember anything she was doing during the night, would anyone question it? Memory loss is certainly possible considering the alleged behavior. Whether CR actually doesn't remember anything-only CR knows that.

I seem to recall that CR did not seek medical attention (I think that was in the TG blog, not sure if it was also in MSM). That makes it seem to me that either A) there was no loss of memory or B) he thought that the loss of memory might be due to something he did not want to talk about even with his doctor (alcohol and drug use, perhaps?). If someone had memory loss and thought it was due to a concussion caused by a blow to the head, seeking medical attention to verify the injuries would have been the reasonable thing to do. As far as I know, CR and CS have chosen not to have charges filed against ZO, even though there is videotape and witnesses to the incident, so that CR's memory is not needed.
 
^^ this comment tells me that CR remembers SOMETHING from that night, no?

Even if you want to look at this as CR remembers something, the "theory" is most likely supported from events earlier in the night. Salzmann stated CR does not remember anything from 15 minutes before the punch through the night. He most likely said something like "I don't even remember leaving Kilroys"

But their "theory" could be from what he remembers before. As an example, let's say LS told CR that her and JW are fighting and he's been acting jealous and keeps bothering her. They could use this information as a "lead" to BPD. Just an example.
 
I seem to recall that CR did not seek medical attention (I think that was in the TG blog, not sure if it was also in MSM). That makes it seem to me that either A) there was no loss of memory or B) he thought that the loss of memory might be due to something he did not want to talk about even with his doctor (alcohol and drug use, perhaps?). If someone had memory loss and thought it was due to a concussion caused by a blow to the head, seeking medical attention to verify the injuries would have been the reasonable thing to do. As far as I know, CR and CS have chosen not to have charges filed against ZO, even though there is videotape and witnesses to the incident, so that CR's memory is not needed.

I do not know a single one of my male friends who went to the hospital after a drunken fight that did not leave them with a broken bone/critical injury.

Reasonable thing to do? yes. Likely? no.
 
CR's lawyers job is to deflect attention from CR and suggest other possible POIs. So the lawyer can come up with theories and not necessarily based on what CR tells him. The theory could be formed based on interviews with other people.
Regarding CR's head injury, it doesn't seem to be serious and I personally don't think that's what responsible for his supposed memory loss.
 
Check out the time Lauren was seen on cam here. The police seem to have made a correction. However, most papers failed to correct their timeline.
You were right and every clue we have is contradicted by other clues and accounts. http://whiteplains.dailyvoice.com/neighbors/polygraph-dna-tests-issued-lauren-spierer-case

Don't see many useful posts from you. This one got my attention. For certainly if there were now substantial time differences due to timestamps that would change support of some theories on what happened.

However, what you have linked is an article posted 1 week after Lauren disappeared from a news paper in NY. How could you consider this more current than the dozens of reports made locally and LE releases since? Just have to wonder if you do this sort of thing on purpose.
 
Don't see many useful posts from you. This one got my attention. For certainly if there were now substantial time differences due to timestamps that would change support of some theories on what happened.

However, what you have linked is an article posted 1 week after Lauren disappeared from a news paper in NY. How could you consider this more current than the dozens of reports made locally and LE releases since? Just have to wonder if you do this sort of thing on purpose.

Actually, that timeline fits in very well with the BO interview supplied by Lo-Hud.
Dude, perhaps you are the one who does not get it. Please watch again. Also, find Tony Gatto's mystery witness and I think you will find she is also BO's witness. The Mystery Man appears to be Corey, not AB.
Solving this case is like programming a computer, rubbish in rubbish out.
Now, I am looking for credible info. I seem to be finding a lot of trash.
 
I feel confident in saying that CR's attorney using the word "amnesia", regardless of whether that is a direct CR quote or not, is NOT the smoking gun in this case.
I don't remember anyone saying it was.

I just feel that as the former DA for Monroe Co. (including during the Behrman case) that Salzmann knows that he is tied to any testimony he gives in public. 'Amnesia' is a very specific word, and he made clear that CR doesn't remember anything because ZO punched him-- VERY different than saying he 'blacked out', which again, would imply drug/alcohol use.

I know a lawyer is supposed to paint a pretty picture for his client, but I just don't believe the 'amnesia' story.
 
Actually, that timeline fits in very well with the BO interview supplied by Lo-Hud.
Dude, perhaps you are the one who does not get it. Please watch again. Also, find Tony Gatto's mystery witness and I think you will find she is also BO's witness. The Mystery Man appears to be Corey, not AB.
Solving this case is like programming a computer, rubbish in rubbish out.
Now, I am looking for credible info. I seem to be finding a lot of trash.

I watched the video interview with Bo Dietl (the Lohud "one year later" one) and I did not hear him provide a timeline. Are you referring to a different interview?
 
I don't remember anyone saying it was.

I just feel that as the former DA for Monroe Co. (including during the Behrman case) that Salzmann knows that he is tied to any testimony he gives in public. 'Amnesia' is a very specific word, and he made clear that CR doesn't remember anything because ZO punched him-- VERY different than saying he 'blacked out', which again, would imply drug/alcohol use.

I know a lawyer is supposed to paint a pretty picture for his client, but I just don't believe the 'amnesia' story.

What's interesting is memory loss due to a head injury can sometimes be recovered whereas memory loss due to alcoholic blackout cannot. (Disclaimer: This is from an article I skimmed late one night.)
 
I came to this forum after being away for a couple days...I saw there were a lot of new posts and became hopeful. There must be a new clue, I thought, or maybe she was found?

Nope, just petty arguments -disappointing
 
I came to this forum after being away for a couple days...I saw there were a lot of new posts and became hopeful. There must be a new clue, I thought, or maybe she was found?

Nope, just petty arguments -disappointing
I consider it constructive dialogue.

