GUILTY GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 26 June 2011 # 6

[~SuperSleuth~]

I'm sure this has already been discussed, but I wonder how long Buford is going to stick with the case. Now that the stakes have been raised with the murder charge, I would bet he'll be off the case when/if Winters announces they're going for the death penalty.

I'm not sure whether Buford is qualified to take death penalty cases, and even if he is, I doubt the McD's could fork over the massive fees retaining him on a DP case would require. I would guess he'll be passed over to the Capital Defender's Office.

If I was Buford, I wouldn't be able to get rid of the case fast enough. McD's mother is a liability, and would likely try to involve herself at all the wrong times between now and trial. Kind of sad though that I can see her going to all kinds of extremes to foot the bill for a paid lawyer- mortgaging the house,selling everything they own, etc.

From the previous thread...

I know this is early in the case to bring this up but is the death penalty an option for a felony murder conviction? Does anyone in Macon know if SM's attorney, Buford, is death qualified if it is an option for this crime. Also, does anyone think he would get involved in SM's defense on the murder charge?

I believe he is, but I don't think he would be handling this case by himself if he does it at all. He will probably have a team of lawyers from the capital defender's office assist or take over the case entirely. Sadly, this is the office Lauren was hoping to get a job offer from upon graduating from law school.

Having said that before my second cup of coffee this morning, it now occurs to me that depending on where Lauren was with her application/interview process with the capital defender's office, THEY may have to recuse themselves from representing McD if there is a substantial enough connection to create a conflict of interest. Even so, there are plenty of capital offense qualified attorneys out there who could be appointed by the court to represent him.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Originally Posted by Knox
*But in real life, it didn't work as well as his written theory did.

When you stop and think about it.. It never does( I.e. Real life situations NEVER EVER pan out/play out how we have played it out in our minds in theory).. And that's true IMO of all scenarios that we naturally ponder on, think about, pre plan, etc, etc.. Our common everyday thoughts of say an upcoming vacation that we're eagerly looking forward to, a dinner party we have plotted out And planned extensively ahead of time.. These type situations never ever turn out exactly as we planned them to.. Sometimes that's for the good(as in they go even better than what we expected) and sometimes unfortunately it's for the not so good(as in we get let down, and what we have built up in our minds for some time in advance to be something so wonderful, so perfect.. We are left disappointed with how in real life the situation actually played out)..

.. back to the case at hand and how this relates to SM and his possible premeditation.. IMO I think it's likely tho that this too is indicative of possibly a self assured arrogance might've come in to play.. Meaning that he is deeply convinced that he is smarter than the world basically and that how he planned it was exactly how it was gonna be.. IMO I believe it's possible(and please take note of the word possible, as in a possibility and therefor am not stating it as fact) that in his premeditation that he thought that his mind and intelligence was so far advanced beyond those that would be involved in/and around the entire case(and that includes even possibly taking into consideration a jury as well).. And his believing he had even thought ahead about differing scenarios of how in "real life" the situation may actually play out..

For example as some of us have previously discussed the possibility that he had a plan A as well as a plan B.. Plan A of course being *preferred with there being no body, no Lauren, no murder.. Simply one of the many thousands MISSING PERSONS we have every year.. Lauren being just another name and face on a flyer that in time fades not only from it's stapled position on a corner pole, or corkboard outside the local Wal Mart, but also eventually fading from EVERYONE's memory as well.. This plan A IMO was of course his preferred plan..

But I believe it possible that he did plan for this to possibly go awry hence having the back up plan B.. *Time will only tell whether this was a well thought out back up plan or whether it was a last minute(as in the plan did not even begin to be formulated til after midnight that Wednesday night heading into Thursday morning of the 30th when the torso was found.. More specifically the time between when the friends/LE left the apts after midnight and the time when the friends/LE returned several hours later that morning of the 30th) Time will tell us just how much effort and thought went into it before hand IMO..*

Plan B being what several of us have discussed as the possible frame job of MM.. I am not near as confident in the premeditation that went into it as I am about the premeditation of plan A(IMO that is very likely premeditated way in advance possibly even more than a year in advance).. I'm not so sure it was a frame job that SM planned as more like an attempt to misdirect the investigation in absolutely any direction that way pointing away from him..

