NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #12

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rosemary said:
Btw, why didn't Shannan wait for the police to arrive when she asked the neighbor for help? what made her decide to run off again into the darkness and why didn't she bother to hide in the neighbor's house instead? i'm also curious why, if Shannan had been a victim of the LISK, he chose to dump her body in the marsh rather than his usual dumping ground?
Click to expand...

This is why I lean towards the drugs/ bipolar having a lot to do with her reactions. She didn't trust anyone and I would think the 911 operator would have told her to go to a neighbors house.

Its really the only answer I can think of for why she would:

Say people are trying to kill her
Run from her driver
Run from neighbors
Not sit tight and hide
Possibly run into a marsh
 
Redbird said:
Thinking outside the box, has it ever crossed your mind there is no serial killer? Since the sex trafficking bust last week they sure are pushing the one killer theory now. What if there is only a sex trafficking ring that has been running through the strip clubs and the Holiday Inn Express in Hauppage for fifteen years or longer, aided by police corruption and Shannan and her family are too close to exposing all of it. What if the victims are women who got out of line and became a liability. What if Shannan was terrified because she didn't have the money she was supposed to bring back to Pak? Does this sound crazy? By now there should be someone that escaped the SK and come forward. The OB gang, as Fluke calls them sure are afraid of somebody.
Click to expand...

That theory has been discussed also. I think there are some weird things about the body placement and treatment that made these murders seem more like a SK than a hit.
 
Would someone clarify "marsh" for me, please? Is that tall, reed-like grass over really thick mud for the most part......the kind that you stick your foot in and it keeps your shoe when you try to pull your foot out?
 
Kaytom, that is what I think! If she did some social drugs with her client JB, she might have had a bad interatction with drugs she was on for her bi-polar disorder.
JMO, but I think she wasn't a victim of the SK.
I would love to see Mari Gilberts phone records of the call she received, to verify it.
She may have become totally disoriented and ran into the marshy area, which is like a swamp, and fell, possibly hit her head on a rock and was knocked out and drowned.
I wouldn't set my toe in those areas at the beach! Crabs and muck up to your knees!
 
rosemary said:
i'm also curious why, if Shannan had been a victim of the LISK, he chose to dump her body in the marsh rather than his usual dumping ground?
Click to expand...
<rsbm>

Because SG's 911 call is the one big factor that could connect the individuals involved (i.e. MP, JB, and CPH?) to a host of victims. If her body had been found together with the other victims, then all victims could be tied to the individuals that SG was with at the time. At this point, SG is still a missing person, and even if she is eventually found deceased, they can't make that definitive connection to the other victims.
 
minazoe said:
If the area is swamp or marsh...how on earth could Shannan float far from her clothes and become detached from her things when there is so much plant life there? I call BS.
Click to expand...

Agreed, her purse would certainly float, however, if what they are saying is true, her boots and body got stuck in the mud and swamp, it stands to reason her body would be found near her boots. Now people will say things float, get carried etc...but her purse certainly didn't float all that far in a year and a half, same with her boots.

Someone -either Dormer or FBI- is leaving things out or purposely being misleading, it literally makes no sense. And the wording of Dormer "wandered aimlessly" strikes me as either very, very insensitive or carefully crafted. And I'm willing to bet that despite what Dormer said, either a tip or some piece f info was recently received.

As for the mob angle, I don't discount it at all. However, the mob being responsible for 10 bodies I don't buy, simply because A)The mob will make sure you're never found, B) They have no interest in tormenting family members. With that said, it is quite possible they have detailed and accurate knowledge of things and people who may or may not be responsible.
 
Shutterfly said:
Would someone clarify "marsh" for me, please? Is that tall, reed-like grass over really thick mud for the most part......the kind that you stick your foot in and it keeps your shoe when you try to pull your foot out?
Click to expand...

Here is a phot I found on the net of "Oak Beach marsh"



http://farm1.static.flickr.com/139/329508864_1615bbd27a_o.jpg

It is from this website:

http://citybirder.blogspot.com/2006_12_01_archive.html

OBS; This is NOT from the actual area they are searching, as Sealug44 posted thise images are from:

"down the road a bit on the North side of Ocean Parkway near Oak Island."

