It's TORI - Remains Found in Mt. Forest, ON, July 19, 2009

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Turbododger

Turbododger

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Victoria Stafford's Remains were found near
Mt. Forest, ON
Sunday, July 19, 2009​

police_salute_victoria.jpg


Tori's Aunt: It's The Death Of Our Hope​




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​

Human remains found in southwestern Ontario are almost certainly those of Victoria Stafford, a Woodstock schoolgirl who has been missing for three months, according to the head of the provincial police.

"We have some very strong leads that cause us to believe that we have in fact located the human remains of [Victoria] Tori Stafford," Ontario Provincial Police Commissioner Julian Fantino said.

Victoria, who was eight years old, disappeared April 8 while on her way home from school in Woodstock. Until now, a massive search effort had failed to find a trace of the girl, even after two people were charged with kidnapping and first-degree murder in the case.
On Monday, police confirmed that remains had been found Sunday near Mount Forest, about 95 kilometres north of Woodstock.
Police said new information led them to the location

Victoria's father, Rodney Stafford, said news of the discovery was "the worst of the possibilities" he has had to consider since his daughter's disappearance. Despite the murder charges, Stafford told reporters in Woodstock he always held out hope that Victoria might be found alive. "Even up until last night I was [looking] ... you can't help but think, is that her just up ahead, or was that her voice in the background? You can't help but hear that," he said.

Stafford said he hopes confirmation that the remains are Victoria's will bring closure for him and other family members. Victoria's aunt, Rebecca Nichols, echoed those feelings.

"Even though it's not the ending we were hoping for, we're not going to be spending a lifetime wondering, we're not going to be looking in every car, in every backseat that we drive by, in every window of every house that we drive by. We're not going to be wondering, is Victoria in there? So yes, there is a sense of relief," she said.

 
CP24's Sue Sgambati just had a live interview with Det. Sgt. Jim Smith, who is a Criminal Profiler with the Behavioural Sciences division of the OPP that found the remains.

1. The reason he was in the area, is that they were in the process of expanding the search area, and he was assessing how much further and the best areas to expand the search.

2. In the last week or so, information had come to light to expand the area. They were very confident the areas that they had searched so far had been done thoroughly.

3. Based on a "hunch" if you want to call it that, he found items and the things he saw led him further in. He was "startled" with what he found.

4. He said "we moved through the steps" to process the scene, and notified forensic ID unit to take over the scene. (* note he said "we" several times)

5. The investigative teams have been following 1,000's of hunches over the last 2 months. He simply looked somewhere that interested him.

6. Goal is to help prosecution and the crown to move the case forward against the 2 accused.

7. The role that TLM played, was in addition to other information that came together to give them a picture of what to look for.

8. He would not say what the new information was.

9. He has been helping the teams understand the motivations behing the crimes, and to help them make decisions on how to move the investigation forward.
 
This video interviews the Mennonite owner of the property where Tori was recovered.

1. He worked right by the area "earlier on", but didn't notice anything.

2. This area fit the profile established by different information, in that it was off a laneway that was located across the street from a house that was close to the road. (I have not read or heard that information before, about the house, this was not released by LE)

3. The laneway is often used by horse and buggy's as a short cut between concessions.

http://site.citynews.ca/video/?bcpid...id=30106500001
 
Today, the close-knit Mennonite community here was rocked by the news the remains of a child were found on a narrow gravel laneway they frequently use to negotiate between rural concession roads.

“We don’t understand the commotion,” said Ervin, who didn’t want his last name used.

It was even more bizarre to the community because TVs, phones and radios are forbidden among the conservative religious community, so many hadn’t heard of Tori’s disappearance which had so consumed most of Southwestern Ontario since she was abducted April 8.

I was out picking rocks in that area just a couple days ago.”

What he can't figure out is how someone who didn't know the area would know to stop by there. He called the area like a “needle in a haystack.”

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Loc.../10201391.html
 
Revisiting the notes from the interview with Det. Sgt. Jim Smyth, the Criminal Profiler who found Victoria, I would like to question what everyone thinks he found prior to his discovery of Victoria? He specifically said, I am quoting him here, that he "found items" and the things he saw led him further in. He was "startled with what he found." What would he have found, I am assuming here, closer to the road, that led him further in? This is important, IMO.
 
Turbododger said:
Revisiting the notes from the interview with Det. Sgt. Jim Smyth, the Criminal Profiler who found Victoria, I would like to question what everyone thinks he found prior to his discovery of Victoria? He specifically said, I am quoting him here, that he "found items" and the things he saw led him further in. He was "startled with what he found." What would he have found, I am assuming here, closer to the road, that led him further in? This is important, IMO.
Click to expand...

Can you find the video of the interview with Det. Smyth where he states that there was new info that assisted in the location of the site? There was a lot of shocking revelations in that interview if I remember correctly. TIA
 
matou said:
Can you find the video of the interview with Det. Smyth where he states that there was new info that assisted in the location of the site? There was a lot of shocking revelations in that interview if I remember correctly. TIA
Click to expand...

Yes, I have been trying for 1/2 an hour! It's a tricky one to find, I watched it live on tv, then stumbled across it online a couple of days later.
 
Turbododger said:
Revisiting the notes from the interview with Det. Sgt. Jim Smyth, the Criminal Profiler who found Victoria, I would like to question what everyone thinks he found prior to his discovery of Victoria? He specifically said, I am quoting him here, that he "found items" and the things he saw led him further in. He was "startled with what he found." What would he have found, I am assuming here, closer to the road, that led him further in? This is important, IMO.
Click to expand...

Interesting question... I would certianly love to hear this officer speak openly- clearly that will have to wait until trial.

I believe it makes sense that TLM gave some descriptives of where Tori's remains were left, and that is what first sparked his curiosity to stop in that area and do some searching. So like its been said, the fact that there is a house, close to the road, across the street from a laneway that goes back a fair bit all would have made him wonder Im sure, hence a desire to investigate further. One theory I have is once he focused in a bit more on that area, he could have found rope, or a weapon of some sort, maybe a carpeting tossed aside from the car, or even something as simple as a bag from home depot with a receipt in it!
Given this was so disturbing however, I have to wonder if there was dismemberment, and if so, it is possible to have found a body part nearer to the road, which could have possible been pulled closer to the roadway by an animal. This depending on the part of her remains, would have been a disturbing discovery Im sure.

JMO!
 
I think he found something that he recognized as Tori's, like maybe her Bratz bag or some clothing or something.
 
Kittymama said:
I think he found something that he recognized as Tori's, like maybe her Bratz bag or some clothing or something.
Click to expand...

Maybe. I wonder, too, if the rock pile was not obvious when he first turned down the laneway (long grass and weeds blocking view?) and as he drove further in he saw it. The silos, laneway, large tree and rock pile would have given him cause to explore further since TLM gave them landmarks to go by. I imagine many officers drove down a lot of laneways with a large tree and rock piles before happening upon the correct one.

I know a couple of times when I took the back way home from the Guelph area, I noticed a few "potential" places based on what the media had disclosed. GSPr's are the greatest... one can take all kinds of backroads and not worry about getting lost!!

If the person I met in June is the same detective (and I'm pretty sure it is), I'll do my best to see what he'll say if our paths cross next weekend. Although, I doubt he will offer any new information that hasn't already been released to the media.
 
antiquegirl said:
If he's guilty, then it's certainly a possibility. Why do you think he would have? It would be risky.

MOO
Click to expand...

I don't know why he would do it just that some murderers have done this kind of thing.
 
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