NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #10

Welcome to Websleuths!
Click to learn how to make a missing person's thread

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Status
Not open for further replies.
It's relevant to me for a number of reasons, mainly, that sillybilly's accusation that I was throwing around an accusation was false.

???? I didn't accuse you of anything ... I merely pointed out that the error of CPH being referred to as an MD appeared to have been contained in the original Style of Cause originating on the plaintiff's side. If you've ever worked in a law firm, it is important that the Style of Cause be precise because every subsequent document in the proceeding will contain it verbatim, unless application is made to the court to have it amended.
 
???? I didn't accuse you of anything ... I merely pointed out that the error of CPH being referred to as an MD appeared to have been contained in the original Style of Cause originating on the plaintiff's side. If you've ever worked in a law firm, it is important that the Style of Cause be precise because every subsequent document in the proceeding will contain it verbatim, unless application is made to the court to have it amended.

I was referring to the substance abuse rehab comment.
 
I don't take personal any of the things we have said to each other, it's ok that we all get "into" this case, it is an emotionally charged crime.

I think I stated this before, but I will again, so that we all know this sleuthing is in good fun. If in the end, when this case comes to (real) conclusion, I am wrong, then I plan to say sorry to everybody by eating a pig's head (grilled) and taping the ordeal to post for your pleasure. :sick: I do believe in what I am doing and would rather put my $ where my mouth is, but that's impossible (and immoral) so this is what I offer to my fellow sleuthers for enduring my opinion.

This bet started with my family and friends at the beach this summer as I made them listen to my "opinions".
 
I was referring to the substance abuse rehab comment.

I don't recall who that poster was offhand, but it wasn't me.

Okay, who offered drinks? I'll have six please :crazy:

ETA: Oh, it was MK offering up the libations ... i should have known :)
 
I don't take personal any of the things we have said to each other, it's ok that we all get "into" this case, it is an emotionally charged crime.

I think I stated this before, but I will again, so that we all know this sleuthing is in good fun. If in the end, when this case comes to (real) conclusion, I am wrong, then I plan to say sorry to everybody by eating a pig's head (grilled) and taping the ordeal to post for your pleasure. :sick: I do believe in what I am doing and would rather put my $ where my mouth is, but that's impossible (and immoral) so this is what I offer to my fellow sleuthers for enduring my opinion.

This bet started with my family and friends at the beach this summer as I made them listen to my "opinions".

I'll cop to the charge of sometimes being overly invested and overly emotional when it comes to this case. For me, it comes from the vulnerablity of these girls and the fact that the cops just didn't seem to give a rat's *advertiser censored* about them. It makes me furious and incredibly sad at the same time. DS once said that it's like a predator that smells a dying gazelle. Man, that just hits the nail right on the head for me and sums up exactly why this case is so personal for me.

(Shuts up and drinks now.)

ETA: And then passes the bottle to Billy.
 
I am debating whether or not to continue contributing to this discussion or to simply take the sidelines as a spectator. After what I've learned over the past 48 hours I have become fearful how this discussion has crossed the line in that it now contains libelous statements that are still being presented as being fact.

It's one thing to speculate and to give one's personal opinion. It's ILLEGAL to state something is fact and then refuse to retract that statement. When it's put into words and communicated to others via a published media it fits the definition of Libel. When it's spoken to others it fits the definition of Slander. I am fearful that these conversations many have crossed the line of both. With that being said, I officially am saying that I denounce the practice of misrepresenting to us information that cannot be proven or that has been proven to be false when such information has been stated to be a "Fact". In otherwords, I dennounce all attempts that have been made to misrepresent false or unproven facts as being true.

Going forward I may or may not decide to continue posting because if/when the cease and desist orders start coming, I do not want to be clumped in as being an associate of the guilty party. I will promise to agree to post more details if someone cannot clearly see the posts that clearly contain defamation of CPH's character without substantial proof to backup the claims being made (as well as statements that are clearly false). That is if the posts in question aren't deleted already.
 
Yeah well, I stink. And that's a verifiable fact if anyone wants to come whiff me. ;)

I'm hitting the showers. :)
 
You say: "The fact that he received medical treatment for substance abuse couldn't be used against him in the case. If he never received substance abuse treatment, it couldn't and wouldn't have been mentioned."

Wrong. If you can show me anything whatsoever affirming that he was in drug rehab, I'll concede the entire argument to you. Until then, please consider that:


I do not have confidence in my ability to read legal jargon and can't say with certainty what that quote means, and unless you passed the bar, I don't have confidence that you can either. When I don't know something, I go to an expert. A lawyer with decades of experience told me this meant he was treated for substance abuse. I will take his word over yours. But am glad you seem to be back inspector :)

So based on that I should accept that it's a "fact" that CPH had a substance abuse problem? Why don't you ask your expert again, and this time, be sure to include the lawsuit citation that I provided. A criminal prosecutor might not be familiar with civil practice law rules. Your expert wouldn't provide legal advice in say a bankruptcy or a contracts case, or a malpractice lawsuit for that matter, but rather would provide a reference to a competent attorney that practiced that particular type of law. This is normal for lawyers. I'm not trying to disparage your expert. I'm quite sure that they are competent in their field.

The reason I ask you to include the lawsuit citation when you double-check with your source is because this is definitely a law citation that the judge in CPH's particular case, Honorable Jonas, would be aware of. I know this because the same exact judge ruled against the plaintiff in the same exact case on the same exact issue just a few months prior (see the decision dated April 19, 2001). Yes Truthspider, I actually went to the online court case at and read all the way through all of the available documents, which I am able to understand in their entirety.

In the April 19th motion:

"The defendant, Long Beach Medical Center, herein requests, pursuant to CPLR $3101(a) and $3124, that the Court direct plaintiff to provide authorizations for it to obtain the infant's psychiatric and counseling records from the organization known as Families of Alcoholic Counseling and Treatment Services Center (FACTS). Available medical records show that NXXX CXXX lives in a home that was extensively involved with alcohol and drugs, witnessed frightening threats between parents, and saw his father removed from the house in handcuffs by police. Dr. Andrew Kent noted the infant CXXXXX situation to be complicated by several factors including a likely genetic predisposition to substance abuse coupled with other factors that possibly had a significant influence on the infant's condition."

...Pursuant to CPLR $3121, a party who places his mental condition in controversy may be compelled to provide written authorizations for the discovery of relevant records...

...Defendant's motion for disclosure of existing psychiatric records and reports and psychological counseling reports from Families of Alcoholic Counseling and Treatment Services Center is granted pursuant to CPLR 3101(a)....

From the September 28, 2001 Motion:

"Plaintiffs proof in this case is insufficient to satisfy its initial burden of demonstrating that Dr. Hackett ’s medical condition at the time of the alleged malpractice is in controversy."

In other words Truthspider, there was no credible or reasonable evidence furnished in this case by the plaintiff relative to substance abuse by CPH, or it (the discovery motion) would almost certainly have been granted by the judge. Judges are fairly lenient with discovery motions in civil cases like this. I'm sorry if this disappoints you, Truth, but that's just what all this "legal jargon" means.
 
<modsnip>

MSM reported CPH was the last to see SG "looking both sick and distressed"


"Gilbert, a prostitute from Jersey City, was last seen in May by Long Island doctor Peter Hackett, who said he saw Gilbert running at night near Oak Beach, looking both sick and distressed. “These people need closure and we need to find this girl if she is alive,” he said.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/04...ch-for-bodies-off-l-i-in-serial-killer-probe/




Then MSM reported that he denied ever calling the family:

"Hackett, who has done police and EMS work in the past, has denied ever calling or meeting Gilbert."

http://nymag.com/news/features/long-island-serial-killer-families-2011-6/


Then MSM reported (as did he himself) that he DID call the family.
(see 48 hours transcript)


<modsnip>

I've emailed WINS reporter Mona Rivera to see if she can clarify the CBSlocal "sick & distressed" report...
 
Wow, I just got off the phone with a friend of mine. He has a coworker who he tells me crazy stories about from time to time. We always joke that this guy is so messed up that he could indeed be the serial killer.

Well, tonight I started asking my friend to tell me more about this guy. So he tells me a little personal information about the guy. One of the things he tells me would put the guy in the area of Oak Beach on a weekly basis. So I keep digging. Then he tells me that the guy is a reservist. So I asked when the last time he was deployed and he said that he was deployed about 2-3 years ago. So I start thinking that this could explain the cool-down period in 2008: A reservist deployed in Iraq or Afghanistan in 2008. Interesting for sure!
 
I've emailed WINS reporter Mona Rivera to see if she can clarify the CBSlocal "sick & distressed" report...

Thanks MrsPC, I was just about to e-mail the NY Mag article that Truthspider was using as documentation that CPH denied Hackett ever called "the family", but I realized that there is no clarification needed. When the author states: "New York has not been able to confirm this; Hackett, who has done police and EMS work in the past, has denied ever calling or meeting Gilbert."

The author is talking about Shannan, not Mari. Huge difference.
 
Thanks MrsPC, I was just about to e-mail the NY Mag article that Truthspider was using as documentation that CPH denied Hackett ever called "the family", but I realized that there is no clarification needed. When the author states: "New York has not been able to confirm this; Hackett, who has done police and EMS work in the past, has denied ever calling or meeting Gilbert."

The author is talking about Shannan, not Mari. Huge difference.

To the best of my knowledge, no one has ever suggested that Hackett called Shannan. So the logic in the assumption that the question was in reference to Shannan, and not Mari, completely escapes me. JMO
 
Wow, I just got off the phone with a friend of mine. He has a coworker who he tells me crazy stories about from time to time. We always joke that this guy is so messed up that he could indeed be the serial killer.

Well, tonight I started asking my friend to tell me more about this guy. So he tells me a little personal information about the guy. One of the things he tells me would put the guy in the area of Oak Beach on a weekly basis. So I keep digging. Then he tells me that the guy is a reservist. So I asked when the last time he was deployed and he said that he was deployed about 2-3 years ago. So I start thinking that this could explain the cool-down period in 2008: A reservist deployed in Iraq or Afghanistan in 2008. Interesting for sure!

goathairjones, FWIW, a person in the military is in the top five on my list of possible suspects. The reason is because of the dates the GB4 disappeared, all between Memorial Day and Labor Day. It just makes me think of someone on 'leave' for the holiday. IMO, this SK may have training in communications, recon/stealth to pull off these brutal murders. Also worth noting is that the first 2 girls, MBB and MB disappeared during a 'holiday period' but in different years....2007 and 2009 respectively. But no activity in 2008 makes me suspicous. Of course, if he was deployed somewhere else how would we ever know there was a victim in 2008?

What types of life changes would cause a serial offender to cease for a brief period of time and start up again? (Because we know the only thing that really stops them is either death or incarceration. Regardless if they are serial stabbers, rapists or murderers.)

Marriage.....Birth of a child.....travel.....opening a business?

The lack of a victim in 2008 may be a very important clue.

Do you know (or can you tell us) if this person is in the CG reserve? I ask because of the other serial killings along the east coast (AC/FL) and the CG may stop at ports in those areas. (I feel sure they do since they police all US waters) Heck, our CG cutter moors at the Riverwalk (not the state port)which is a short walk to the downtown bars!

BTW everyone, I have a long list of occupations who may be suspects based on the facts that we know. I am not ruling anyone out at this time. I just think we should be exploring all options!

MOO

wm
 
To the best of my knowledge, no one has ever suggested that Hackett called Shannan. So the logic in the assumption that the question was in reference to Shannan, and not Mari, completely escapes me. JMO

You right, MK, the author should have been specific here. He should have been specific and said if he had denied ever calling Mari or Shannan. Instead, the author uses the word "Gilbert."

I assume (interpret) that the quote was in reference to Shannan because CPH has always denied meeting Shannan (less the flaky "sick and distressed" CBS Local article, which we will discount for the moment). He never denied meeting Mari. In fact he admitted he met Mari on Mother's Day. So when this author, who was pretty thorough otherwise, says that he denied "calling or meeting" Gilbert, he absolutely, incontrovertibly meant Shannan. If the author had said that CPH denied ever "calling or meeting" Mari, we would all have said "Whoa there, here's his 48 Hours letter where he admits he "met" Mari!" It would be a huge mistake. So that's the logic in my assumption. Sorry if I didn't elaborate!

So, has CPH ever denied "calling" Shannan? Probably not specifically. It's just a very minor writing/editorial mistake on behalf of the author, but a mistake that might be easily misinterpreted as it was here.
 
You right, MK, the author should have been specific here. He should have been specific and said if he had denied ever calling Mari or Shannan. Instead, the author uses the word "Gilbert."

I assume (interpret) that the quote was in reference to Shannan because CPH has always denied meeting Shannan (less the flaky "sick and distressed" CBS Local article, which we will discount for the moment). He never denied meeting Mari. In fact he admitted he met Mari on Mother's Day. So when this author, who was pretty thorough otherwise, says that he denied "calling or meeting" Gilbert, he absolutely, incontrovertibly meant Shannan. If the author had said that CPH denied ever "calling or meeting" Mari, we would all have said "Whoa there, here's his 48 Hours letter where he admits he "met" Mari!" It would be a huge mistake. So that's the logic in my assumption. Sorry if I didn't elaborate!

So, has CPH ever denied "calling" Shannan? Probably not specifically. It's just a very minor writing/editorial mistake on behalf of the author, but a mistake that might be easily misinterpreted as it was here.

So is this also a writing/editorial mistake?

Gilbert's mother says she received a strange phone call from him the day after her daughter disappeared.

"He called me on the phone. He said he had a halfway house and that Shannon was there," she said. "She wanted to be off the streets and he was trying to help her."

Dr. Hackett denies calling Gilbert's mother, and police have not named any suspects in the case so far.


http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news/local/long_island&id=8069901

And here's one from NYPost:

Missing escort Shannan Gilbert&#8217;s mother, Mari Gilbert, told cops someone saying they were Hackett called her after her daughter vanished last May and said she was with him and that she was OK.

Hackett has denied making the call.


http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/...chnology_a4HyUDmIa03bCsUpH250xJ#ixzz1ZvRlmx9t

And here's one from Newday:

Mari Gilbert said Hackett asked her to have Shannan call him. "I said, 'Fine, I will.' Then he hung up," Gilbert said Sunday.

Until Sunday, Hackett had denied to Newsday and others that he called Mari Gilbert. He first confirmed the call to "48 Hours Mystery," but he denied Mari Gilbert's account of what was said.


http://www.newsday.com/news/breaking/suffolk-commish-progress-in-gilgo-probe-1.3016807

I could list several more, but it's really not neccesary. The claim has been verified, imo.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Staff online

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
182
Guests online
1,742
Total visitors
1,924

Forum statistics

Threads
605,672
Messages
18,190,654
Members
233,492
Latest member
edlynch
Back
Top