GUILTY GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 26 June 2011 #14

MaconMom said:

Hi guys. New article about evidence just posted:

http://www.macon.com/2012/12/14/2285130/defense-attorneys-dna-on-saw-may.html#storylink=rss#wgt=rss

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Thanks, MaconMom.

So, according to the story at the link, the rumor about running shorts was true.

There is another macon.com story as well:

Lawyers want McDaniel’s ‘perfect murder’ discussions kept out of court

If Stephen McDaniel’s lawyers have their way, the murder case against him will not include testimony from his former college roommate and friend about how McDaniel used to claim he could pull off “the perfect murder” and get away with it. ...

...“Stephen said he would wear shoes that were too small, that he would make himself appear to be bald, that he would cut up the body, put the parts in bags, use chemicals to mask the odor, and spread the body parts in the woods,” a defense motion’s account of Money’s statement to police says. ...

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more at: http://www.macon.com/2012/12/14/2285676/lawyers-want-mcdaniels-perfect.html#storylink=botnext

So some interesting new information comes to light.

A medical examiner would later find a few, several-inch-long brown hairs on Giddings’ abdomen. A clump of brown and blond hair was on the back of her shorts.

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The hairs could be the clincher if they prove to be McD's. On the other hand, that information should have been returned from the lab by now. The latest docs don't include lab results, yet I suspect soon we'll hear more about them from one side or the other.

The article also mentionsn blood in McD's car and around LG's bathtub, and a freshly painted wall in the downstairs apartment bathroom with blood stains.

I don't recall that the panties found in McD's apartment were said to be blood-stained:

Later, police found a pair of green-and-white, blood-stained panties in a dresser drawer inside the apartment of her accused killer, Stephen McDaniel.

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Read more here: http://www.macon.com/2012/12/14/2285130/defense-attorneys-dna-on-saw-may.html#storylink=rss%23wgt=rss#storylink=cpy

A late Friday article says McD's lawyers want to suppress Thad Money's recollections of McD and "the perfect murdrs".

http://www.macon.com/2012/12/14/2285676/lawyers-want-mcdaniels-perfect.html#storylink=topnext

ETA: LOL Looks like we were posting at the same time again, BW.

Macon's 13WMAZ also covered the filing of motions:

McDaniel Defense Attack Admissibility Of Evidence

The team of lawyers representing Stephen McDaniel-- the man accused of killing and dismembering Mercer Law graduate Lauren Giddings-- are challenging the District Attorney's intent to seek the death penalty. ...


...The motion was one of 31 filed Friday, what Hogue calls "the first wave"-- he anticipates filing about 30 more in coming weeks. ...

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more at: http://www.13wmaz.com/news/article/208160/175/McDaniel-Defense-Attack-Admissibility-Of-Evidence


...and also coverage from 13WMAZ concerning some of what is revealed by the motions process about evidence -- some pretty interesting stuff in this one:

Court Documents: Brown Hair Found on Giddings Remains

...The affidavit talks about interrogating McDaniel later that morning. Patterson says during questioning, he noticed a red mark on the left side of his face. That's when he asked McDaniel to lift his shirt to see if he had any other marks. "He lifted his t-shirt and revealed what appeared to be two fresh scratch marks." McDaniel told Patterson he didn't know how he got the marks. ...

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more at: http://www.13wmaz.com/news/article/208159/153/Court-Documents-Brown-Hair-Found-on-Giddings-Remains

Does anyone know if the actual motions filed by the defense lawyers are online or available to the public?

pearl said:

Does anyone know if the actual motions filed by the defense lawyers are online or available to the public?

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pearl, I didn't notice any links to online copies on the media pages we were linking in the posts above.

They'll be a matter of public record at some point -- technically, I think they are now, since the media is apparently examining them...? But when a person would be able to access them, I'm not sure.

Backwoods said:

pearl, I didn't notice any links to online copies on the media pages we were linking in the posts above.

They'll be a matter of public record at some point -- technically, I think they are now, since the media is apparently examining them...? But when a person would be able to access them, I'm not sure.

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I will try to get the Macon paper tomorrow if it is still sold in my area. Used to be.