There have been times when there would be no posts here for days.

I find it encouraging that people still care.
 
Actually, that timeline fits in very well with the BO interview supplied by Lo-Hud.
Dude, perhaps you are the one who does not get it. Please watch again. Also, find Tony Gatto's mystery witness and I think you will find she is also BO's witness. The Mystery Man appears to be Corey, not AB.
Solving this case is like programming a computer, rubbish in rubbish out.
Now, I am looking for credible info. I seem to be finding a lot of trash.

Those who have been around since the beginning seem to do a lot of sorting out of rubbish. How is this source of information from 1 week after she vanished, in a small newspaper in NY more credible than more recent reports made locally and actual statements made by LE? The 3:15 to 3:30 time frame would be very curious, but can you find something recent and credible to back it up? Here is what I have:

2:53 am (has been repeated as fact) - LS Slams down face first, without blocking with hands into gravel lot after just exiting the Alley. It's not clear at this point if she was walking on her own or somehow still hanging onto CR.

3:00am approx. her wallet with keys are found in the immediate area where she fell face down after exiting the alley. Person finding wallet places it on ledge. His Room mate sees it there later.

3:00am to 3:30am LS is reported on CR's back seen to be alive, and then supposedly winds up at CR/MB's

3:30 am (unverified) MB calls JR about LS.

3:38 am TG's Female Bartender eyewitness says she saw LS slumped over shoulder of someone north of 10th and N. College building on N. College.

4:15 am (Fact) 2 calls made from JR's

4:30 am supposedly LS leaves JR's


If your NY newspaper story were accurate, and going with your sense of leaning towards CR as Mystery man... it would set the video time forward by at least 22 minutes. The wallet find time was only an estimate, so it could still fit. This would mean LS would have spent almost no time at CR/MB's if she were even there. IF CR were Mystery man why would he stop back at his own place which stimulated the call to JR (assuming that call can be verified)? We can see why he would immediately leave and take a different route back to SW (perhaps hoping that ZO and mystery gang were now gone) Or planned on stopping at 10th and College for some other reason. From the 3:30 call JR knows perhaps that CR was taking LS back home, maybe advised that it should be done. Then makes calls at 4:15 to DR and ?? to see if CR and LS made it back to SW?
In this scenario, it would seem if CR were up to no good, or if LS died, it seems to me he would try to enter that 10th and College building which he is famous for breaking into. Since he has been known to sneak around and enter buildings where he doesn't live, he likely knows them very well, areas to hide things, doors that aren't locked, etc... He may have found a place or had access to a place to put LS. perhaps even a vehicle. I have asked several times what kind of cameras exist inside that building or parking garage. No one seems to know. I know there were cameras outside the front of the building, so had a feeling there were more. Perhaps horribly a dumpster in this building. That all would fit.

EXCEPT: It makes MB a liar, because then CR did not go to bed and was not put to bed, nor did LS go to JR's. It makes JR a liar, because LS would not have been there nearly an hour as so far has been indicated. There would have been no time for it. If anything, he may have cracked the door and said something like "CR, take her home!" That's about all there would be time for. At the most, perhaps time to go out the front of JR's exiting onto 11th exactly where JR says he saw LS alone turning the corner onto N. College. But now at about 3:35 and not 4:30. By 3:38 they could have been where witness saw them. How long would JR wait to find out if they made it? If he told CR to call when they made it to her place at SW, how long would he wait? I figure about 15 to 20 minutes... and then he would start to wonder what happened. After another 15 to 20 minutes he decides to call people. That fits. What doesn't fit is that MB would lie for CR and say she want to JR's. Unless MB was duped into thinking CR went there with her, and was duped into protecting CR by saying he put him to bed. In this event MB would be an unwitting accomplice rather than overt conspirator. What really doesn't make sense is that even after CR comes back at about 4:15 to JR's and explains that SHE's DEAD, why would JR lie and say she was there that whole time? She may have been hidden in 10th and N. College for some time or maybe went out via the trash dumpster at 10th and College. I get the impression LE were not checking every trash container in the area. Now CR just happens to forget all of this and doesn't realize he did any of it. MB was duped and used. But again JR is the key. the person conscious enough to give people sobriety tests, watch out from his balcony and can tell the difference between an ipod and a phone at 4:15. Again it seems the plausible explanation is that he felt responsible for what killed her - some degree of partying at his place earlier (most likely).
In this case, JR would also not necessarily known where she was... he may have braced for her being found and the ensuing autopsy and investigation. But instead she wasn't found and CR forgets everything so JR is left mostly holding the bag. And CR then would be the only person to know where she was... but since he has no memory of anything since before the punch, he has also no idea what he did with her.

Now after walking through all of this, could it all have happened this way, even if the 1 year old newspaper time were wrong? This all could have happened anyway, just that there would be 22+ extra minutes to go from Alley to CR/MB's to JR's and down N. College.

How it all fits with variants of personal profiles:

JR - not a sociopath, instead neurotic and guilt driven
MB - tool
CR - irresponsible rule breaking buffoon - ooops, you stopped breathing from that last fall... I don't remember what happened last night. (next day... "Have you seen a little blonde girl?" As if he misplaced her)

Unfortunately this almost 3 stooge-like Comedic Tragedy is a theory I think would be possible.

I don't mean to make light of LS disappearance. What I'm getting at here is that her end may have been due to a series of bad (ok stupid) judgements made for a variety of very human reasons. We've considered everything else, why not drunken idiocy?
 
We need to slow down a bit. In BO's version, Lauren does not return to 10th and College at 3:38. But instead, Lauren and Corey remain there until the mystery witness arrives on the scene. This would support a later time for Lauren being seen on camera as reported by the White Plains newspaper. And, it makes Corey into THE MYSTERY MAN.
 
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