Thanks Seaslug.
 
ItalinBella27 said:
I would love to see Mari Gilberts phone records of the call she received, to verify it.
She may have become totally disoriented and ran into the marshy area, which is like a swamp, and fell, possibly hit her head on a rock and was knocked out and drowned.
I wouldn't set my toe in those areas at the beach! Crabs and muck up to your knees!
Click to expand...
<rsbm>

Conversely, why wouldn't you want to see CPH's phone records to see if they jive with what he claims?

Given the "knocked out and drowned" scenario, how would you explain items of clothing being separated from any potential remains, and the clothing and other personal effects being located with no human remains found in proximity to those items? Even with Hurricane Irene having blitzed through, surely this would not result in human remains being somehow neatly separated from clothing, but totally separated from the personal items that got nicely picked up and plopped in the same area.
 
Redbird said:
Thinking outside the box, has it ever crossed your mind there is no serial killer? Since the sex trafficking bust last week they sure are pushing the one killer theory now. What if there is only a sex trafficking ring that has been running through the strip clubs and the Holiday Inn Express in Hauppage for fifteen years or longer, aided by police corruption and Shannan and her family are too close to exposing all of it. What if the victims are women who got out of line and became a liability. What if Shannan was terrified because she didn't have the money she was supposed to bring back to Pak? Does this sound crazy? By now there should be someone that escaped the SK and come forward. The OB gang, as Fluke calls them sure are afraid of somebody.
Click to expand...

THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This has been my hunch from the very beginning. All of the writing is on the wall..

  1. At least two of the GB4 worked as strippers.
  2. We have the sister of one of the victims stating that someone at the strip club where she was dancing approached her and encouraged her to earn more money boy working "the party". This, in turn, led to her being pimped out as a prostitute at those "parties" and then eventually through Craiglist.
  3. Strip clubs are a known mob-run industry.
  4. Testimony & convictions exist on Long Island and NYC for mob associates recruiting their dancers to be prostitutes. All of it starts with asking them to work the special parties like the high-stakes poker games.
  5. Mob members have been convicted on Long Island & NYC for running prostitution rings advertising on Craigslist.
  6. SG's driver, MP has a human trafficking conviction for attempting to sneak an illegal immigrant into the country.
  7. Last week's arrests show how the mob is active in the human trafficking business and is actively seeking to bring in immigrants to first work as strippers at their clubs (and as previously mentioned, prior testimony of mob members confirms that they actively recruit their dancers to work for them as prostitutes).
  8. One of the clubs linked to last week's arrest is five minutes away (one or two exits down the expressway) from the Holiday Inn Express where two of the GB4 operated from.
  9. Another one of the strip clubs named in last week's arrest is located in midtown Manhattan, five minutes away from Times Square, the Port Authority, Penn Station & the train stop where SG arrives in NYC.
  10. The rest of the strip clubs linked to the case have not been announced but I think it will be no surprise if one of them is the club located in West Islip or the club located in West Babylon (which are both five minutes away from ALC's home) as well as a certain strip club in the Bronx which is also located five minutes away from where a GB4 victim was last seen alive.
  11. If you include the bodies of the two hispanic male victims that were found in Manorville at the same time as the women's bodies were found in the same stretch of woods (I still don't know why the police refuse to even acknowledge that these unidentified victims exist & could be related), you actually have three men, eight women (nine if you include SG), and a child all found dead on two concentrated area but with different MO's, cause of deaths, & years of deaths. It is more likely that two makeshift graveyards were utilized by multiple members of a crime organization then it is to think that one mastermind SK "evolved". Let's not also forget the discovery of large quantities of dead roosters in that same Manorville area (suggestive of someone discarding the casualties of organized *advertiser censored*-fighting).
  12. There has been a noticeable lack of police cooperation (as we heard from each of the GB4 victim's families). Many of you even suggested that in your minds it appears almost as if there is some sort of police cover-up going on.
  13. Some of the people named in last week's mob arrest (as well as in some previous organized-crime arrests) have direct ties to residences within Oak Beach as well as Gilgo Beach communities.
  14. The A&E special made it clear to us that many of the victims worked with "Agencies". Past convictions & testimonies associated with the busts of former agencies in the Long Island & NYC area show direct ties to both Italian & Russian mobs). Last week's sex trafficking arrests included members of both Italian & Russian mobs too.
  15. It has been a mystery as to why two of the victims would feel comfortable enough to honor the request to leave their cell phones behind. What if they knew that they were going to a party or poker game where there would be a few VIP's present who do not want to risk having their photo taken?
 
