NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - # 3

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Fairy1 said:
Since we have a real, live reporter here - I also want to mention that I've seen a number of reports and such with conflicting information. I've seen Steven is 5'8", 5'10" and the poster I have now from Project Jason says 5'11". I've also seen reports saying he went missing 12/13, 12/14 and 12/15. There are more, but you get the gist.

I sure would love to see these details nailed down.
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With descriptive details, always go with what's on the poster. We end up writing 500 stories a day and little mistakes make it through the cracks (see my map issue above...)

As far as the dates: Sometimes, especially early on in a story, details get reported that might not be totally correct. We try to parrot what police or family tell us, but they might not know 100%. They say a detail anyway, and we end up running it. There's a good Las Vegas example of that from today. Remember the shooting at our federal courthouse? Police made a major correction of facts today surrounding that shooting. The victim fired his weapon (originally he didn't), the suspect was shot several times (originally it was twice). You get the idea.

In this case, we all have established from the family and security video that he went missing on the 13th.

Hope that helps. I'm happy to answer any other questions.
 
CONCRNED CTZN said:
GW...another thing that gets me. The question of him making the meeting was asked on Facebook where the clerk posted the original time line of events that he was involved in. Even he (the clerk) did not answer that simple question from others who posted that same question and are not on here. I feel like if the answer was a resounding yes, we would know that. There is a reason why no one has an answer to that.

In regards to GW, maybe Naegle could get some more events for the time line from him. I am assuming that GW and Steven performed their church duties together at least bi-weekly. Or maybe if Steven had started canceling on him, that would be important too, especially if he gave reasons, like "I am in Vegas" or "I am going to Vegas". If GW is not involved...or a POI, then he should be a resource, ONE would think.
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I think the duties were rotational between the President (Web) and the two conselors (one of whom was Steven).

How much simpler can it be, than stating it this way:

GW calls Steven to cover for him, 'cos GW's in Vegas.
Steven can't, 'cos he's in Vegas.
Abboud calls and also finds out Steven's in Vegas.
Abboud calls again (at Bishop's request) and asks Steven, who he knows is 150 miles away, to come to a meeting that's already in progress.

The ONLY thing I can think of, is this: Abboud didn't want to admit, in front of the Bishop, that he knew where Steven (and probably Webb) were....so he went ahead and made the call for the Bishop.
 
laytonian said:
One WOULD think, of course.

Don't forget that these are three of the four (male) leaders of the ward, and could invoke clergy-penitent privilege. The LDS do have an exemption now, if someone confesses child sexual abuse to their Bishop, but other communications can be as sacrosanct as those in a formal Catholic confessional. There's also self-sufficiency and possible protection of others.

Naegle is hundreds of miles away, and wouldn't be in a position to investigate people, even if she were closer.

But I don't see anything wrong with another member of the Priesthood, especially one related to Steven, talking to those men and at least clearing the air.
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I was just suggesting that when Steven's "good friend" and first counselor GW calls the family daily or weekly or whatever to find out what he could do or what's happening, he could shed some light on Steven's state of mind, etc., before he went missing. That's all I was suggesting. My husband would be devastated if one of his counselors went missing and we would probably see him on here more than a family member. Friends are usually the best one's to handle these types of forums. (We have seen the way it affects Naegle...:-() He loves those guys...even the ones that annoy the heck out of him. ;-)
 
swjaxon said:
With descriptive details, always go with what's on the poster. We end up writing 500 stories a day and little mistakes make it through the cracks (see my map issue above...)

As far as the dates: Sometimes, especially early on in a story, details get reported that might not be totally correct. We try to parrot what police or family tell us, but they might not know 100%. They say a detail anyway, and we end up running it. There's a good Las Vegas example of that from today. Remember the shooting at our federal courthouse? Police made a major correction of facts today surrounding that shooting. The victim fired his weapon (originally he didn't), the suspect was shot several times (originally it was twice). You get the idea.

In this case, we all have established from the family and security video that he went missing on the 13th.

Hope that helps. I'm happy to answer any other questions.
Click to expand...

We do the same thing here. Someone will mention something, it gets cleared up/clarified, and a couple of days later, someone else comes along and sees the original "thing".....and it starts all over.

Here's a question:
Is there any suspicion that age 30-ish single men are being lured to Las Vegas? Take a look here:
http://sites.google.com/site/parallelcooler/home/koecher-html/morse
 
laytonian said:
I think the duties were rotational between the President (Web) and the two counselors (one of whom was Steven).

How much simpler can it be, than stating it this way:

GW calls Steven to cover for him, 'cos GW's in Vegas.
Steven can't, 'cos he's in Vegas.
Abboud calls and also finds out Steven's in Vegas.
Abboud calls again (at Bishop's request) and asks Steven, who he knows is 150 miles away, to come to a meeting that's already in progress.