And until more evidence and circumstances come to light we just won't know if there was actually a well thought out in advance premeditation of plan B.. Or .. As I am more inclined to believe(at this time) that the plan be was a last stitch effort to quickly and as efficiently as absolutely possible to misdirect the evidence and therefor the trail leading back to ANYONE but SM.. Therefor MM just being the unfortunate easiest and most convenient person to be used to point the evidence toward..

IDK.. Just will have to be patient and wait to know more..

 

[cluciano63]

I think LE only released the minimum amount of evidence to make the charges thus far...there will be much more and maybe even a plea at some point...JMO...

 

[AgentFrankLundy]

I do not know if MM will be our George Anthony, but I do believe Glenda McDaniel is the equivalent of Cindy Anthony, willing to lie to save her child. Very sad.

 

[JeannieC]

And my 8-year-old said, ‘Satan is trying to steal Stephen.’ I said, ‘Yes, dear, he’s trying to steal Stephen. He’s trying to steal our testimony. He’s trying to steal our faith in God. He’s trying to steal our peace, and we’re not going to listen to Satan.’ And the 10-year-old said, ‘Well, Satan is powerful.’ I said, ‘Yes, Satan and his demons are powerful. And one day they will be chained forever.’”

Read more: http://www.macon.com/2011/08/07/1657322_p2/man-on-the-street-how-fledgling.html#ixzz1UNDT9ALp

wow-this gives me the heebie jeebies...
I bet if they could ever convince mom that he did it-her next response would be it was the victims fault.

The thing I have the biggest problem with is them discussing it in front of the children, telling them so much. Of course they might hear things but you can turn a tv channel, not watch the news with them around. Tell them only what they need to know. Their uncle is in jail.

 

[Sandstorm]

[/B]

Yes, you are correct, the grand jury will still be convened for the purpose of issuing an indictment and yes, they will be given much more evidence than what the public is aware of. Grand Jury proceedings are secret, so what goes on in there will not be made public. As for whether charges would be dismissed if the Grand Jury does not indict, yes, theoretically that could happen but it absolutely WON'T happen in this case - not a snowball's chance in hell. First of all, McD's attorney won't be there and there will be no defense put up whatsoever to the testimony that is given to the Grand Jury. Believe me, there is a lot more forensic evidence than the public is aware of yet. They will reveal some of it to the Grand Jury, maybe not all. In any event, he WILL be indicted for Lauren's murder and probably the 2 burglaries as well.

Thank you Colonel Mustard for the legal details.
After reading your post, first thing that came to my mind was:
What's Mama going to say after this GJ hearing and he gets indicted?!!

Questions:
So no defense present at the GJ hearing - only the prosecution speaks to the GJ presenting just enough evidence to convince GJ to indict?
Also, McD will be there?
Only the prosecution is allowed to speak?
thanks.

 

[Sandstorm]

If SM is so smart, why was Lauren's body (torso) found at all? He could have just "disappeared" her, as so many killers seem to do. I think he thinks he is smart, but don't they all...

LE finding the torso was definitely NOT in the plan! This was the BIG mistake.

 

[Darcyline]

If this was some plan to get away with murder I don't get why he didn't work a little faster. It seems like a long time passed between when she died and when friends showed up-several days. If I was going to murder someone I would figure that people would start looking for that person in a day or two. Not be caught unprepared when people come 5 days later or something.
Maybe it was not entirely premeditated? Maybe he did have a plan to be finished earlier and somehow things just took longer than he expected? Maybe he couldn't force himself to get rid of the torso for whatever reason **shudders**

 

[ThinMan]

Questions:
So no defense present at the GJ hearing - only the prosecution speaks to the GJ presenting just enough evidence to convince GJ to indict?
Also, McD will be there?
Only the prosecution is allowed to speak?
thanks.

Only the DA appears before the Grand Jury, and, sometimes, key witnesses for the prosecution if necessary (probably not in this case, if we are right in expecting forensic reports to be sufficient to establish probable cause).

