Jodi Arias Trial discussion, #3

[Linda7NJ]

In my experience and from what I have researched, people with personality disorders like narcissistic, borderline or anti-social personality disorder, often use sex as a means of control or manipulation - not because they actually need sex but because they have learned they can get things with it. (And yes, some of that starts with extreme sexual abuse).

The being quiet in a crowd just shows me that, as a psychopath, she does not know who to emulate, who to be, when she's in a group, which is her means of controlling everyone's reactions to her, in a one-on-one situation. So, she goes silent so she won't accidentally reveal herself and allow people to see the real, evil her. That's because psychopaths realize they aren't like others and in order to convince other people that they are normal, or to gain those people's confidence, they mimic the behavior and emotions of the people they are interacting with. That's hard to do in a group, since everyone is different. (Although lots of psychopaths would simply copy the most popular person in the crowd).



The one thing about the DP, though (which I am not a proponent of, actually), is that the accommodations for death penalty prisoners are usually much worse than for lifers. Psychopaths have little problems adapting to regular prison. But death penalty wings are more punitive.

Adapting ... like Prison American Idol? Lol most popular girl on the cell block after winning her cellies that turkey dinner!

 

[Karmady]

I'm surprised she didn't try to lure him with pregnancy...

seems like they didn't have that kind of sex...at least unprotected. What really surprises me is that he allowed pics to be taken. He obviously wasn't afraid of being "outed" by her. That's weird under the circumstances, imo.

 

[Sulamith]

I'd like to hear about the other realm, the one in between being with god and the crappy outer circle.

I know you did not address this to me, but since this thread is moving so fast, thought I would chime in.

From Mormonwiki: http://www.mormonwiki.com/Celestial,_Terrestrial,_and_Telestial_Kingdoms

 

[Karmady]

I have the impression from her photos, and knowing that she is Hispanic, that she is a natural born brunette, and had dyed it blonde in her relationship with Travis. I realize that's not the exact question you asked, but it's been bugging me. I think she's back to her natural color now.

fwiw, she doesn't look at all hispanic in person. She looks at least part asian and her hair, complexion and body type are consistent with that.

 

[popsicle]

seems like they didn't have that kind of sex...at least unprotected. What really surprises me is that he allowed pics to be taken. He obviously wasn't afraid of being "outed" by her. That's weird under the circumstances, imo.

Unfortunately he didn't have a hinky meter

 

[Linda7NJ]

I know you did not address this to me, but since this thread is moving so fast, thought I would chime in.

From Mormonwiki: http://www.mormonwiki.com/Celestial,_Terrestrial,_and_Telestial_Kingdoms

Thank you!

Well it sounds as if Travis would be in the terrestrial one....doesn't sound too shabby!!!

 

[LotusPawprint]

Whew... Got through all 47 pages. Now I can comment - sorry if some of this stuff is 'old' now. You guys move fast!



As a psychologist, I'll try to clarify as best I can. A main difference between narcissists and psychopaths is that the former can have meaningful relationships and empathy, while the latter is incapable. Sure, they may be in a relationship but it is not meaningful. They may fool the other person (they are good at that) but there really is no emotional attachment from their side. Nada. Not necessarily true for narcissists.

Yay! Thank you! :seeya:

 

[bobloblaw]

I know you did not address this to me, but since this thread is moving so fast, thought I would chime in.

From Mormonwiki: http://www.mormonwiki.com/Celestial,_Terrestrial,_and_Telestial_Kingdoms

I don't know why there is a religious aspect to this trial. Its still cold blooded murder whether the victim is Buddhist, Mormon or Catholic...

No one was exceding societal norms sexually or otherwise...

 

[PrincessSezMe]

Sounds like you've found background information about JA. I've sure wanted to understand her childhood. Is there a link to an article about her running away from home young?

I suspect that Jodi was sexually abused by someone as a child. Something happened to this girl. I heard someone on InSession say she dropped out of high school in the 11th grade. Her being extremely quiet in a crowd is not only creepy, it shows some kind of dysfunction. And her being so sexual -- needing a "dildo with a heartbeat," as Travis wrote -- screams that she has some sexual issue.

Last but not least, the new guy, Ryan, said she was sexually aggressive with him. That is toooooo odd!! Don't most women try to act soft and feminine when they're first with a guy?