December 14-15, 2012

Defense Attorneys: DNA on Saw May Not Belong to McDaniel

By AMY LEIGH WOMACK and JOE KOVAC JR. — Telegraph staff

A hacksaw with Giddings’ DNA on it may not contain McDaniel’s DNA. An FBI analysis of the saw showed it had DNA from three or more people, according to one of the defense motions...

Later, police found a pair of green-and-white, blood-stained panties in a dresser drawer inside the apartment of her accused killer, Stephen McDaniel.

A medical examiner would later find a few, several-inch-long brown hairs on Giddings’ abdomen. A clump of brown and blond hair was on the back of her shorts.

Giddings, 27, had blond hair. McDaniel, now 27, had shoulder-length brown hair at the time.


Lawyers Want McDaniel's Perfect Murder Discussion Kept Out of Court

By AMY LEIGH WOMACK and JOE KOVAC JR. — Telegraph staff

McDaniel’s defense team, in a Friday court filing, dismisses such “college ramblings” between McDaniel and his friend as “casual conversations of young college students based on curious musings, not deep criminal confessions.”

Court Documents: Brown Hair Found on Giddings' Remains

WMAZ
12:25 AM, Dec 15, 2012
Written by Candace Adorka

A year and a half after Mercer Law School grad Lauren Giddings was found murdered and dismembered in the trash can outside her apartment complex, many of the details of the ensuing investigation are now public record.

Some of the facts of the case were shared in a series of 31 motions filed by the defense team of Stephen McDaniel, Giddings' neighbor and accused killer.

McDaniel Defense Attack Admissibility of Evidence

WMAZ
11:11 AM, Dec 15, 2012
Written by Candace Adorka

The team of lawyers representing Stephen McDaniel-- the man accused of killing and dismembering Mercer Law graduate Lauren Giddings-- are challenging the District Attorney's intent to seek the death penalty.

DA Greg Winters filed his notice of intent to seek the death penalty almost a year ago on the grounds that Giddings' murder was "outrageously or wantonly vile, horrible or inhuman in that it involved depravity of mind."

DEFENSE MOTIONS



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Backwoods said:

pearl, I didn't notice any links to online copies on the media pages we were linking in the posts above.

They'll be a matter of public record at some point -- technically, I think they are now, since the media is apparently examining them...? But when a person would be able to access them, I'm not sure.

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I'm hoping the media will post at least a few of them as pdf's. :crossfingers:

After a long dry spell, we are finally getting some new information! More today:

Search warrants give insight into Giddings murder case

Macon police obtained several warrants to search Stephen McDaniel’s apartment, car and body between June 30 and Aug. 11, 2011. ...

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read more at: http://www.macon.com/2012/12/15/2286422/search-warrants-give-insight-into.html

Documents in Giddings slaying chronicle case’s early hours

For more than 17 months, in the wake of the slaying of a Mercer University law graduate and the jailing of the classmate accused of killing and dismembering her, a number of details about the case and the lives of those altered by it have emerged. ...

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read more at: http://www.macon.com/2012/12/15/2286427/documents-in-giddings-slaying.html

ETA: bessie, I still don't see any pdf links -- but I'm hoping, too! In the meantime: Pretty good detail in the stories.

pearl said:

I will try to get the Macon paper tomorrow if it is still sold in my area. Used to be.

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Right now, I am still able to access macon.com (The Telegraph), even though it is supposedly a pay site now. Are you having problems accessing it to read the stories, pearl?

Backwoods said:

Right now, I am still able to access macon.com (The Telegraph), even though it is supposedly a pay site now. Are you having problems accessing it to read the stories, pearl?

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Backwoods,
I can read the main article, but the links to the one about the search warrants don't work for me. Will try them a couple more times before I go to bed.

Just read the warrants article. Accessed it from your link not the paper.

bessie said:

So some interesting new information comes to light.

The hairs could be the clincher if they prove to be McD's. On the other hand, that information should have been returned from the lab by now. The latest docs don't include lab results, yet I suspect soon we'll hear more about them from one side or the other.

The article also mentions blood in McD's car and around LG's bathtub, and a freshly painted wall in the downstairs apartment bathroom with blood stains.

