AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - # 8

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I thought that is a Shoe Pavilion or is the Google map wrong and it has changed? I am so confused and trying to keep straight what is located where. I know you are local and know the area but just want to confirm. Thanks!

Also, I need to get straight. The area where the five were walking and the lurker was, is an alley, right? Behind the Office Max? Was the command center in that alley/street or was it in front of the Office Max? I am confused.
 
Lark, just curious, and anyone else who is leaning towards suspecting the family, what are your motive theories?

I am not convinced because I can't come up with one. In other so far unsolved cases where the family is suspected, I "get" the motive, not to say there is ever a reasonable one, but there is usually drugs, alcohol, previous abuse, extreme obsessions with violence, etc... But I am open to hear theories.
 
I can post the image I posted at the start of the discussion of where the walkers were.

fivewalking.jpg
Thank you, Prof. The white building is the Office Max. Across the street from the "blue arrow", is where the command center (consisting of the TPD RV and tent, etc) were located. In the area behind the O.M. is where police cars were parked. I am having a very difficult time believing the video is of Saturday night. Where are the flashing lights from the cop cars?!
 
I thought that is a Shoe Pavilion or is the Google map wrong and it has changed? I am so confused and trying to keep straight what is located where. I know you are local and know the area but just want to confirm. Thanks!


It is no longer Show Pavilion. It is now Five Guys burger place, something like that. Office Max is still there.
 
From Smooth's transcription (BBM):

-TPD always told the parents to speak to media.. And it is absolutely inaccurate that we ever told them NOT TO SPEAK WITH MEDIA..

-Another reason we need the parents to speak with you.. A lot of questions can be cleared up and answered by the parents

(Family) working with us and answering some of our questions(stood out to me.. WHY SOME?)

Hoping they will speak to you so u can judge for yourself.. I can tell you they show a level of concern..

-Meet with both parents at the briefings.. Other individuals.. We will not comment on any others that are present at meetings..


Facinating what Pacheco says without really saying it. From this conversation, I gleen that the family does indeed already have representation and that they are attending LE meetings...that the family is only answering SOME of LE's questions...and that LE very, very much wants the family to talk to the media because then they will HAVE to answer questions or invoke the immortal words, "On the advice of our attorney, we can't talk about that..."

I would LOVE to see them on a media show. Among the first questions asked would likely be, "Have you taken a lie detector test?" And I betcha they'll answer, "On the advice of our attorney..." blah blah blah. I only hope that their interviewee doesn't agree to a statement only or agree to limited questions.

This has now become crystal clear to me. I don't know if their daughter's alive or dead, but no question in my mind now as to what is really going on here.

B/Underlined by me. And what is it you believe is going on? I agree with all that you have said here so far...
 
I think it is more likely the video was from a day before, not a day after.
 
I thought that is a Shoe Pavilion or is the Google map wrong and it has changed? I am so confused and trying to keep straight what is located where. I know you are local and know the area but just want to confirm. Thanks!

It was a Shoe Pavilion, now it is a Five Guys Burger. The Party City is between the Five Guys and Office Max.
 
Maybe the video was date/time stamped, but had the wrong date. It is a leap year; if the time isn't kept very accurate that could explain why it's a day behind. Not all surveillance video systems are automatically updated with the correct date and time (you'd think they are, but they aren't).

Doesn't explain the lack of LE/activity in the area, though.

You could be on to something....leap year would make today April 30th, show up as May 1st. When in fact because of the extra day, it's only the 30th.

But they said it's not time-stamped and I don't believe that. Even old VHS recorders were time-stamped and newer recording systems would be likely on a computer.

But you could be on to something if the time stamp on whatever recording device did not take into account leap year.....:waitasec:

What I want to know is HOW they at the 11th hour come to realize it's the wrong date? The eyewitness? The 5. Surely after they talked to the first guy (who supposedly self-identified as being there on the day we all thought!) could have set the record straight. I would know from Friday to Saturday what I was doing, especially only a week later!
 