For Jodi to have been in Ryan's presence for only a couple of hours and then be "manhandling" him sexually sends up a HUGE red flag. Somebody screwed with her as a child and completely screwed this girl up...

I have to wonder if she went psycho on Travis with that knife, as part of a blackout / flashback, as if finally getting even with a man who may have molested her or whatever.

I see too many parallels between how this woman acts and how Casey Anthony acts. Wasn't the abuse angle done to death with that one? Not proven, no evidence of same, and I don't really buy into it this time either. They are psychopathic, sexual predators themselves. Their thing seems to be to blame everyone else for their lack of a conscience or soul. Anything to get their butt out of the fire, even if it means trashing the reputation of another in order to do that.

Like others on here have said, it's sad that they resort to that because true victims of abuse have more of an uphill battle to be believed because of it. JMHO.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I see too many parallels between how this woman acts and how Casey Anthony acts. Wasn't the abuse angle done to death with that one? Not proven, no evidence of same, and I don't really buy into it this time either. They are psychopathic, sexual predators themselves. Their thing seems to be to blame everyone else for their lack of a conscience or soul. Anything to get their butt out of the fire, even if it means trashing the reputation of another in order to do that.

Like others on here have said, it's sad that they resort to that because true victims of abuse have more of an uphill battle to be believed because of it. JMHO.

Casey also hopped in the sack with a guy the very day she claimed her daughter drowned!

Cough cough...and we all know she didn't accidentally drown, right?

 

[Curious Me]

She totaled his car! The BMW...and he handled it great! Only asked her to pay $100 a month!

But he was going to KILL her over a camera?

It's laughable!

Must bump this post! :bump:

 

[Linda7NJ]

Whew... Got through all 47 pages. Now I can comment - sorry if some of this stuff is 'old' now. You guys move fast!



As a psychologist, I'll try to clarify as best I can. A main difference between narcissists and psychopaths is that the former can have meaningful relationships and empathy, while the latter is incapable. Sure, they may be in a relationship but it is not meaningful. They may fool the other person (they are good at that) but there really is no emotional attachment from their side. Nada. Not necessarily true for narcissists.

I so appreciate this... as a psychologist, can you please explain the major differences between psychopaths and borderlines TIA.

 

[PrincessSezMe]

fwiw, she doesn't look at all hispanic in person. She looks at least part asian and her hair, complexion and body type are consistent with that.

I thought the same thing, and it's her eyes. They look asian, not hispanic. Thank you for all of this great inside info! :rocker:

 

[Karmady]

My aunt married a Mormon and I have many many cousins who are Mormon. They ones my age were mostly your typical Mormon, i.e., fairly straightlaced. But one cousin - not so sure. I think he and his now-wife (also a Mormon) may have had premarital sex. I know that one of their children (also a Mormon) got his girlfriend pregnant. And I'm sure it wasn't by 'divine intervention'.

I am in no way saying it doesn't happen. What I'm saying is that, if it's acknowledged, it's a big deal. I have many close friends who are LDS and several of them have adopted children from "illicit" relationships between young LDS couples. The adoptions are done privately within the Church. It's a big deal according to doctrine is, I guess, what I'm trying to say. My LDS friends do not have the attitude that it's just a mistake that's to be expected between curious teens/normal young adults. It is NOT expected and NOT outwardly tolerated.

 

[Karmady]

Unfortunately he didn't have a hinky meter

Just sayin'...for a kid raised the way he was NOT to have had a hinky meter is beyond comprehension. I can't see even a "typical" LDS guy getting himself involved with someone like Jodi and engaging in behavior against the core tenets of his faith (and it's not like bein' a Presbyterian! lol) and allowing pics to be taken of it. Really. I can't. And Travis was no babe in the woods life lesson wise. I can't imagine what he was thinking and wouldn't be at all surprised if, in the end, she didn't threaten to send those pics to mimi.

 

[MsCharlieChan]

Many people have been in your position. (I also have had horrible heartbreak though it's never made me want to hurt someone). But the facts thus far in this case do not show evidence that jodi arias was a heartbroken mess of a woman who drove, sobbing to her ex boyfriend's house where she, what, are you saying that when she got their she flew into a passionate, desperate rage and suddenly killed him because her grief (and possible other issues) drove her to murder?

