TRIAL OF CHAD DAYBELL CHARGED WITH MURDER OF JJ VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN AND TAMMY DAYBELL #2

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indicolite22 said:
After watching a Mormon Stories podcast episode with host John Dehlin and guests Lauren Matthias (HTC) and Lori's cousin Meegan, it's clearer to me why JP wanted JD as a defense witness. While JD believes that most of Chad's doctrine is based on LDS teachings (new or old), the guests tried to make a distinction. Church of the Firstborn is one such example. They expressed that if this was not done, Chad might get away with it. JP's plan is likely to paint Chad as a mainstream Mormon and, if the teaching were harmful, blame the Church. The goal is to deny existence of a cult and Chad's leadership.
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Th thing is, I'm kinda with JD on this:

Lori is guilty on all counts, even though in her relationship with Chad, he was the one with more power.

Even if the cult was not really a cult but the expected, legitimate practice of a major religion, how does that absolve Chad?

He still sent the raccoon text, checked wind direction, reported on "Viola," told his lover he was sad because he wasn't with her, and not because his wife was dead, has to contend with his wife's restraint bruises, place of death, and contradictory, impossible stories such as that his dead wife fell out of bed, dug a grave, provided soiled tools... the list goes on. The newest addition, both he and his daughter were unsurprised and not inquisitive when LE was digging up human remains in Chad's yard, but did know ahead of arrest that Chad was losing his freedom.

MOO
 
I was surprised JD made no distinction between mainstream LDS and COTFB, since Joseph Smith was COTFB. After deep-diving modern and what I personally consider to be historic fringe believers, it is true that most of the concepts at face value are captured in either mainstream LDS, COTFB or Christianity. However, LM & MC were also correct re: Chad's twisting, modification, and/ or wresting.

That being said, it is abundantly clear now that JP would have been running all the bases with JD as a witness!
 
watergirl62 said:
I was surprised JD made no distinction between mainstream LDS and COTFB, since Joseph Smith was COTFB. After deep-diving modern and what I personally consider to be historic fringe believers, it is true that most of the concepts at face value are captured in either mainstream LDS, COTFB or Christianity. However, LM & MC were also correct re: Chad's twisting, modification, and/ or wresting.

That being said, it is abundantly clear now that JP would have been running all the bases with JD as a witness!
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Running all the bases, but not tagging any of them hard enough, IMO.

My opinion about this (as a non-expert) is that both are correct.

This is deep LDS. And this is not at all LDS.

It appears to me that very devout, brilliant, educated persons of conscience who are LDS are appalled at the idea these cult ideas are LDS. While it is in there, hidden, it never impacts many faith-filled lives.

MOO
 
Ruminations said:
Wow, she's still mad at the judge and possibly Lauren Matthias, IMO. A lot of Lori Hellis' emotions come through on this live.

She did say she thought the lawyer was a well intentioned " hippie-era" actor concerned with appropriate representation of persons facing the death penalty. But she also said he made a mistake in filing the motion. She glossed over that the lawyer had no permission from Chad to represent him. She ignored entirely the fact that Radcliffe had literal years to make his motion, and instead made it sound like the judge and prosecutors were just being whiners about having their weekends interrupted. I found her analysis of the situation more subjective than objective.

She did give an alternate theory to the reasoning behind filing beyond just trying to delay and confuse the case more of behalf of the defense. She theorized it was an idealistic "rescue" of a death penalty-facing defendant. But that simply does not track with 5he timing. Again, he had literal years. Or at the very least, he could have intervened when Prior claimed he wanted off the case. I believe he didn't intervene then because he and Prior were trying to maximize the delay possible by pulling these stunts one at a time.

A question came in live. In her opinion, is Prior annoying the jury? She said no. However, she did say that he seems to be annoying the judge. I don't see that. The judge is very much overruling the States reasonable objections to Prior, and appears to be respecting his defensive efforts and to be favoring Prior to me. (And this is okay with me. The defendants life is on the line. I'd rather he get a little too much slack than too little. But I don't at all see that the judge is annoyed with Prior.)

MOO
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IIRC wasn't LH told off by the Judge during Lori's trial? I do think that Judge Boyce get annoyed with JP and I think he bites his tongue more often than not.
 
Nikynoo said:
IIRC wasn't LH told off by the Judge during Lori's trial? I do think that Judge Boyce get annoyed with JP and I think he bites his tongue more often than not.
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I think Boyce is annoyed by Prior. By the time Ratliff appeared, he had already had a very trying day maintaining a calm demeanor. Prior /Gibb were the set and Ratliff was the spike.

LH got in trouble for seemingly taking a photo, but hadn't done so, and got kicked out. Also ahe had submitted that motion about excessive sealings before the trial ever started.
 
Ruminations said:
Th thing is, I'm kinda with JD on this:

Lori is guilty on all counts, even though in her relationship with Chad, he was the one with more power.

