17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #17

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tehcloser said:
So "John" sees this "fight" and GZ on the bottom yelling for help....and instead of "helping", he tells him to "STOP" and that he's calling 911.

Now, why would you tell the guy on the BOTTOM who was yelling for help tp stop? That does not make sense.
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I'd like to know the positions of their bodies. For instance, could they have both been on their backs with GZ on bottom while holding Tray on top while wrestling? I have assumed that they were face to face while on the ground but don't recall reading such.

The only thing I have read with specifics is that GZ was staddling Tray, who was face down on the ground after the shooting.

Just trying to think outside the box. I am waaaay behind as my computer is still :maddening:

MOO Tia, wm

morning all!
 
gator said:
I think this is a really good point. To me, the screams on the 911 tapes sound like someone who is absolutely terrified. Like someone who is looking down the barrel of a gun for 41 seconds, not just in a "scuffle."

JMO.
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JMO, I agree. You are stating exactly what I think, too. I believe Trayvon was stalked and terrorized in the moments before he was murdered. His screams tell the story. My heart aches for his parents.
 
cityslick said:
I still think he would of said something to the GF about the gun if he saw it. He was talking up until there was a push (who pushes someone who has a gun? Who has a gun out but yet pushes, did he push with one hand while holding the gun in another?)
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Also a good point. But I don't think GZ pulled the gun out at the last second either. I think it was trained on TM pretty early on in the confrontation. JMO.
 
LiveLaughLuv said:
Zimmerman's Arrest Should Be a Family Affair, Including His Father
Posted: 04/ 4/2012 1:30 pm


George Zimmerman, the man who instantly turned himself into public enemy number one, is an intriguing character for a multitude of reasons. When I read Zimmerman's story, he reminds me of one of my more "interesting" friends who had a similar story in his life. This person was also a wannabe police officer who lived with his parents, dropped out of college and took things way too seriously. There are few men more frightening than wannabe cops who failed the psychological tests.


more
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-boyce-watkins/george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin_b_1393761.html
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BBM.

Has it been stated and/or confirmed that GZ failed any psychological tests? IMO, that's a huge assumption for a writer to make. Is it even true? If not, shame on Dr. Boyce Watkins for making such a slanderous implication.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
 
gxm said:
BBM.

Has it been stated and/or confirmed that GZ failed any psychological tests? IMO, that's a huge assumption for a writer to make. Is it even true? If not, shame on Dr. Boyce Watkins for making such a slanderous implication.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
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gxm, the author was speaking of a personal acquaintance who reminded him of GZ.
 
gator said:
Also a good point. But I don't think GZ pulled the gun out at the last second either. I think it was trained on TM pretty early on in the confrontation. JMO.
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But how did they end up wrestling on the ground… was the gun out before or after the struggle on the ground?

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
 
Velouria said:
gxm, the author was speaking of a personal acquaintance who reminded him of GZ.
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Yes. Thus implying that GZ has also failed the psych tests. Dirty pool IMO.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
 
http://fcit.usf.edu/florida/lessons/tourism/tourism1.htm

Today, tourism is the most important factor driving Florida's economy. About forty million people visit Florida yearly. The money visitors spend in Florida supports many businesses. Amounting to over $40 billion dollars each year, tourism is the state's greatest source of income. As tourism continues to grow, so will Florida.
 
Gin said:
JMO, I agree. You are stating exactly what I think, too. I believe Trayvon was stalked and terrorized in the moments before he was murdered. His screams tell the story. My heart aches for his parents.
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If that's what happened that is incredibly horrific.

But I'm still trying to figure out how they ended up on the ground, was the gun out before they went down or after? IMO, based on the witness statement(s), at some point GZ was on the ground with TM over him. That's why I don't believe the gun came out until/after that point.

Either way my heart aches for his parents and for a young life cut terribly short.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
 
gxm said:
Yes. Thus implying that GZ has also failed the psych tests. Dirty pool IMO.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
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It is an opinion piece after all, not a straight news article. Had it been, then I could see your point.

IMO
 
I have mixed feelings regarding the SYG Law.
I DO see cases where the law is being "twisted", if you will.
I sure did NOT like it when we had a duty to retreat.
JMO
 
tehcloser said:
So "John" sees this "fight" and GZ on the bottom yelling for help....and instead of "helping", he tells him to "STOP" and that he's calling 911.

Now, why would you tell the guy on the BOTTOM who was yelling for help to stop? That does not make sense.
Click to expand...

and it was so light out he could see the guy on the bottom lips moving to know he was the one yelling for help but he could not see the guys face or Trayvon's hands or any part of his face to tell one was black and one was white.

Oh yeah and he saw the guy on bottom had a red sweater on which is very concerning since one of the people did have a sweater on but it was not red.

To me there appears to be a bit of tampering with that witness going on. ALL IMO
 
I don't see the SYG law and the CC permit as one in the same. When a state grants a permit for cc a person then has the right to do just that (carry the weapon concealed). Then the same state has a SYG law in place that means you are justified to defend yourself in your home. The issue is not the gun the issue is whether GZ killed TM in self defense. He could have had a knife. jmo
 
I just wanted to say that I find it extremely difficult to believe that George Zimmerman could have been getting the worst of it in a fight with Trayvon Martin. I find it extremely difficult to believe that George Martin could have been afraid of suffering great bodily harm from Trayvon Martin. I feel this so strongly for two reasons.

First, using the weights reported by both families Trayvon weighed between 140 and 145 pounds, and George Zimmerman weighed 190. Are these weights accurate? I don't know for sure, but the police report weights seem to be guesses so I am going to go with them. I suspect 190 is a little light for Zimmerman but I will go with it. These weight differences would put them 4 or 5 weight classes apart in professional boxing, and at least 4 weight classes apart in high school wrestling. The heavier fighter would never be allowed into the ring with the lighter because of the unfair advantage he would have.

Secondly, George Zimmerman is reported to have multiple years of experience as a bouncer/private security. This is not a field you survive in for months, let alone years, if you are easily frightened at the possibility of getting hit. This is not a field you last long in if you do not know how to fight, and more importantly, how to restrain someone who is trying to hurt you without hurting them. You must be able to face down and remove people who are drunk, belligerant and possibly way larger than you. I find it impossible to believe that anyone who spent years as a bouncer could be reduced to those wails of terror in less than two minutes by a skinny, unarmed kid he outweighed by forty or fifty pounds. Moo
 
Dr.Fessel said:
and it was so light out he could see the guy on the bottom lips moving to know he was the one yelling for help but he could not see the guys face or Trayvon's hands or any part of his face to tell one was black and one was white.

Oh yeah and he saw the guy on bottom had a red sweater on which is very concerning since one of the people did have a sweater on but it was not red.

To me there appears to be a bit of tampering with that witness going on. ALL IMO
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It could be though the difference in how witnesses describe things. For example... I wouldn't call it a sweater, I would call it a sweatshirt, my daughters call them jackets. It was dark so that could also explain the sweater discription.

Ima
 
LambChop said:
GZ worked as a bouncer. He knows how to handle people in a fight. jmo
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I also suspect he knows exactly what to do to render someone completely helpless too.... At this time I won't elaborate any further..JMHO
 
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