Could Isabel's parents want compensation for media appearances? If they believe that there will be "demands" to be met to get their daughter back, maybe they would be more willing to appear on TV shows if they're paid (for photos, video, etc.). Just a thought... :moo:

I SERIOUSLY doubt that.
 
Could the mysterious 6th man have been law enforcement?

In the pic above, the police tape was wrapped around a tree just west of 4 squares of something, believe those are pallets like I saw, with a bunch of boxes, broken down and then bound into a huge bundle. I think the tape was strung across and attached somewhere on the Omax building...

btw someone asked where Party City building is, its not shown in this photo, is just out of view to the north, Five Guys burger joint is in north part of building, the rest is Party City...
 
Also, I need to get straight. The area where the five were walking and the lurker was, is an alley, right? Behind the Office Max? Was the command center in that alley/street or was it in front of the Office Max? I am confused.

The command center was in the parking lot on the northeast side of the Office Max.
 
I think it is more likely the video was from a day before, not a day after.

I totally agree. I think LE was given a video which was identified by the provider incorrectly as Fri nite/Sat AM. I also believe it was from before. I think it has since been identified as the wrong date, due to the persons in the video saying "no it wasn't Friday night it was xxxx", but Pacheco has been misinformed of the corrected ate.

I didn't hold as much stock in this video being the key to the case - just never felt it was going to pan into anything significant. At any rate, LE had to find and interview the people to find out it was the wrong date. And so it goes...
 
I think this is just more of the cat and mouse game LE is playing...this is not a mistake. MOO

There must be something very revealing on the ACTUAL tape from that night. MOO

The tip off was when actually came out and said that they want to gauge the parents emotional reactions when they do sit down interviews. It is almost like a war of nerves.... MOO
 
I totally agree. I think LE was given a video which was identified by the provider incorrectly as Fri nite/Sat AM. I also believe it was from before. I think it has since been identified as the wrong date, due to the persons in the video saying "no it wasn't Friday night it was xxxx", but Pacheco has been misinformed of the corrected ate.

I didn't hold as much stock in this video being the key to the case - just never felt it was going to pan into anything significant. At any rate, LE had to find and interview the people to find out it was the wrong date. And so it goes...

Oh dear. If it turns out the corrected date is wrong...........

Tomorrows press conference will be interesting.
 
If the footage is from the wrong day, why does it have to be from early Sunday morning. Why can't be it be from early Friday morning or any other early morning before Saturday?

I'd love to see Nancy Grace interview the parents. Any parent that doesn't cooperate 100% with LE and answer any and every single question they have makes me question their involvement.
 
I guess it is just a matter of preference, as a rule I would never counsel anyone to speak to LEO without an attorney present, a lot of innocent people have been imprisoned because they thought they were smart enough to go head to head with trained professional interrogators.

Kevin Fox, Riley's dad...comes to mind. In trying to cooperate with LE, without attorney (because innocent people do not need attorneys) Kevin Fox was coerced into confessing to his daughter's murder. Problem: He was innocent.
 
I still don't think LE would have admitted to this mistake. They would have just said they talked to all 6 people and none were persons of interest.

My thought from the very beginning was that Dad was going to be a witness in an upcoming trial and taking Isabel would keep him quiet. I have no idea why I think that.

:/
 
What if the video just said Sat/Sun, and it was from a week before?
A lot of businesses are very casual about labeling videos...
And if LE collected a whole bunch at one time, they may have done so quickly...
JMO

As far as suspecting the parents....I only do if perhaps they have someone in mind and are anxious about that...otherwise, I can't think of a reason they would have hurt Isobel, Or why they are not wanting to meet with media.
 
Thank you, Prof. The white building is the Office Max. Across the street from the "blue arrow", is where the command center (consisting of the TPD RV and tent, etc) were located. In the area behind the O.M. is where police cars were parked. I am having a very difficult time believing the video is of Saturday night. Where are the flashing lights from the cop cars?!

Not only that, why is that shadowy figure there, and why are the walkers not questioned. It has been less than 18 hours since 911 was called on this. Instead it looks so quiet and calm. Maybe it is from the previous week.
 
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