Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #176

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Welcome back to the Delphi Murders discussion thread.

On the afternoon of Feb. 13th, 2017, best friends Abigail Williams and Liberty German were dropped off at a bridge in the town of Delphi. On Feb 14th their bodies were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek which is about 0.5 miles from the bridge.

Richard Allen has been arrested and charged with the murders of Abby and Libby
ISP page dedicated to the investigation (includes audio of suspect)

FOR MORE CLICK HERE FOR THE CARROL COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE FACEBOOK PAGE.

Anyone with information about this case, no matter how insignificant, is encouraged to call the Delphi Homicide Investigation Tip Line at (844) 459-5786.

Information can also be reported by calling the Indiana State Police at(800) 382-7537, or the Carroll County Sheriff's Department at (765) 564-2413.

Information can also be emailed to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com

PICTURES OF ABBY AND LIBBY
Link to post with all threads 1 - 98 (Courtesy of margarita25)
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Rules Etiquette & Information

Case map by skibaboo updated with grayhuze crime flow video

Grayhuze youtube channel
Murder sheet YouTube

Verified Insiders: None in this case at this time. Verified Professional, Member michael.gartley, is a Verified Expert in Imaging Science.

RULES OF THIS DISCUSSION
DO NOT post photos of random individuals (including persons featured in MSM articles about other area crimes) to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.

PLEASE DO NOT POST PICTURES OF SEX OFFENDERS!

Do not sleuth family, PERIOD. This includes previous public records which have nothing to do with this case. They are victims here. Plain and simple.

If you feel you have a tip, by all means, phone it in. Do NOT discuss your tip here. Contact the authorities and give them time to follow your lead.

NOTE - per Tricia and Sillybilly’s 5.28.2021 post here, JBC as a poi is now open for discussion in the Delphi thread.

Added 12/12/21
For general discussion on KAK’s current case please use his thread.
IN, Peru - Kegan Anthony Kline, 27, arrested Aug 29, 2020, 30 Counts associated with CSAM
 
Last edited by a moderator:
A consolidation of ADMIN & MOD notes (edited November 24, 2022):

- Members are allowed to discuss Richard Allen's voice as heard on the Gray Hughes podcast. Members may NOT link directly to RA's wife’s social media accounts.

- Speculation about RA’s possible involvement in other cases belongs in the OTHER CASES thread.

- Speculation that is not based on known fact is not allowed.

- Please use initials only for anyone other than victims or perps.

- If you have questions about rules or moderation, please do not ask them on the thread. Just jump off any post to use the Report feature to ask and a Mod or Admin will respond as soon as possible.

- Rumors are not allowed. If you can't link information to Websleuths approved sources, do NOT post it with "I read it somewhere" or "I'll find the link later ...".

- Sleuthing or discussing RSOs just because they are on the registry is not allowed. A thread specific exception may be made by Tricia or an Admin depending on geographical location in relation a crime.

- Photo alterations or side-by-side comparisons of unrelated pictures are not allowed.
 
ADMIN NOTE:

Sorry folks, but statement analysis, body language analysis, amateur handwriting analysis is not allowed unless sourced to a credentialed, forensic specialist involved in the case under discussion.

This discussion is dedicated to Abby and Libby. Posts that do not relate directly to their case are off topic and such posts get removed. If you wish to discuss personal matters, please do so with your WS friends through PM or in the basement.

Also, the presumption of innocence is part and parcel of the judicial process. It does not apply to the general public who are entitled to express their opinion. Members are not here to be lectured or chastised by others for expressing their personal opinions. If you have an issue, use the Report feature and let Mods or Admins determine what is or is not okay to post.

Thanks.

Sillybilly
WS Administrator

Click here for The Rules
 
Delphi, IN had a population of a bit less than 3000 in 2016.
Carroll County sits around 30,000 citizens.
Purdue University, a 30 min drive from Delphi, has appx 52,000 students.

According to MrJitty's work regarding # of murders at about 5 in 100,000 in USA in 2017. "Murder is rare."