First, there is evidence that arias faked the theft of her grandparent's gun, one week before the murder, the same caliber gun that was used to shoot Travis.

Two, there is evidence that she drove 90 miles to rent a car, which she then flipped the license plates on, instead of using her own car, to drive hundreds of miles to see Travis. This show premeditation and that is not the conduct of a sobbing, out of control with heartbreak person.

Third, there is evidence that jodi, after savagely murdering Travis, went to another guys' house the next day and calmly dry humped him. After dying her hair. Don't you think that a person who was not simply evil, but instead was driven to murder due to unbearable heartbreak, would be incapable of calmly dry humping some guy the very next day?

And what about her bizarrely emotionless and cold interviews with detectives in the days just following the vicious murder. Does that evidence a person so sodden with heartache that they lost their mind and snapped or does it evidence an evil, methodical person who is glad they did what they did and doesn't believe they will ever get caught?

1. The tears may stop, but the anger and desire for revenge can continue for years. MANY years... I didn't intend for anyone's takeaway from my story be that THE SECOND your heart is broken is the ONLY moment you want to go -- sobbing -- and hurt the guy. In fact, if you're smart, you'll let as much time go by as possible.

2. Of course, she tried to plot and hide what she'd done. That's what 99% of criminals do: they try NOT to get caught. Most don't do the crime and then show up at the police station 5 minutes later saying, "Let me tell you what I just did! Arrest me now!!" Of course she dyed her hair, rented car elsewhere, calmly and repeatedly lied, etc. Honestly, something was wrong with her to leave the dang camera in the washing machine. Who does that?! Still, she tried to do all the stuff that most criminals do.

3. Bizarre and emotionless? Yep. That's why I suspect she may have been sexually molested as a child. This destroys peoples' souls in many cases. Not everyone can survive it like Oprah and become a multimillionaire. Many carry the scar well into adulthood, take on an unusual sexual personae, and remain angry at the person who did it to them. In other words, they're sick for life, try to hide it as they may. So yes, molestation might play a part in making a girl capable of becoming a "bizarre and emotionless" sex-murderer.

 

[Sulamith]

I don't know why there is a religious aspect to this trial. Its still cold blooded murder whether the victim is Buddhist, Mormon or Catholic...

No one was exceding societal norms sexually or otherwise...

Did you get a chance to watch/listen on day 1 of the trial?

Prosecutor Martinez and the Defense attorney were asking Mimi Hall all sorts of questions about the Mormon Singles group. Where they met, activities. Then she was asked about sins and the repentence process in the Mormon church. I thought it was really weird. Had no idea why he was asking all those mundane (IMO) questions on and on. He also asked her about the dates she had with TA, of course it made sense why he would ask her those questions.

Here is the link in case anybody wants to listen..no video.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ip7EN8uoD-Q"]Jodi Arias Trial Day 1 (Audio Only) - YouTube[/ame]

I have no idea why the video popped up here. I cut and pasted the link.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Just sayin'...for a kid raised the way he was NOT to have had a hinky meter is beyond comprehension. I can't see even a "typical" LDS guy getting himself involved with someone like Jodi and engaging in behavior against the core tenets of his faith (and it's not like bein' a Presbyterian! lol) and allowing pics to be taken of it. Really. I can't. And Travis was no babe in the woods life lesson wise. I can't imagine what he was thinking and wouldn't be at all surprised if, in the end, she didn't threaten to send those pics to mimi.

She said...take it for what's its worth. That they often took naked pictures, and deleted them when they were done viewing them. IMO that would lull him into trusting her with regards to taking pictures. He didn't count on being the one deleted.

 

[nells]

48 Hours Question:

CBS "48 Hours" did an episode on this case some time ago but I can't find it on their website. Does anyone know where I can locate it on the Internet?

Thanks!

 

[Curious Me]

Chris Coleman killed his two sons and wife because the Ministries he worked for would fire him if he got a divorce to marry his mistress. He wanted to keep his important security job.

Travis took a big risk taking sexy pics with Jody. He apparently trusted her more than he should have. I'm surprised Jody didn't try to blackmail him. He was in good standing in the church and on the job. She could have sent those pics to everybody, but she decided to go see him and hold a knife to his heart. She didn't want to just hurt him, but destroy him.