waltzingmatilda said:
NJGuy, I really don't know what to think but something does seem off to me. In addition to the special that aired on Tuesday, we are two days away from the 1 year anniversary of the discovery of the first body on GB.

Where is Shannan? <modsnip> MOO

wm
Click to expand...
Hi WM, <modsnip>

Also, Do you think it odd LE would use the word 'shoes' if what they really found was her boots? Here people would call boots, boots and not shoes. She'd have a hard time running in strappy sandals.
 
NJGuy said:
Agreed, her purse would certainly float, however, if what they are saying is true, her boots and body got stuck in the mud and swamp, it stands to reason her body would be found near her boots. Now people will say things float, get carried etc...but her purse certainly didn't float all that far in a year and a half, same with her boots.

Someone -either Dormer or FBI- is leaving things out or purposely being misleading, it literally makes no sense. And the wording of Dormer "wandered aimlessly" strikes me as either very, very insensitive or carefully crafted. And I'm willing to bet that despite what Dormer said, either a tip or some piece f info was recently received.

As for the mob angle, I don't discount it at all. However, the mob being responsible for 10 bodies I don't buy, simply because A)The mob will make sure you're never found, B) They have no interest in tormenting family members. With that said, it is quite possible they have detailed and accurate knowledge of things and people who may or may not be responsible.
Click to expand...

ITA with the bulk of what you've posted NJGuy, with the exception of the "mob will make sure you're never found". Could be the bodies were intended to ultimately be found en masse as a message to other prostitutes who didn't tow the line. (That's been a theory that's being considered re the dumping of bodies in the Edmonton SK cases up here in Alberta)
 
Theforeigner said:
Here is a phot I found on the net of "Oak Beach marsh"



http://farm1.static.flickr.com/139/329508864_1615bbd27a_o.jpg

It is from this website:

http://citybirder.blogspot.com/2006_12_01_archive.html
Click to expand...

That is not where they are searching. That is down the road a bit on the North side of Ocean Parkway near Oak Island. Please refer to my high-def photos thread to see the area being searched. It consists of trees, tall reeds and patches of open moss-covered earth. Tonight I will try to post a video or photos from the land.
 
why kill a hooker though? there are so many girls and plenty of johns...it seems like a huge waste and to top it, now you have a murder rap to look at.

in a territory dispute maybe...one pimp kills another pimps girl.

but it isn't like that anymore , is it?

again though, maybe there is some other reason, I feel like she was set up...it would explain her fear of MP.

but so would not getting paid or ripping off drugs from her client.

or she was lured there for some kind of game.
 
scandi said:
Hi WM, <modsnip>

Also, Do you think it odd LE would use the word 'shoes' if what they really found was her boots? Here people would call boots, boots and not shoes. She'd have a hard time running in strappy sandals.
Click to expand...

According to Newsday they found ballet flats. Sorry I can't post a link, I'm posting from my phone.
 
In this news video, from today, there are several images of the marsh area they are searching.

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/135243498.html

Search for Shannan Gilbert Resumes at Oak Beach Marsh
Authorities say they believe the missing woman may have drowned in the marsh after finding her jeans, shoes, purse and possibly cell phone there this week.

In the video it is said about Shannan:
"last seen in May 2010 running into the marsh from a clients nearby home"

My question is ; seen by WHOM EXACTLY???
 