Perhaps the biggest clue is that we know the killer was familiar with this particular area and knew it was available for their purposes. Does that mean the killer knew what time to be there in order to grab these two girls?

BG looked to me, in those 2 seconds of video, like he was crossing that bridge at a fairly good clip. Showing no fear. Probably took him 4.5 minutes once he started across until he reached them and spoke those infamous words. How is that possible? Who practices walking across that scary bridge? Someone who lived on or near Deer Creek?

It was Abby's very first time to cross the MHB over Deer Creek. There was some reason for them to go there that was important to one or both of them. They were young and innocent in the ways of the world.

How do two young girls out for a stroll on a nice Monday afternoon suddenly find themselves kidnapped and forced down a hill to their deaths? 3000 local people and one of them finds two girls that fit his evil insatiable desires in the middle of the day on a walking trail? For the time being, I'm leaning towards they were set-up to be there. I do not understand BG knowing witnesses saw him and did it anyway. That's brassy.
MOO
 
I just can not reconcile Libby inviting her sister along that day to the bridge if they had plans to meet somebody.

We know from interviews Kelsi has been very outspoken on how let down and betrayed she felt over her sister chatting to strangers on the web.

it’s safe to say if Kelsi had changed her plans that day and gone to the bridge and there was a mysterious boy they was planning to meet she would of blown up and got both girls in a ton of trouble.
 
Salah11 said:
I just can not reconcile Libby inviting her sister along that day to the bridge if they had plans to meet somebody.

We know from interviews Kelsi has been very outspoken on how let down and betrayed she felt over her sister chatting to strangers on the web.

it’s safe to say if Kelsi had changed her plans that day and gone to the bridge and there was a mysterious boy they was planning to meet she would of blown up and got both girls in a ton of trouble.
Click to expand...

Indeed. The reason why these kinds of cases can be so hard to solve is the absence of any connection between victim(s) and killer.
 
On the phone data discussion from the previous thread, the alleged killer is "forensically aware" enough to turn his phone off or to leave it at home, but in six years doesn't destroy clothes or toss weapons/bullets that possibly link him? Doesn't seem to be aware enough that his victim is recording him from her phone. Also leaves at least one of the victim's phones at the crime scene. If RA is the killer I don't think he's this forensic mastermind at all.
 
Salah11 said:
I just can not reconcile Libby inviting her sister along that day to the bridge if they had plans to meet somebody.

We know from interviews Kelsi has been very outspoken on how let down and betrayed she felt over her sister chatting to strangers on the web.

it’s safe to say if Kelsi had changed her plans that day and gone to the bridge and there was a mysterious boy they was planning to meet she would of blown up and got both girls in a ton of trouble.
Click to expand...
Abby & Libby knew Kelsi had plans to meet up with her boyfriend. I think they just asked knowing ahead of time she would say no.

Kelsi is such a victim, I feel so sorry that she has had to second guess any of her decisions that day. That often happens when a loved one is murdered. Could have, should have, what ifs? it's mental torture for the families and it is nobody's fault except the deranged killer(s).

#Justice4Abby&Libby

MOO
 
abams said:
On the phone data discussion from the previous thread, the alleged killer is "forensically aware" enough to turn his phone off or to leave it at home, but in six years doesn't destroy clothes or toss weapons/bullets that possibly link him? Doesn't seem to be aware enough that his victim is recording him from her phone. Also leaves at least one of the victim's phones at the crime scene. If RA is the killer I don't think he's this forensic mastermind at all. The simplest explanation for the missing phone data is as what was said under oath in the the depos by investigators--there is none.
Click to expand...

I put "forensically aware" in quotes because i was being sarcastic.

Every clown knows not to take their phone to the murder. But by switching it off before the murder, then turning it back on right after the murder, you actually highlight the window when you did the crime. This has happened in half a dozen trials I've followed in recent years.