I don't recall that the panties found in McD's apartment were said to be blood-stained:

<respectfully snipped for space>

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The new details make me wonder what else the DA already knows. I suspect there will be more in the coming weeks. I believe they will have a solid case.

I had to laugh at the comments that McD's attys made, in the article MaconMom posted, about reliability of the science behind the cadaver dogs. Sounds like they are beginning to sweat as evidence emerges and are trying to get all of the evidence thrown out. Reminds me of Baez.

<snipped>
The lawyers, in a creative flourish, contend that testimony involving the cadaver dogs&#8217; actions, interpreted by a handler, &#8220;may turn out to fall somewhere between astrology&#8221; and an ancient Indian lie-detector test that involves tugging on a donkey&#8217;s tail.
&#8220;Even Lassie needed English-speaking humans to translate her various barks ... concerning Timmy&#8217;s falling into the well, yet again, and other mishaps and calamities of his,&#8221; the attorneys write in a footnote.

http://www.macon.com/2012/12/14/2285130/defense-attorneys-dna-on-saw-may.html#storylink=cpy​

<snipped>

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http://www.macon.com/2012/12/14/2285130/defense-attorneys-dna-on-saw-may.html

Does McDaniel expect people to believe that LE stomped all over the civil rights of a recent law school grad? He knew the law, but yet allowed himself to be treated as he claims he was treated? He was repeatedly questioned and did not request a lawyer and just shut his mouth? He was put in a police car, mobile crime scene lab, and police station and did not request a lawyer? Seems like he made his one phone call to his mother not a lawyer. He could have. just. shut. his. mouth.
Please excuse my rant. I've just entered an alternate reality reading these articles.

Backwoods said:

After a long dry spell, we are finally getting some new information! More today:

read more at: http://www.macon.com/2012/12/15/2286422/search-warrants-give-insight-into.html


read more at: http://www.macon.com/2012/12/15/2286427/documents-in-giddings-slaying.html

ETA: bessie, I still don't see any pdf links -- but I'm hoping, too! In the meantime: Pretty good detail in the stories.

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Now why would he need four ponchos? :waitasec:

Warrant 3, issued 1:55 a.m. July 1, 2011: Police searched McDaniel&#8217;s black 1997 Geo Prizm and took fabric samples from the back seat, scrapings from the airbag area, an earring and two ponchos from the glove compartment, the headliner, floor mats, rearview mirror, front seat covers, trunk mat, and a black bag from the trunk that held two ponchos, a tire gauge and an air hose.

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Finally! We might have an answer to what was in the large evidence bag.

Warrant 2, issued 1:55 a.m. July 1, 2011: Police searched McDaniel&#8217;s apartment and took two handguns, a rifle, rope, wooden sticks, four baseball bats and a bayonet. They also took a chain mail vest, &#8220;wad of hair,&#8221; laptop, camera, cell phone, external card drive and a memory card reader. A shoelace, receipts -- including one from Walmart dated June 23, 2011, a green scrub sponge, two keys, and a silver case with a journal and laptop also were seized, as was a foam cup with &#8220;Lauren&#8221; written on it.

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Indy Anna said:

The new details make me wonder what else the DA already knows. I suspect there will be more in the coming weeks. I believe they will have a solid case.

I had to laugh at the comments that McD's attys made, in the article MaconMom posted, about reliability of the science behind the cadaver dogs. Sounds like they are beginning to sweat as evidence emerges and are trying to get all of the evidence thrown out. Reminds me of Baez.


http://www.macon.com/2012/12/14/2285130/defense-attorneys-dna-on-saw-may.html

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I think that was incredibly foolish remark. To question the training of the actual canines used in the search would be one thing, but to cast aspersions on a tried and true method used by emergency workers in recovery efforts all over the world is just ludicrous.

pearl said:

Backwoods,
I can read the main article, but the links to the one about the search warrants don't work for me. Will try them a couple more times before I go to bed.

Just read the warrants article. Accessed it from your link not the paper.

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I'm having a little trouble with the links, too, Pearl. This is what I have to do to open the full articles.