Even if the cult was not really a cult but the expected, legitimate practice of a major religion, how does that absolve Chad?

He still sent the raccoon text, checked wind direction, reported on "Viola," told his lover he was sad because he wasn't with her, and not because his wife was dead, has to contend with his wife's restraint bruises, place of death, and contradictory, impossible stories such as that his dead wife fell out of bed, dug a grave, provided soiled tools... the list goes on. The newest addition, both he and his daughter were unsurprised and not inquisitive when LE was digging up human remains in Chad's yard, but did know ahead of arrest that Chad was losing his freedom.

MOO
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Now, that is an interesting point. How should someone "act" when the FBI is searching your home, and digging up your backyard? CD's daughter wasn't freaking out...she was just matter of fact about it.

The conversation was so mundane, CD talking about going to jail, with completely flat affect. The scene was like something out of "Fargo".
 
alexwood said:
Not only did he look foolish, but he was obviously impaired when he wrote the pleading. (IMO.)
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I think it is wrong and potentially slanderous to post that an attorney was "obviously impaired" based on 3 misspelled words. IMO
 
watergirl62 said:
I think Boyce is annoyed by Prior. By the time Ratliff appeared, he had already had a very trying day maintaining a calm demeanor. Prior /Gibb were the set and Ratliff was the spike.

LH got in trouble for seemingly taking a photo, but hadn't done so, and got kicked out. Also ahe had submitted that motion about excessive sealings before the trial ever started.
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lol- I like your metaphor about Boyce spiking that bomb on Ratliff.

Boyce did defend Prior vigorously at the show-cause hearing. Boyce put all the responsibility for the motion on the person filing it (as it should be). I think it was a defense prank. But that doesn't absolve Ratliff. When a professional takes a professional action, it is their responsibility. It doesn't matter if they got phone calls.

If Boyce was annoyed at Prior for his role, he didn't show it at that hearing.

MOO
 
Trebor5591 said:
I think it is wrong and potentially slanderous to post that an attorney was "obviously impaired" based on 3 misspelled words. IMO
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It was an opinion. I don't share it, because the inappropriate actions were precision timed. I think it was all planned and the typos/wrong case number were a distraction to make dealing with the motion as cumbersome as possible and increase the odds of delaying the trial.

The plan was to jolt Boyce and prevent him from figuring out that this was a frivolous motion before it got out. Remember, parties that received it included attorneys for press outlets. It was a back door around the gag order. Boyce was not thrown off his game on the weekend. He figured out what was going on, and sealed it quick! I really admire how Boyce handled this.

MOO
 
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Ruminations said:
Running all the bases, but not tagging any of them hard enough, IMO.

My opinion about this (as a non-expert) is that both are correct.

This is deep LDS. And this is not at all LDS.

It appears to me that very devout, brilliant, educated persons of conscience who are LDS are appalled at the idea these cult ideas are LDS. While it is in there, hidden, it never impacts many faith-filled lives.

MOO
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The same way the Inquisition appalls very devout Catholics but doesn’t affect their faith-filled lives. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t study the knickers out of it to steer clear of revivalists.
 
Just curious whether anyone has documented the number of times Chad actually responded to queries from reporters or others. I recall at least one clip from Hawaii where he assures the kids are somewhere safe. And, of course, he was on the call with MG in which he implicitly endorses Lori’s b.s. Were there other recorded instances and,if so, when and where did they occur?
 
mickey2942 said:
What?! How dare he have a life! I am actually so glad that he continues with his life, and has not let this consume his life. Kudos to Nate!
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He did say that he would be checking in on twitter because he can't help it (lol), and may stream later in the week. IIRC he said that there would be a couple people going to replace him. He talked about it on his stream last night but I don't remember the specifics.

Now watch something major happen that Nate will lament not witnessing in person, haha.
 
lightofmine99 said:
I sure hope Heather Daybell actually gets to testify and was not just subpoenaed to prevent her from going to the trial so shoot Chad dirty looks.

But deep down I have a feeling she was only subpoenaed at the request of Chad. MOO.
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I suspect she was subpoenaed to keep her out of the room, too. But I wonder how much she wanted to be there, anyway. Chad was always threatened by her. It's not like it would be something new that she upsets him.

I truly think she has superior insight into the stories surrounding the trial and how things got to this for Chad. But I don't think her insight is particularly relevant evidence for conviction. Nor is it relevant exculpatory information. In other words, I think she is essential to the story behind the trial, but has little to do with the trial itself.

Based on what little I know, of course. For some reason, her lawyer did think she might want to save her HTC interview for after the trial. She chose not to take that advice.What she said certainly didn't paint Chad in a neutral light, lol, but it wasn't evidence either. Maybe she has some evidence but didn't include that in the interview. But, remember it's defense that called her, not prosecution.

MOO
 
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