Lisa and the river

[norest4thewicked]

If my memory serves me correctly, the story about SB and her daughter having "seen" Lisa on Monday was a story that the DT had leaked so that there would be a witness to Lisa after Sunday night. We have never heard this anywhere else. But, even if SB said she "saw" Lisa that afternoon, it could have easily been while Lisa was supposedly sleeping and SB just saw blankets in her bed. The 4 year old is completely unreliable regarding time, etc. She would have a hard time telling one day from another. And, regarding the boys, as iamnotagolem said, many variables plus the fact that they were in school part of the day. Very easy for them not to see Lisa for one day. This is one of the reasons that I strongly believe that Lisa died a day earlier and the entire day on Monday was a set up for the big kidnapping story. This makes sense to me.

 

[RANCH]

I don't see grade as being all that important when a person has a dead child in their hands and is trying to dispose of said child in the quickest way. As a matter of fact, I think that shock and panic might take over and a lot of variables (such as grade) would be thrown out in these circumstances.

I was asking about the grade to the river to try and understand if a person of less than average physical conditioning would be able to walk the route easily.

Obviously going down hill is easier than going uphill. If the grade is severe, it would be a difficult walk back to the house. If it's a moderate grade, it would still be difficult and perhaps time consuming to a person with less than optimum physical conditioning.

That's why I'm asking about the grade to the river from DB/JI's house.

 

[KsStormy]

She seemed to have no trouble walking in the wine run video...

 

[4Jacy]

She seemed to have no trouble walking in the wine run video...

stop it! you have me LMAO :floorlaugh: That was a really good one!!

 

[KsStormy]

Hee hee ...well ,it's true. Being overweight isn't a likely alibi for not being able to walk to the river. I personally think she drove, as she has been reported to be an old pro at sneaking out at night, according to her Mother-in-law, Hazel Bradley :

Debbie talked of getting her G.E.D. and insisted that her youngest brother, Phillip, graduate. But she didn't go back to school. Instead, she started leaving the house at night, taking Hazel's truck without asking when the family slept.

"I never knew for sure where she went or what she did," Hazel said. They had words. Debbie was again asked to leave.

"It's just immature things," she says. "I kept thinking she would settle down."

http://www.standard.net/stories/2011/11/09/mother-hen-media-villain-life-missing-babys-mom

 

[norest4thewicked]

I was asking about the grade to the river to try and understand if a person of less than average physical conditioning would be able to walk the route easily.

Obviously going down hill is easier than going uphill. If the grade is severe, it would be a difficult walk back to the house. If it's a moderate grade, it would still be difficult and perhaps time consuming to a person with less than optimum physical conditioning.

That's why I'm asking about the grade to the river from DB/JI's house.

How is she less than physically fit? She's a slightly overweight woman in her 20's! I just don't get when people state things that makes it sound like she is in a wheel chair or something. She's a young woman. Sure, she smokes and has some extra weight on her, but that in no way would impede her from covering her a$$ if she were in a panic to get rid of a tiny body that she is used to carrying around anyway. I just don't get this line of thinking.

 

[norest4thewicked]

She seemed to have no trouble walking in the wine run video...

True! And, we have seen her on videos and she seemed to have no trouble walking. I just don't get it!:banghead:

 

[redheadedgal]

How is she less than physically fit? She's a slightly overweight woman in her 20's! I just don't get when people state things that makes it sound like she is in a wheel chair or something. She's a young woman. Sure, she smokes and has some extra weight on her, but that in no way would impede her from covering her a$$ if she were in a panic to get rid of a tiny body that she is used to carrying around anyway. I just don't get this line of thinking.

True! And, we have seen her on videos and she seemed to have no trouble walking. I just don't get it!:banghead:

exactly! and as more proof: ever watch "the biggest loser"? contestants are much larger than DB and they are able to do those intense workouts and challenges day after day...

 

[RANCH]

How is she less than physically fit? She's a slightly overweight woman in her 20's! I just don't get when people state things that makes it sound like she is in a wheel chair or something. She's a young woman. Sure, she smokes and has some extra weight on her, but that in no way would impede her from covering her a$$ if she were in a panic to get rid of a tiny body that she is used to carrying around anyway. I just don't get this line of thinking.

BBM
My post mentions a person who is in less than optimum psychical condition. An overweight smoker fits that description to me. I didn't say anything about wheelchairs or the person having any psychical disabilities.

 

[norest4thewicked]

BBM
My post mentions a person who is in less than optimum psychical condition. An overweight smoker fits that description to me. I didn't say anything about wheelchairs or the person having any psychical disabilities.

And...I didn't say that you did say that. I said "people". You are definitely not the first poster who has questioned whether DB could make it to the river or not.

 

[norest4thewicked]

exactly! and as more proof: ever watch "the biggest loser"? contestants are much larger than DB and they are able to do those intense workouts and challenges day after day...