SMD will NOT be there; neither will his lawyer.

The Grand Jury proceedings are secret (although sometimes there are leaks).

 

[Givsmetheshivers]

About June 24, Friday nite:
Lauren was out with friends- my family member who was Lauren's friend and running buddy was out with her and friends Friday nite at the bar.
I think the camping trip was for the upcoming July 4 holidays.


About the LS dumpster:
From what I read in one of the articles, Golba and crew decided that it was logical that McD used the LS dumpsters. The search team discussed the other possibilities and concluded it was most convenient, less noticable and easier for McD to walk across the street for disposal of parts. The LS dumpster trash does not go to Bibbs County but to Twiggs landfill. Twiggs landfill was not searched as extensively.

No, you can see it in the video. Golba's dog, Rhino, actually starts freaking out barking around the Mercer dumptser.

Yes, so she was supposed to go camping with those guys.

 

[Givsmetheshivers]

http://www.macon.com/2011/08/07/1656330/mama-loves-ya.html

I agree with you engineer and after reading Mama Loves Ya I could not resist posting my reaction. This article unleashed a plethora of IN MY OPINIONS for the BIG PICTURE of Stephen McDaniel.
So here goes....
I have raised a child and and know that it is paramount to a child's well being and development to teach accountability to the truth.
Unfortunately, sometimes a Mama's love goes too far.
Ms. McDaniel's love has enabled her child to become UNACCOUNTABLE. She does not allow herself to believe that it is possible her son committed this crime, even when the evidence points directly at him. She prefers to take his word, without question.
My guess is this has been her mode of parenting for the past 25 years.

And so Stephen grew up believing that he could do whatever he wanted without consequence which alienated him from his peers. Stephen's unorthodox egocentric behavior resulted in a "socially awkward" stigma. According to his peers, Stephen developed some unusual behaviors which included his own Elvin language and scratching others with his long fingernails. Read more of what his peers from Parkview High School and Mountain Park First Baptist Church had to say about him on the link below.

During Stephen’s childhood, Ms. McDaniel turned a blind eye to these 'socially awkward' attributes her son was developing. After all, they were a good Christian family and Stephen went to church regularly with his family. Did you notice how Ms. McDaniel uses Christianity as the reason her son could not possibly commit this crime of murder and dismemberment:
"We believe that he is innocent, because we do not believe that a Christian could murder and cut somebody's body up."
In light of all that has happened, I wonder how Christianity was portrayed to Stephen as well as how he actually perceived it when he was growing up. I have read that he was raised in an “ultra-conservative” home which may have facilitated his ulterior person. But then again, Stephen did have a PRAY bumper sticker on his car….

I am convinced that Stephen has always had ‘backup’ i.e., ‘cover up’ with his Mama's Love. Just look at her reaction to the evidence: For every single piece of evidence that points to Stephen, Ms. McDaniel has a backup reason which defends her son- he is NOT accountable - she will not allow it. We see it in her attempt to back him up by claiming Stephen was framed by the Maintenance Man: 'Glenda McDaniel said her son told her that “he had heard a loud noise, got up, got dressed, went out and saw (another apartment resident) standing on Lauren’s balcony” at midnight...McDaniel’s mother said she’s sure he kicked himself after he realized the man could have been up to no good."'
The Macon Police have cleared the ‘maintenance man’:
‘Police had asked Dorer, a Mercer law student, to drop by their headquarters to answer questions, and he was being “completely cooperative,” said Brett Steger, Dorer’s attorney. Dorer is not a suspect or a person of interest in Giddings’ slaying, and the questioning was brief, Steger said.’
We see it when she admits he DID buy the hacksaw, BUT Stephen threw the hacksaw in the trash. The real killer (maintenance man) took it from the trash… and on and on and on it goes.
Don't get me wrong. I my heart aches for this family, and they are in my prayers. But I can also plainly see Mama’s love… covering up a multitude of lies.

