CO - Dylan Redwine - Forensics Discussion- *WARNING!* MAY INCLUDE GRAPHIC DETAILS

[Linda7NJ]

As I recall, it wasn't all that unreasonably warm. Which is why MR was complaining Dylan didn't have a coat with him.

Darn. I hate that we don't recall the same thing. Is there a website that would tell us about snowfall on that date and prior in that area?

 

[pinto]

Wasn't it unseasonably warm? I could have sworn on one of the very early threads that being discussed. I'm unable to do an advanced search on my phone and I can't see threads that old. But I'm almost 100% positive it's there somewhere.

Yes, it was a warm and dry fall.

To another post, yes, most campgrounds do close by Labor Day. That doesn't mean people don't camp outside of official campgrounds, they do that all year long anyway. But services (pump, trash, toilets) would not be maintained, and the actual campgrounds would probably be gated. But there are still many people who travel the area to hike, fish, camp, hunt, sit on a rock and stare at the stars, whatever....

 

[ColdHands]

Wasn't it unseasonably warm? I could have sworn on one of the very early threads that being discussed. I'm unable to do an advanced search on my phone and I can't see threads that old. But I'm almost 100% positive it's there somewhere.

Per http://www.wunderground.com/history...tml?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

It was highs in the 50s, lows in the 20s, no snow. Close to average temps.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Per http://www.wunderground.com/history...tml?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

It was highs in the 50s, lows in the 20s, no snow. Close to average temps.

So that road was passable ...correct?

 

[jjenny]

Darn. I hate that we don't recall the same thing. Is there a website that would tell us about snowfall on that date and prior in that area?

I don't believe there was any snow. Dylan was wearing shorts.

 

[pinto]

Darn. I hate that we don't recall the same thing. Is there a website that would tell us about snowfall on that date and prior in that area?

http://www.wunderground.com/history...tml?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

This is for Durango, won't go to Bayfield. Not sure I can get closer. If you look at the calendar at bottom, most of the month it was a good 8 to 10 degrees above normal. There was a little weather the weekend before the incident, but it had warmed back up by the time we are talking about.

 

[Ghostwheel]

I am very curious what the dumpsite was like on November 18th/19th. Were there many hikers/campers/ATVers up and around there in the early morning hours ? Would someone have been noticed going up there at sunrise?

Is it possible to make that trip up the mountain in the dark of night? I guess if you are desperate and stressed and motivated to save your own skin, anything is possible?

I have not been to that area, but from the Google Maps pictures, the main road would be easily traversed at night, and most of the side dirt roads (especially if you know the area) IMO, would be easily traversed at night. The first quarter moon (about half illuminated) did set about 10:34 November 18, 2012, but I've driven similar in the dark. Fog lights alone can give enough light to drive by.

People sometimes go up there to climb the crags, but the only pictures near that time were from October 9, 2012. ( at this post [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9618427&postcount=134"]# 134[/ame] ETA: No snow showing, but that is assuming those pictures were taken on October 9.

Also on post 134 above, there is a map with the gate locations. The road is not closed below the lower gate ever as far as I can tell (at least there is no way to gate it off that I can find) The lower gate is about a half mile south of the Bear Creek crossing.

ETA: from what I read at the website from post 134 above, the lower gate closes later than the upper gate and opens earlier than upper gate.

 

[cluciano63]

In a "Dateline" episode tonight, some people who murdered a young man had buried him and went back about a year later to retrieve the bones and move them elsewhere, due to news of a Walmart being built there. They missed a few small bones and those were later found. Anyway, I do wonder if more of Dylan's remains shouldn't have been in the area. I know there have been plenty of cases when much more of a victim was recovered, even after much longer than seven months. It just made me think about the idea of the perp trying to collect all the bones prior to discovery.

 

[caffeinejean]

I have a better picture (attached). It isn't a gate, it's a shaft of light on the road just past the gap in the trees. The gate is further south of that area.

Really, a shaft of light, it looks so perfectly parallel. But, that's okay, at least we know there is a gate and the remains were left beyond it .... I think!

 

[Sasquatch]

Sasquatch, excellent deduction and points about the location of the remains. Just as MR leaked and Ghostwheel mentioned... just off and below the road. But, a clandestine grave sounds a bit better than rolling a boy off a cliff which was my theory... neither is good though. Anyway, after looking at the photos you posted above, this is the first I noticed "the gate" at the headquarters of the search site at the rear of the photo. I've seen that photo before, but never saw the gate :banghead:? And just like the Whitney Heichel case, the body may have been taken to and left just beyond that gate, the gate that gets closed for the winter. Also the possible leakage we heard from MR in Tricia's interview about the gate being closed on Middle Mountain Road fits in. So odd that these awful events replicate themselves and statistics like from the FBI are close to right. Human behavior studied just like the habits of other animals and so on and so forth.... Scarey!
JMO

Thank you CJ! It is interesting that in both cases, that the bodies were most likely taken beyond the gates. In the Whitney Heichel Case, the Larch Mountain Gate closed on October 25th. In the DR case, the Middle Mountain Road gate (South of the search staging site) closed on 12/1/2012 and opened again on 5/31/2013. It looks like another gate beyond the search site, The Tucker Gate, was closed from 12/1/2012 - 6/16/2013

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5329145.pdf

Yes, human nature can be predictable and scarey all at the same time! The FBI has been dealing with a lot of these sick murderers over the years! I am glad that they take the time to share their statistics.