I do agree there is a chance there is no phone evidence at all, but I suspect even after so many years, LE were able to get at least the basic mast connection data from the telco. Whether his actual phone for '17 was recovered, who knows?
 
mrjitty said:
I put "forensically aware" in quotes because i was being sarcastic.

Every clown knows not to take their phone to the murder. But by switching it off before the murder, then turning it back on right after the murder, you actually highlight the window when you did the crime. This has happened in half a dozen trials I've followed in recent years.

I do agree there is a chance there is no phone evidence at all, but I suspect even after so many years, LE were able to get at least the basic mast connection data from the telco. Whether his actual phone for '17 was recovered, who knows?
Click to expand...
Yep, BK of the Moscow college murders did this absolutely genius move. It's right up there with keeping the shoes and shopping at Walmart for boneheaded things to do. (Don't do crime.)

MOO
 
mrjitty said:
I put "forensically aware" in quotes because i was being sarcastic.

Every clown knows not to take their phone to the murder. But by switching it off before the murder, then turning it back on right after the murder, you actually highlight the window when you did the crime. This has happened in half a dozen trials I've followed in recent years.

I do agree there is a chance there is no phone evidence at all, but I suspect even after so many years, LE were able to get at least the basic mast connection data from the telco. Whether his actual phone for '17 was recovered, who knows?
Click to expand...
I have no doubt LE, ISP & FBI didn't pull all the relevant phone tower information available in 2017. RA said he had his phone with him, on and checking the stock ticker during his brisk walking on the bridge and watching fish.

The information will be included in that tower dump and if it isn't, or it is out of his normal pattern usage, they will know that too, plus his arrival and departure times as well hopefully.

IMO
 
mrjitty said:
Yep - it's one of the most common fails of recent years. Need to figure out a way to have a digital alibi!
Click to expand...
Didn't work so great for Dotis Fulos.

In my years here on WS, I can only think of one case where digital forensics didn't trip up the perpetrator-- the kidnapping in Wisconsin. Unbelievably the perpetrator had no cellphone, no social media presence, no internet search history. His victim may never have been found if she hadn't rescued herself.

In all other cases, either the criminals have their phones on them or, as you say, the blackout period of no cell use is a beacon for LE!

jmo
 
girlhasnoname said:
Abby & Libby knew Kelsi had plans to meet up with her boyfriend. I think they just asked knowing ahead of time she would say no.

Kelsi is such a victim, I feel so sorry that she has had to second guess any of her decisions that day. That often happens when a loved one is murdered. Could have, should have, what ifs? it's mental torture for the families and it is nobody's fault except the deranged killer(s).

#Justice4Abby&Libby

MOO
Click to expand...


Yes but they couldn’t know that Kelsi wouldn’t put her little sister first and think I’ll just hang with the girls for a few hours. So the assumption is both Libby and Abby were happy for Kelsi to take along on their walk.

MOO
 
girlhasnoname said:
I have no doubt LE, ISP & FBI didn't pull all the relevant phone tower information available in 2017. RA said he had his phone with him, on and checking the stock ticker during his brisk walking on the bridge and watching fish.

The information will be included in that tower dump and if it isn't, or it is out of his normal pattern usage, they will know that too, plus his arrival and departure times as well hopefully.

IMO
Click to expand...

It's just very odd to me that the defense complained and speculated about everything else in the Franks but didn't say where the phone was.
 
Megnut said:
Didn't work so great for Dotis Fulos.

In my years here on WS, I can only think of one case where digital forensics didn't trip up the perpetrator-- the kidnapping in Wisconsin. Unbelievably the perpetrator had no cellphone, no social media presence, no internet search history. His victim may never have been found if she hadn't rescued herself.

In all other cases, either the criminals have their phones on them or, as you say, the blackout period of no cell use is a beacon for LE!

jmo
Click to expand...
Yes, Jayme Strong. <heart emoji>

Phone analysis and patterns tell a story of a person's daily habits. If that story is significantly changed or stopped suddenly on a day when it should be like any other, unless they are accused of a crime, it can well mean trouble for them.

MOO
 
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