Redbird said:
Thinking outside the box, has it ever crossed your mind there is no serial killer? Since the sex trafficking bust last week they sure are pushing the one killer theory now. What if there is only a sex trafficking ring that has been running through the strip clubs and the Holiday Inn Express in Hauppage for fifteen years or longer, aided by police corruption and Shannan and her family are too close to exposing all of it. What if the victims are women who got out of line and became a liability. What if Shannan was terrified because she didn't have the money she was supposed to bring back to Pak? Does this sound crazy? By now there should be someone that escaped the SK and come forward. The OB gang, as Fluke calls them sure are afraid of somebody.
Click to expand...
I thought there was an argument about the amount of money she received for the job. Maybe that was the trigger for whoever was at JB's house threatening and scaring the heck out of her to where she believed they would kill her as they said and she booked.

If she believed the elderly man {who might have been there as I read here} was involved with LE, maybe that is why every time someone she approached for help said they were going to call 911, she took off running.
 
Theforeigner said:
In this news video, from today, there are several images of the marsh area they are searching.

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/135243498.html

Search for Shannan Gilbert Resumes at Oak Beach Marsh
Authorities say they believe the missing woman may have drowned in the marsh after finding her jeans, shoes, purse and possibly cell phone there this week.

In the video it is said about Shannan:
"last seen in May 2010 running into the marsh from a clients nearby home"

My question is ; seen by WHOM EXACTLY???
Click to expand...

Yeah. Great reporting. Nobody's ever mentioned her running into the marsh until now. But since they think her belongings have been found it's "She was last seen running into the marsh!"

I think the SCPD may be intentionally giving mixed info for their own reasons, but then there's the media just plain getting things wrong due to incompetence.
 
Theforeigner said:
In this news video, from today, there are several images of the marsh area they are searching.

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/135243498.html

Search for Shannan Gilbert Resumes at Oak Beach Marsh
Authorities say they believe the missing woman may have drowned in the marsh after finding her jeans, shoes, purse and possibly cell phone there this week.

In the video it is said about Shannan:
"last seen in May 2010 running into the marsh from a clients nearby home"

My question is ; seen by WHOM EXACTLY???
Click to expand...

This might be your answer:

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/v...pp34jyyTtMQefJ

Snippet ~ '*advertiser censored* Canning, 20, who lives in the area, also recalled the last time he saw the woman.

"That was the last time she was seen. We saw her footprints in the sand. She was in a panic. We thought she was on drugs."


ETA: SORRY, The NY POST link worked yesterday !!! Trying again: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/victims_found_killer_joined_beach_j1Hp5kTApp34jyyTtMQefJ

This article was on Dec 15, 2010, so the info about the Canning's and their seeing her footprints has been out there for a year.

The Cannings live on Anchor Way across the street and down a bit from the Dr U who sold his house. Very near his house is where that 4x4 dirt road takes off Anchor Way }that Seaslug discovered} cutting diagonally across the marsh ending close to CPH's home. Where this road takes off Anchor Way it looks very sandy and could be where she went. Just a possibility.
 
sillybilly said:
<rsbm>

Conversely, why wouldn't you want to see CPH's phone records to see if they jive with what he claims?

Given the "knocked out and drowned" scenario, how would you explain items of clothing being separated from any potential remains, and the clothing and other personal effects being located with no human remains found in proximity to those items? Even with Hurricane Irene having blitzed through, surely this would not result in human remains being somehow neatly separated from clothing, but totally separated from the personal items that got nicely picked up and plopped in the same area.
Click to expand...


I absolutely would want to see CPH phone records! No question!
I'll be honest, I know what the marshy areas are like out there, quite frankly it's like quicksand! I wouldn't go in there under any circumstances, nor would I allow my children!
No, I don't think they will find her intact, she's been in the elements way too long. Skeletal remains fall apart, especially under those circumstances.
What concerns me first and formost is why didn't LE look there thouroughly in the first place? That area should have been looked at with a fine tooth comb. That was where she was seen last.
I saw a post by Mrs. G and I totally agree...why aren't they looking in Manorville! I understand the Pine Barrens would be quite an undertaking, but they really should try to crack this wide open!
 
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