The ONLY thing I can think of, is this: Abboud didn't want to admit, in front of the Bishop, that he knew where Steven (and probably Webb) were....so he went ahead and made the call for the Bishop.
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Naegle said there was only one call from Abboud after all.

And why did they call Steven? How did they find out about Webb? If Webb had called, why didn't he tell them he talked to Steven? And they realized Webb was not coming 15 minutes into the meeting...so if that is when Webb called, we know by his own admission, that he knew that would not be there. If he called and said he would not be making it, and didn't share the information about Steven, there was a reason.
 
laytonian said:
We do the same thing here. Someone will mention something, it gets cleared up/clarified, and a couple of days later, someone else comes along and sees the original "thing".....and it starts all over.

Here's a question:
Is there any suspicion that age 30-ish single men are being lured to Las Vegas? Take a look here:
http://sites.google.com/site/parallelcooler/home/koecher-html/morse
Click to expand...

It's tough to sort out what's true and isn't. We've gone days reporting erroneous facts.

As for men being lured to Las Vegas... I doubt it. While the similarities are interesting, they're just too vague.

A couple of things to consider: I think families of missing persons in LV always feel like they're not taken seriously by LE. But that's not because LE doesn't care. We just have thousands of missing persons reports every year. Typically the missing person turns up. These two cases are the exception.

Second, the fact they were both caught on surveillance before they disappeared is, to me, completely irrelevant. If you live here, you're on surveillance all the time -- probably adding up to several hours per year. Cameras are everywhere in this town.

Lastly, why lure someone to the suburbs? No one cares about our suburbs. People come to LV for one reason...
 
Naegle said the bank account is...0. Is she trying to tell us they took the money out...so don't try to steal it, or did something happen that I missed?
 
CONCRNED CTZN said:
Naegle said there was only one call from Abboud after all.

And why did they call Steven? How did they find out about Webb? If Webb had called, why didn't he tell them he talked to Steven? And they realized Webb was not coming 15 minutes into the meeting...so if that is when Webb called, we know by his own admission, that he knew that would not be there. If he called and said he would not be making it, and didn't share the information about Steven, there was a reason.
Click to expand...

I didn't see Naegle's comment about only one Abboud call.
At first, we thought there calls from GW, Abboud and the Bishop -- and then it was clarified that Abboud called on behalf of the bishop.

So...the VERY specifically-timed 10:47am call didn't happen?

The bishop said that he had Abboud call at 10:10/10:15.

Sometimes I wonder if we're getting played.
 
swjaxon said:
Second, the fact they were both caught on surveillance before they disappeared is, to me, completely irrelevant. If you live here, you're on surveillance all the time -- probably adding up to several hours per year. Cameras are everywhere in this town.

Lastly, why lure someone to the suburbs? No one cares about our suburbs. People come to LV for one reason...
Click to expand...

But consider it this way: with that many cameras, indoors and out, neither man was ever seen on another one. One of them likely didn't expect that they'd walk by a home that had at least 7 security cameras....but is that common in the suburbs?

We come to Vegas for a couple of business reasons; we haven't stepped inside a casino for almost 20 years. To us, it's kinda like Phoenix.
 
I copied this directly from Facebook from Doxey himself:

At approximately 11:10 AM on Sunday, December 13 during PEC meeting, we called Steve on his cell phone to see if he could be at the meeting to replace our EQ President (whom we had just realized wouldn't be at the meeting). Steve answered and said that he was in Vegas and couldn't make the meeting in time. We didn't ask what he was doing in Vegas and he didn't seem as though something was amiss. He didn't tell us when he would be back.

This is the reason I have such a problem with "just realized"... So did they realize cause Webb called them? And when he called didn't mention Steven?
 
CONCRNED CTZN said:
I copied this directly from Facebook from Doxey himself:

At approximately 11:10 AM on Sunday, December 13 during PEC meeting, we called Steve on his cell phone to see if he could be at the meeting to replace our EQ President (whom we had just realized wouldn't be at the meeting). Steve answered and said that he was in Vegas and couldn't make the meeting in time. We didn't ask what he was doing in Vegas and he didn't seem as though something was amiss. He didn't tell us when he would be back.

This is the reason I have such a problem with "just realized"... So did they realize cause Webb called them? And when he called didn't mention Steven?
Click to expand...

"realized" -- something told them. Not that he was late, but that he wouldn't be there.

See. That's the 11:10am call; yet, I was told specifically that Abboud made a 10:47am call, too. So I'm not dropping them unless we see phone records.
 
believe09 said:
still, don't feel bad unless you and DH buried Steve in the backyard.