The ‘Mama's Love’ we are witnessing: ‘MY SON WAS FRAMED FOR THE LAUREN GIDDINGS MURDER’ is precisely why Stephen thought he had the right to have Lauren's apt key as well as a master key to all the apartments and the right to go snooping though other people's apartments for the past few years stealing as we went. Most importantly, this is why he thought he could plan and execute a murder and hide the body undetected. Can you imagine if Lauren had been declared a missing person? Stephen would have perceived himself even more highly ingenious if he had fooled us all, to literally have gotten away with murder. His plan would have been successful. And who knows, if it worked once, he could make it work even better the next time.

This is an extremely sad situation that a 25 year old law school graduate’s mind has sunk to evil such as this. Yet, I think we are seeing only the tip of the iceberg. The more I learn about this case, the deeper and darker the mind of Stephen McDaniel becomes. The master key, Lauren’s key, the snooping, the stealing are only what we KNOW he has done so far, and of course, the murder and dismemberment...I suspect there are a whole lot more covert activities that he has gotten away with if the truth be known. Believe me, this behavior did not start yesterday. In my opinion, these surreptitious, covert, illegal activities have been developing and advancing for years. With success and over time, Stephen’s confidence grew and finally culminated in this final, heinous act which cost Lauren her life. Warrant excerpt: “he commented that he could commit murder and provided details of methods to avoid detection which are similar to the facts and circumstances surrounding the killing of Lauren Giddings..."

It is true, there is no love like a Mama’s love, but when Mama's love does not include ACCOUNTABILITY to the TRUTH, the result is detrimental to her child's development and well being. In my opinion, this is why Lauren Giddings is no longer with us and why Stephen McDaniel is where he is today.
In this case, it is my opinion, ‘Mama's love’ is one of the main reasons why the chickens have come home to roost.

Final comment: More than anyone, it is Stephen’s Mom and Dad who are the most difficult for him to admit that he committed this crime. The only hope that he will ever confess is if his parents go to him and plead for him to tell the truth for Lauren’s family’s sake AND assure him that Mama loves ya no matter what.


http://www.macon.com/2011/08/06/1656586/mcdaniels-mother-offers-explanation.html

http://www.macon.com/2011/08/06/1656586/mcdaniels-mother-offers-explanation.html


Peer perceptions:
http://lilburn.patch.com/articles/murder-charge-draws-local-reaction

IN CASE YOU MISSED THIS VIDEO BACKSTREAM
Why Do Killers Speak out: Here are examples of 3 people who were NOT held accountable to the truth. IMO

‪Why do killers speak out‬‏ - YouTube

....and on top of it all, if something really terrible does happen, it is not Stephen's fault...it is Satan's fault. Too bad Santan can't be charged with murder.

 

[ThinMan]

No, you can see it in the video. Golba's dog, Rhino, actually starts freaking out barking around the Mercer dumptser.

Not only that, but look at the video and you will see that the green Mercer Law School dumpster is surrounded by a tall wooden fence with big swing-out gates to allow the truck to access the dumpster, but to screen off the view of the dumpster.

This makes it very attractive as a site for SMD to dump body parts. He can sneak inside the gate; then re-close it and have privacy in which to take the goods out of whatever he's carrying them in (backpack?); then even get into the dumpster to place them within other trash or otherwise make sure they're hard to notice. Not many dumpsters around businesses afford total privacy for someone dumping stuff secretly!

 

[currcat]

No, you can see it in the video. Golba's dog, Rhino, actually starts freaking out barking around the Mercer dumptser.

Respectfully snipped for focus-


Where is the link to this video- I thought I had seen all the video available on this case, but I have not seen any of the dogs "hitting" or "alerting" on anything. Would like to see it if you can direct me.

 

[Givsmetheshivers]

I hate to even say this, but...he may have kept it to do things with it. Jmo.