 

[Mitsana]

If LE thinks that DR's death was not natural, then they must have some evidence on the bones that they found indicating this.

Not necessarily. If MR was correct about the list of non-bone items they found, the shoe laces could have been knotted in a fashion that indicated homicide. I doubt the shirt fragment or sock could provide the evidence, but it's also possible that LE found items that they did not divulge to MR. That might even include other bones that might easily provide evidence of homicide (e.g. cranium, but I know that's probably just wishful thinking on my part). I don't know how much concrete evidence they feel they need to declare it a homicide (could it be something as simple as, "He wouldn't go for a walk up the mountain in those circumstances therefore it must be homicide"?).

 

[Ghostwheel]

Darn. I hate that we don't recall the same thing. Is there a website that would tell us about snowfall on that date and prior in that area?

If you look at http://www.wunderground.com DailyHistory You can see temperatures for Durango (about 2000 ft lower) were pretty standard (you can go back and check previous years). Precipitation was average, but only about an inch. Highs were between 54 and 58 for the first few days after Dylan arrived. Lows were 47-48. Not incredibly cold, but not warm either.

Bayfield was probably on the average side, as well, but I would guess colder due to altitude.

 

[Linda7NJ]

If you look at http://www.wunderground.com DailyHistory You can see temperatures for Durango (about 2000 ft lower) were pretty standard (you can go back and check previous years). Precipitation was average, but only about an inch. Highs were between 54 and 58 for the first few days after Dylan arrived. Lows were 47-48. Not incredibly cold, but not warm either.

Bayfield was probably on the average side, as well, but I would guess colder due to altitude.

I just wanted to know if that road was passable It was my understanding from way back that it was indeed passable.

 

[katydid23]

I think it has been confirmed and clarified now, that the road was passable, not under snow, and was not 'crowded.' A route that one could take without running into anyone else.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I think it has been confirmed and clarified now, that the road was passable, not under snow, and was not 'crowded.' A route that one could take without running into anyone else.

Right. So IMO that kinda of rules out anyone just passing through. Had to be someone very familiar with the area.

 

[katydid23]

Right. So IMO that kinda of rules out anyone just passing through. Had to be someone very familiar with the area.

I agree. A transient, passing through, is not going to go up a dirt road with one way in and one way out, that he is not familiar with, with a dead body of a child in his possession. They usually dump and run or drive over state lines and dump by the side of the road.

IMO< the dump site indicates it was a local perp. I know that LE canvassed the nrighborhood, actually the entire town, that same night. I wonder how many neighbors were actually in town that day/night?

 

[carbuff]

Not necessarily. If MR was correct about the list of non-bone items they found, the shoe laces could have been knotted in a fashion that indicated homicide. I doubt the shirt fragment or sock could provide the evidence, but it's also possible that LE found items that they did not divulge to MR. That might even include other bones that might easily provide evidence of homicide (e.g. cranium, but I know that's probably just wishful thinking on my part). I don't know how much concrete evidence they feel they need to declare it a homicide (could it be something as simple as, "He wouldn't go for a walk up the mountain in those circumstances therefore it must be homicide"?).

Well, a shirt fragment with a big hole and a bunch of blood might be considered evidence of homicide.

So many things can leave an incriminating trace. Until they release official information, it's hard to even guess. I think you're right about items they did not divulge to MR.

 

[song22]

I did hear back from Kevin Torres that MR and ER both told him a shoe was found, not just shoe-laces. He replied to my request for info on his facebook page.

 

[cluciano63]

Kind of OT, but I am curious about the remains found in CO this week, to see how much of the remains were still in place, compared to so few for Dylan, as they are saying these latest remains have been there "a while". I still get a feeling some may have been taken away by the perp since the spring thaw.

 

[margarita25]

Kind of OT, but I am curious about the remains found in CO this week, to see how much of the remains were still in place, compared to so few for Dylan, as they are saying these latest remains have been there "a while". I still get a feeling some may have been taken away by the perp since the spring thaw.

My guess is that these remains belong to [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144226"]Amy Ahonen. Ironically Amy disappeared 2 years ago today[/ame]. Anxiously awaiting news on this. I doubt Dylan's remains being separated and transported that far.