My landlord calls himself a capitalist with a heart-he is trying to make money off his properties, but he will work with you to make it work for you....
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lol !! Kinda hard for him to catch the rent up then. That's DH, he was trying to work with Steve and Steve had paid a little bit, he had been paying some part of the utilites to help keep them on. And making promises and plans to catch up the rent.

laytonian said:
You and your DH had a business relationship with Steven, and there's nothing wrong with asking a 30-year-old to respect that relationship. There's also nothing wrong with calling the reference listed on the lease. That's why they are there.

No need to feel guilt.
Click to expand...

Thanks guys, that helps. I know we didn't do anything wrong but DH does have a big heart, to big sometimes. He keeps second guessing himself thinking maybe he should have called the parents sooner or handled things differently. He has been the one who has talked with Steve parents and I know their grief tears him up.

liz b. said:
CC,
Actually, I was thinking that someone in the development might have lured Steven over there, using the pretext of showing him a room to rent. KWIM ?
Click to expand...

I have wondered about that too. We live up here near the SLC area and I know exactly why Steve hated the inversions. It is horrible air, gives us all sinus issues, to cold, to much snow. LV would have more employment opportunities than St George and weather that is fairly similar, just a bit warmer. And when ever a renter stops paying rent they are planning on moving out, at least that has been our experience.

I keep wondering if IHOP guy will go back. I hope he does but then I had a thought if he does and sees his picture on the front door he might just turn around and leave. If I didn't want to be found I wouln't go into a place I knew people had been there looking for me.
 
laytonian said:
But consider it this way: with that many cameras, indoors and out, neither man was ever seen on another one. One of them likely didn't expect that they'd walk by a home that had at least 7 security cameras....but is that common in the suburbs?

We come to Vegas for a couple of business reasons; we haven't stepped inside a casino for almost 20 years. To us, it's kinda like Phoenix.
Click to expand...

Laytonian-

So does more video exist of Steven then? I want to see those.
 
laytonian said:
But consider it this way: with that many cameras, indoors and out, neither man was ever seen on another one. One of them likely didn't expect that they'd walk by a home that had at least 7 security cameras....but is that common in the suburbs?

We come to Vegas for a couple of business reasons; we haven't stepped inside a casino for almost 20 years. To us, it's kinda like Phoenix.
Click to expand...

Sure, but I think you know what I mean. If someone is getting lured, I don't think the ruse will be in the suburbs. Just my opinion though.

Who's to say he wasn't seen on other security tapes? No one knows where he went after walking past that last camera. The next day his phone dialed voicemail. I would say it's more than possible it was him making the call. If it was, I suspect he's been caught on several cameras and we just don't know it yet.
 
There is a picture on Facebook that shows GW and Steven getting food together at the Dinner on the 9th and then them sitting together eating. So maybe they were good friends. I notice that only SS said something about that, and GW didn't. He is a member of Steven's page, so you can get his link from there.

GW has a Facebook page by the way. If there was a way to privately message him I would just to ask for some help. Hummm....
 
CONCRNED CTZN said:
Naegle said the bank account is...0. Is she trying to tell us they took the money out...so don't try to steal it, or did something happen that I missed?
Click to expand...

Does it really matter if the account was literally $0, $50, or $135.97? Steven was obviously flat broke and was in no position to fly anywhere. He may have zeroed out the account and spent cash here or there but being 3 months behind on rent, there was not alot of money floating around here.
 
laytonian said:
I like that poster, too! Maybe ALSO write this on it, in red, in the top margin? I dunno. I'm just living up to a Bossy Pants reputation ;)

Henderson Nevada Police: 702-267-5000
Las Vegas Police: (702) 229-2907 or (702) 828-3111

I just went over to Project Jason, hoping that I could contact whoever made the poster, to add the information. I see, on their Steven page, they even have two numbers listed for the LVPD. BUT...when I tried to register, it rejected me, saying "registration disabled".

Since the new news article links to THAT poster, it'd be great to get it changed.

Any of our WONDERFULLY TALENTED GRAPHICS ARTISTS available to make the additions and then (if registered) sent it in to Project Jason?

Call me Bossy Helpless.
Click to expand...

I hate that I didn't see this sooner -- I was offline for the last half of yesterday. Do we still need a new poster? I'm more than happy to help out.
 
laytonian said:
Other sources say that LE was involved in the 30 Dec search and thereafter; see the timeline. I've tried to document every search, and who ws involved.
Click to expand...

Customarily LE has to be involved in the event that something is found-the chain of custody has to be preserved. Additionally, LE can grant permission for searchers to "trespass" on public or private lands in their search. It is just good form and a win win.
 
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