I hate to agree...but...
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb4345/is_12_32/ai_n29146842/

 

[Givsmetheshivers]

From the link to the story in The Washington Post that someone posted yesterday evening, the story about Lauren's family's ordeal, the section titled "Last Days and Hours", near the end of the story: Didn't we learn some details that had not yet been made public? (Some were definitely unfamiliar to me.)

link: http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...to-heartache/2011/08/05/gIQAj47IzI_story.html

Quote:
"On Friday night, June 24, Lauren went out with friends. Two of her classmates, both acoustic guitarists, were performing in bars downtown. She and her pals hit the Rookery first, listened for a while, then crossed the street to Bottoms Up.The evening was a welcome breather after weeks of intensive study. Georgia’s bar exam was scheduled for late July, and Lauren was determined to pass. It surprised no one who knew her well that she wanted to become a public defender, to devote her career to the poorest of the accused.
As she occasionally would do after a night on the town, she slept at a friend’s place Friday. Her boyfriend, <name snipped>, who was in California that weekend, has privileges at a Macon country club, and on Saturday, Lauren used his name to get in. She wanted to swim and relax by the pool.
About 6:30 p.m., as she was headed back to Barristers Hall, alone in her 2004 Mitsubishi Galant, she stopped for fast food at a drive-up window monitored by an overhead camera. The wrappers and receipt would later be found in her car, so maybe she ate before she got home."


I had never heard, I don't think, that the Zaxby's wrappers and receipt were found in her car...? Always had the impression they were found in her apartment.


This answers more definitively a question I had raised earlier, about why the police released the Zaxby's info (when everything else was being held so tightly). I had hypothesized that perhaps it was to see if anyone reported seeing her after the Zaxby's trip. Now, since it seems she ate in her car, it seems even more possible that she may have gone somewhere else before returning to the apartment. The Zaxby's that has been mentioned as the one she went to is only a very short distance away -- unless she was really hungry (certainly possible), seems like she would have waited to eat at the apartment if she was headed directly there.

I was confused about this as well. I swear I read that the Zaxby's was in her apartment, but I guess that was wrong?
Zaxby's is like two blocks from her apartment. I have pigged out in the car, and I would have a time packing anything in from Zaxby's in two blocks...you have to have the sauce...that would be messy.

 

[Colonel Mustard]

Originally posted by Thinman:
MPD knows who told them about the "get away with murder" comments and MPD & the DA believe those witnesses to be credible. Identity of those witnesses does not have to be disclosed for an arrest warrant (which is not an adversary proceeding -- just the cops and DA go before the judge for the warrant; the defense is not present).

It will be interesting to see -- at the commitment hearing (which IS adversarial) whether the defense objects to this reason being offered to hold SMD in jail.

All this leads me to speculate that the DA took that into account in his decision to initially charge SMD with FELONY MURDER rather than malice murder.

The final decision on the charge need not be made until the Grand Jury issues an indictment. At that point the DA will have to decide whether he thinks he can prove that it was planned. He can, I think, charge both maiice murder and felony murder in the alternative, then allow the trial jury to decide which has been proved.



Yes, and because hearsay testimony is allowed in a preliminary hearing (committment hearing) a detective can testify as to what was told to him by the witnesses without having to bring in the actual witnesses who heard McD make this statement. I wonder though, if the statement is actually something they found on his computer.

 

[Knox]

No, you can see it in the video. Golba's dog, Rhino, actually starts freaking out barking around the Mercer dumptser.

Yes, so she was supposed to go camping with those guys.

Can you link to the video where Rhino alerts on the dumpster?

 

[pearl]

Colonel Mustard,
You said in an earlier post that if his current lawyer does not stay on for the murder charge, he could use the captial defender's office (?) if there wasn't a conflict with Lauren applying to work there. If there is a conflict, the court would appoint another lawyer to represent SM. Could a lawyer refuse to defend him?

 

[Reannan]

Whew.... this case just keeps defying anything that makes sense outside of a gothic novel! If SM was "framed", who would have been 'smart' enough to have dumped the dismembered torso at the apartment dumpster where he lived with the expectation that HE would be fingered?

 

[~SuperSleuth~]

Respectfully snipped for focus-


Where is the link to this video- I thought I had seen all the video available on this case, but I have not seen any of the dogs "hitting" or "alerting" on anything. Would like to see it if you can direct me.

Lauren Giddings' Family Continues to Search for Remains
http://www.13wmaz.com/video/1092819186001/0/Lauren-Giddings-Family-Continues-to-Search-for-Remains