Wonderful point, red! After all, DB is a YOUNG woman and only slightly overweight. She certainly isn't what one would call morbidly obese. She's not an elderly person. If she had a dead baby to dispose of, I can't think of anything physically that would stop her from doing it if she had to for her own sake.

 

[redheadedgal]

Wonderful point, red! After all, DB is a YOUNG woman and only slightly overweight. She certainly isn't what one would call morbidly obese. She's not an elderly person. If she had a dead baby to dispose of, I can't think of anything physically that would stop her from doing it if she had to for her own sake.

precisely. plus, as we've discussed before, adrenalin can allow one to accomplish feats one never knew one could do...

 

[RANCH]

And...I didn't say that you did say that. I said "people". You are definitely not the first poster who has questioned whether DB could make it to the river or not.

I was making it clear that I don't believe my post suggested that DB is somehow disabled. I don't really doubt that DB could make it to the river and back. My questions are in regards to how difficult it would be for her.

 

[4Jacy]

I'm thinking PN made it to the river with a dead Baby Lisa in a duffle bag. They are very close those two, and I think one would do anything for the other.

I wonder if they have nightmares.

 

[Meri]

I think she could have made it to the river, but as far as her being "slightly overweight," I would say she, at that time, was obese. She seems to have lost a bit of weight now, but she is still not what I would call slightly overweight.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Yeah, she is more than slightly overweight:

 

[norest4thewicked]

Whether she is slightly overweight, or morbidly obese, in how we see her...it's still pretty clear that she would have been able to make it to the river and back. She isn't disabled or hampered in any way with her movement. I don't think that part is much of an issue at all.

 

[RANCH]

It appears to me that it's possible for DB to have walked to the river and back to her house.

My question's are, how likely would it have been for her to carry Lisa to the river and then walk back home undetected?

Would neighbors dogs barking alert someone to possibly look outside and she her?

Would it have to be dark enough to conceal her on her walk, but light enough to see where she's going?

Is there a route to the river that would conceal her from neighbors view, but be easy for her to walk without falling down and suffering an injury?

Or finally, could there be a witness who did see DB walking towards or from the river that night and we just don't know about it yet?

 

[norest4thewicked]

It appears to me that it's possible for DB to have walked to the river and back to her house.

My question's are, how likely would it have been for her to carry Lisa to the river and then walk back home undetected?

Would neighbors dogs barking alert someone to possibly look outside and she her?

Would it have to be dark enough to conceal her on her walk, but light enough to see where she's going?

Is there a route to the river that would conceal her from neighbors view, but be easy for her to walk without falling down and suffering an injury?

Or finally, could there be a witness who did see DB walking towards or from the river that night and we just don't know about it yet?

Answers to your questions from my point of view.

Not a lot of people outside at midnight or 1:00 am on a weeknight/morning. If she was in a panic and had no other choice, she would have just taken her chances.

In a residential area, dogs bark all the time. I don't think most people would get out of bed to go and look unless a persons own dog was barking and continued to bark. Once she'd passed a residence, the dog in the residence would stop or slow down barking and then next dog would start. I don't think any of this would have been odd enough to make someone want to get out of their cozy bed to go look.

There are street lights and the river itself would reflect the moon as well as be an obvious sound to follow. I don't see this as a deterrent for someone who needs to get somewhere.

I don't know about the route from her house to the river, but those in the area who do say that it is not a difficult walk.

Anything is possible regarding witnesses. We (the public) has certainly not been kept informed on the details of this case, so who knows?

Lastly, although I find it totally plausible that DB could have gone to the river herself, I still can't remove JI or PN as possible accomplices. Either of them could have disposed of Lisa just as easily (if not more) than DB herself.

 

[KsStormy]

Answers to your questions from my point of view.

Not a lot of people outside at midnight or 1:00 am on a weeknight/morning. If she was in a panic and had no other choice, she would have just taken her chances.

In a residential area, dogs bark all the time. I don't think most people would get out of bed to go and look unless a persons own dog was barking and continued to bark. Once she'd passed a residence, the dog in the residence would stop or slow down barking and then next dog would start. I don't think any of this would have been odd enough to make someone want to get out of their cozy bed to go look.

There are street lights and the river itself would reflect the moon as well as be an obvious sound to follow. I don't see this as a deterrent for someone who needs to get somewhere.

I don't know about the route from her house to the river, but those in the area who do say that it is not a difficult walk.

Anything is possible regarding witnesses. We (the public) has certainly not been kept informed on the details of this case, so who knows?

Lastly, although I find it totally plausible that DB could have gone to the river herself, I still can't remove JI or PN as possible accomplices. Either of them could have disposed of Lisa just as easily (if not more) than DB herself.

BBM
Earlier in this thread a member posted a video of the quickest route to the river, which is less than a 2 minute drive, by my watch when I drove it myself. I don't think she walked, I think she drove the white Lincoln, or had a helper.
:moo: