WA WA - Sky Metalwala, 2, Bellevue, 6 Nov 2011 - # 6

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ClassyT said:
Where is Estgate Park and what is that building behind them? IMG_0767 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
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Find Bellevue Parks and Facilities

Eastgate Park
Address: 14500 SE Newport Way

Hours: Dawn to dusk
Amenities: Ballfield, play area, trails, picnic tables, benches and tennis courts.

South Bellevue Community Center

Directions: From I-90 East to exit 11 towards Spokane; turn right on 150th Avenue SE; turn right onto SE Newport Way; and the Park is on your left side (south).

From I-90 West; take I-90 to exit 11and merge left onto 150th Avenue SE; turn right at SE Newport Way; the Park is on your left side (south).

Contact Information
Parks & Community Services

450 110th Ave. NE
P.O. Box 90012
Bellevue, WA 98009
Phone: 425-452-6885
Fax: 425-452-7221

This park is off i90 which is the main route to Issaquah where her mother lives. Also,I am not certain how long NB has lived in Issaquah. But,we know JB went to Bellevue High School. Some portions of Issaquah are in the Bellevue School Dristrict. Also,the building is rest rooms.
 
Zuckerschnecke said:
Here are questions I would love to know, and maybe some of you can help me out as I didn't see it answered anywhere. How did Mom contact the friend, via pay phone or what? And did she make any stops before 'the car broke down?', a stop the daughter could speak to

I think the coincidence with the Law and Order episode is too compelling to ignore. I think she did something to Sky after watching that episode and either took him deceased into the car but then how did he turn up missing? Was this blanket still in the car? Was he even wrapped in the blanket or just the mother told the little girl that he was in the blanket? Did the little girl sit in the front seat and not see that her brother was not really there? Did the mom dispose (hate saying this word over a beautiful baby) of him while leaving the little girl home for some time? Did she do it while she was sleeping on Saturday night?

I think the little girl holds a lot of information to all this, unfortunately.

The mom telling the dad about her dream of strangulation is like a warning to him that she's having these thoughts. When did this dream occur? I guess if she was committed before and showed signs of instability, wouldn't the Dad want to do something more to protect his kids? The more I think about it, I think the Dad trusted her to no end, and probably trusted that it was okay to leave the baby in the car back when that happened. I'm not saying he's right, it's a horribly stupid thing to do, but he may have just given in and thought she knew best because she's in his eyes, a good mother to his children. The dream would have been a wake up call for me though. That screams reaching out for help.

My daughter's father and I have been divorced for a few years now and god forbid something happened to her, we would post a united front for her sake. And believe me, when we first separated, my ex moved back to Europe and I was left alone, unemployed caring for a 1 and a half year old. There were times, I'm ashamed to say, when I thought it would be easier to not have a child involved in that mess. But I never would have hurt her or done something to 'get even' with her father, as much as I hated him then. It's a very hard situation, and I think some people simply can't cope and they sink to the depths of despair to alleviate their burdens, such as the case with child killer CA. These two parents are now suddenly strangers. And the mother not speaking out and refusing the lie detector test only says she's pleading the fifth until charges are brought. And speaking of that, why isn't she arrested for leaving the kid in the car and leaving them home alone? They need to get her in custody because I think that's the only was she's gonna talk. And for god's sake don't let her at the girl. She was probably next on the list.
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Wow! Lots of good insight!
Gets me thinking!
I had thought about the "It Takes Two to Tango" aspect of BOTH PARENTS leaving Sky in the car in freezing weather. Therefore, could there be more incidents like this one that we don't know about?
This response does not AT ALL take away the evident negligence and abuse committed by the mom!
 
gitana1 said:
Okay, according to Freud, the process of socialization, of becoming a human, entails a repression of many primal instincts, like blood lust, etc. Hence, (according to this philosophical theorist named Kristeva) such primal urges, or any behavior outside of what constitutes a socialized identity, is "abject" or viewed as a disturbance of identity, of our very identities and is very psychologically shocking and upsetting. It reminds us, as a species, that we were once not socialized and it reminds of us own fragile tether to our socialized identity. It upsets our perception of the world we inhabit.

So we have a social construct of what "mother" means - nurturing, protective, loving, soft. We created that as a society, because in the animal world of which we are a part, while mothers have a biological urge to protect and nurture, there is also evidence of some despicable behavior, like murder, eating one's own young etc. But as socialized individuals, those destructive, baser instincts are not recognized.

Then, when someone comes along and acts in a manner that is outside the socialized identity, it horrifies us and causes "abjection", the feeling that what we are viewing is something between a subject and an object. That is outside of our symbolic order and thus traumatic because it reminds us that the social order is tenuous.

I think this is what social theorists would say is the reason that it is so hard to accept that a mother would ever purposefully destroy her own, precious and until now, apparently well cared for child.

It's easier to accept such a thing when it occurs among people we already have abjectified, such as the very poor, or drug addicts or people from "some other culture" who do those things because they are not as human as we are.

But not one of us. It's too traumatic to accept. Because if it can happen to one of us it can happen to "me" as well. That's not necessarily true, it can't happen to any one of us (IMO), but I think that's the underlying fear surrounding some of the reluctance to accept outright murder of a child by his own mommy.
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Its really sad but its true. I used to nanny for my Uncle and his wife who were foster parents, as a teenager. It was so eye opening. Children in foster care are almost never happy healthy well adjusted kids. Thats why they are there. It broke my heart to hear these poor kids cry for a mother who abused them so much. They would cry themselves to sleep for their mamas. One boy saw his mom kill his dad in front of him. The other had scars all over his body from cigarette burns. The kids were in such bad shape but it did not change the love and longing for their mom. It was still their mom. You cant fix that for them. You can just be there. Moms hurt kids and they can still tell you they love him with all their heart.

I dont think money has much to do with it. I think its mental illness. Of course impoverished people cant get medical help so they self medicate. Their parents were likely similar and its a vicious cycle. Of course, that is just what I have experienced.
 
chgokim said:
I fixed the link in my original post - here is another...

http://images.bimedia.net/documents/Decl+of+Solomon+Metalwala.pdf
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I'm not even half-way through, and all I can say is OMG. Those who noticed that she had a different relationship with M were spot on. SM himself states, "Julia has developed an unusual bond with our daughter."

Interestingly, Overlake Hospital (where she was supposedly taking Sky) is the hospital she went to for her psychiatric treatment. ETA: At least initially, she went there. She was subsequently transferred to a different hospital when she was voluntarily committed.
 
IHAVENOCLUE said:
Wow! Lots of good insight!
Gets me thinking!
I had thought about the "It Takes Two to Tango" aspect of BOTH PARENTS leaving Sky in the car in freezing weather. Therefore, could there be more incidents like this one that we don't know about?
This response does not AT ALL take away the evident negligence and abuse committed by the mom!
Click to expand...

Oh totally, and even if she does ultimately plead mental insanity etc, I still think this was in some way planned or thought about. I thought about her family being able to orchestrate the kids being flown to another country but it seems really far-fetched because both kids being gone would really leave the mom holding the bag. She'd be in deep doo-doo. On the other hand, I wonder if she did only send the one child away since his disappearance would hurt the dad the most and she could easily stage the situation as a kidnapping.

Did they test her car for decomp?
 
I am not a mental health expert, just keen on human behaviors...

Her symptoms appeared just after the birth of Sky. Was Postpartum Psychosis ever considered? Mania is a symptom, overwhelming thoughts of hurting the kids, delusion. It would explain a lot about some of the events. It explains her not bonding with Sky and why she felt closer to M.

Any pros on board? Am I too far off? I have said from the beginning something must have happened right after birth because that arent connected as her and daughter. Thoughts?
 
I'm thinking that the apartment complex was not aware that both of the kids lived with JB full time. Looking at the photos on flicker of the apartment it appears that the living room area was used as the kids playroom/bedroom. There is a box spring and mattress on the floor with sheets on it in a couple of pictures and then it is up against the wall in other pictures. This tells me that they lived in a one bedroom apartment. You can see that the kitchen is in the same open area as the bed on the floor is. I'm not sure what the laws are for the number of people allowed to to be in a rented home/apartment compared to the number of bedrooms but here in SC you can only have 2 people per bedroom. In other words, mother and two kids would have to have a 2 bedroom apartment. Perhaps when JB moved in to the apartment she told them on the application that the kids stayed with her overnight on visits.

MOO
 
Okay, just finished the declaration and all I can say is that it left me feeling very, very sad. SM knew she was dangerous and might even possibly hurt the kids. It seems he tried everything under the sun to be cooperative.

I just don't understand how she got full custody of those kids.
 
TorisMom003 said:
I'm thinking that the apartment complex was not aware that both of the kids lived with JB full time. Looking at the photos on flicker of the apartment it appears that the living room area was used as the kids playroom/bedroom. There is a box spring and mattress on the floor with sheets on it in a couple of pictures and then it is up against the wall in other pictures. This tells me that they lived in a one bedroom apartment. You can see that the kitchen is in the same open area as the bed on the floor is. I'm not sure what the laws are for the number of people allowed to to be in a rented home/apartment compared to the number of bedrooms but here in SC you can only have 2 people per bedroom. In other words, mother and two kids would have to have a 2 bedroom apartment. Perhaps when JB moved in to the apartment she told them on the application that the kids stayed with her overnight on visits.

MOO
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That may be the truth, but in the documents posted in the link below, her OCD was allegedly so bad that she wouldn't let anyone sleep on the bed - they all had to sleep on the floor. She wanted the bedroom to be perfect.

Same as the pictures - she took so many repetitious photos b/c she wanted a perfect one. MOO

chgokim said:
I fixed the link in my original post - here is another...

http://images.bimedia.net/documents/Decl+of+Solomon+Metalwala.pdf
Click to expand...
 
Actually with the pictures, if you look closely alot of them have been placed on flicker twice. If you go through and look at all of them you can notice that she takes a set of pictures, puts them on flicker, then later on puts them on flicker again.

There was mention by someone (sorry I can't remember who now) that the kids end up in the tub. Actually I don't recall any of Sky being in the tub, only M. Sky is outside of the tub looking in at M but is not in the tub with M.

The pool photos that show M in just the bathing suit bottoms and Sky in shorts and t-shirt appear to me that Sky was an afterthought (again). Those photos appear to be at a hotel as there are other photos of Sky in the same clothes in the hotel room. I would guess that JB took M down to the pool while Sky was taking a nap or something in the room with the silver haired man. The man and Sky more than likely went to the pool area at some point later and Sky wanted in the pool because M was in it. Sky didn't have on the correct clothes for the pool but went in anyway.

MOO
 
TorisMom003 said:
I'm thinking that the apartment complex was not aware that both of the kids lived with JB full time. Looking at the photos on flicker of the apartment it appears that the living room area was used as the kids playroom/bedroom. There is a box spring and mattress on the floor with sheets on it in a couple of pictures and then it is up against the wall in other pictures. This tells me that they lived in a one bedroom apartment. You can see that the kitchen is in the same open area as the bed on the floor is. I'm not sure what the laws are for the number of people allowed to to be in a rented home/apartment compared to the number of bedrooms but here in SC you can only have 2 people per bedroom. In other words, mother and two kids would have to have a 2 bedroom apartment. Perhaps when JB moved in to the apartment she told them on the application that the kids stayed with her overnight on visits.

MOO
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If you read the father's declaration, she had issues with bedrooms being the perfect place. Just because she might have made kids to sleep in the living room doesn't mean the apartment only had one bedroom.
 
Another interesting thing to note is SM's characterization of JB and her mother's relationship as love/hate and on again/off again....that JB would lash out at her mother verbally, etc.
 
ClassyT said:
I am not a mental health expert, just keen on human behaviors...

Her symptoms appeared just after the birth of Sky. Was Postpartum Psychosis
ever considered? Mania is a symptom, overwhelming thoughts of hurting the kids, delusion. It would explain a lot about some of the events. It explains her not bonding with Sky and why she felt closer to M.

Any pros on board? Am I too far off? I have said from the beginning something must have happened right after birth because that arent connected as her and daughter. Thoughts?
Click to expand...


I bookmarked this on my iPad. Unfortunately I did not reference the post #.
This is a post by Rougelatete which were so well spoken I bookmarked them.



Sent from my iPad post from Rougelatete,
Thoughts of harming your child are not really consistent with an OCD diagnosis. Ruminating -- i.e., having FEAR-based thoughts running over and over in your mind -- about FEARING that you might harm your child (inadvertently), might be consistent with OCD, but not necessarily. Thoughts, no. Fears, maybe. OCD is an anxiety disorder. It has to do with anxiety, fear, apprehension, worry etc. -- often about things that are outside your control (i.e. your baby suddenly dying) so you try to control everything else in your environment (i.e. cleaning the fridge, washing your hands, etc).

That said, thoughts of harming your child WOULD be consistent with the fact that JB was involuntarily committed to a psychiatric institution. To be Section 12'ed, you have to be a clear potential harm to yourself and/or other/s. That may be the reason she was sectioned.
 
There is no furniture in the apartment living room at all though. There are toys, lots of toys on the floor, but no furniture and no tv. It just doesn't appear to be someplace that they gathered together except for the kids to play and sleep. This is vastly different from the home that JB and SM shared before.

I'm not so sure that I believe everything that SM placed in that declaration. He was trying to get custody of his children or at least get visitation. I have a difficult time believing that he told the entire truth without adding somethings to it to strenghten his own case. I may be wrong, but I don't believe her OCD is/was as strong as he is claiming.

MOO
 
jjenny said:
If you read the father's declaration, she had issues with bedrooms being the perfect place. Just because she might have made kids to sleep in the living room doesn't mean the apartment only had one bedroom.
Click to expand...

And that why there are photos of kids bouncing and playing in the bed. Every photo WAS staged. Every detail planned. Twisted.
 
TorisMom003 said:
There is no furniture in the apartment living room at all though. There are toys, lots of toys on the floor, but no furniture and no tv. It just doesn't appear to be someplace that they gathered together except for the kids to play and sleep. This is vastly different from the home that JB and SM shared before.

I'm not so sure that I believe everything that SM placed in that declaration. He was trying to get custody of his children or at least get visitation. I have a difficult time believing that he told the entire truth without adding somethings to it to strenghten his own case. I may be wrong, but I don't believe her OCD is/was as strong as he is claiming.

MOO
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In the pictures of the 2 kids on the carpet, one can see the perfect vacuum lines he describes.
 
TorisMom003 said:
There is no furniture in the apartment living room at all though. There are toys, lots of toys on the floor, but no furniture and no tv. It just doesn't appear to be someplace that they gathered together except for the kids to play and sleep. This is vastly different from the home that JB and SM shared before.

I'm not so sure that I believe everything that SM placed in that declaration. He was trying to get custody of his children or at least get visitation. I have a difficult time believing that he told the entire truth without adding somethings to it to strenghten his own case. I may be wrong, but I don't believe her OCD is/was as strong as he is claiming.

MOO
Click to expand...

I think the photos we see were taken in a hotel room, not an apartment.
 
ClassyT said:
And how strange that the conflict came on Christmas Day....looks like someone didn't get what she wanted for Christmas. Money is the key there.

I am not saying it couldn't happen but it seems improbable.
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The fact it was Christmas Day wouldn't seem unusual to me because I learned from classes during my dad's recovery that the holidays are always huge stressors for anyone with alcoholism or depression.

But it does seem very odd to me that he would suddenly (allegedly) do this after so many years of marriage.

I haven't seen the photos, but it also struck me as odd you said the photos that day were Christmas afternoon and not morning. Everyone I knew growing up opened gifts Christmas morning and that's when you'd usually take the pictures. Of course, that whole scene could be pretty messy for someone with severe OCD....
 
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