Click link posted here. Headline appears, but not the article. Next click a related article. The article opens. Now look at related articles for the first one I tried to read. This time when I click the link, the whole article appears.

bessie said:

Now why would he need four ponchos? :waitasec:

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I guess I don't find it so very odd that he'd have four ponchos in his car, two in the glove compartment and two in what may have been a tire-changing kit in the trunk. I remember, though, that in previous coverage it was stated that ponchos (don't know that a number was stated) were found in his apartment; now if that is true (and not just misstated -- as in if the ponchos referenced were the same ones actually found in his car), well, then, I would have to say we are getting into the area of owning an unusual number of ponchos.

bessie said:

Finally! We might have an answer to what was in the large evidence bag.

Read more here: http://www.macon.com/2012/12/15/2286422/search-warrants-give-insight
into.html#storylink=relast#storylink=cpy

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Yep, I agree. Can anyone check to see if the dates match up? (Now that's where I'm having problems: looking back at older macon.com coverage. I seem to be hitting the pay site roadblock in that case.)

bessie, what do we do here on WS when the best media source is a pay site? I guess one can still post links, if one is a subscriber or circumvents the roadblock somehow? It's going to be a shame if it gets where we can't even access the newest articles. I wish The Telegraph wasn't going down this path at this time, but I do realize it's hard times for newspapers.

bessie said:

I think that was incredibly foolish remark. To question the training of the actual canines used in the search would be one thing, but to cast aspersions on a tried and true method used by emergency workers in recovery efforts all over the world is just ludicrous.

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I absolutely agree that Hogue seems to have gone in the wrong direction and way up over the top in trying to make the canine searches sound questionable through the particular remarks referenced.

Keeping in mind that (I think) the average person on the street might not have the knowledge about and huge respect for "canine investigators" that a lot of us have gained through WS (and other, in-the-field experience in the case of some here, I know), I nevertheless have to think Hogue knows better. Whom is he aiming to convince -- the judge, the public? Could work, I guess.

I agree that challenging the specific training and methods of the particular search teams actually involved would make a lot better sense. I would guess they are saving that for later, if it is needed. ETA: Just wanted to clarify that I personally do not know anything much one way or another to credit or discredit the teams -- am just saying that approach makes better sense to me. As far as I remember, from the online research we did about them here in earlier days, they looked pretty darn good! We don't know much, though, about the actual protocol of the searches that were conducted that day, IIRC.

Regarding the dog search, though, if the sequence of events and description of the circumstances the defense has laid out, according to the article linked below, is accurate -- and I know the prosecution may not agree that they are accurate -- I do question whether the dog search was legal. If not, could be a big problem for the prosecution!

...“Stephen did not respond and did not sign anything,” a defense motion notes. He was then placed in the Macon Police Department’s RV-like Mobile Command Center that was parked at the apartment complex. They say he remained there for several hours while various police officers came and went.


Sometime that afternoon, a pair of cadaver dogs, led by their handler, sniffed around McDaniel’s apartment while McDaniel sat in the apartment on a sofa.


“This search,” one motion contends, “was conducted without a warrant and without consent.”


<bolding by me>

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http://www.macon.com/2012/12/15/2286427/documents-in-giddings-slaying.html

I know we heard testimony by Patterson at the commitment hearing concerning the dog search and also, later, remarks about it by Winters at one of the bond hearings. Might be interesting to look back and see how they phrased things, as far as whether the search was with Stephen's consent or not.

Backwoods said:

I guess I don't find it so very odd that he'd have four ponchos in his car, two in the glove compartment and two in what may have been a tire-changing kit in the trunk. I remember, though, that in previous coverage it was stated that ponchos (don't know that a number was stated) were found in his apartment; now if that is true (and not just misstated -- as in if the ponchos referenced were the same ones actually found in his car), well, then, I would have to say we are getting into the area of owning an unusual number of ponchos.

Yep, I agree. Can anyone check to see if the dates match up? (Now that's where I'm having problems: looking back at older macon.com coverage. I seem to be hitting the pay site roadblock in that case.)

bessie, what do we do here on WS when the best media source is a pay site? I guess one can still post links, if one is a subscriber or circumvents the roadblock somehow? It's going to be a shame if it gets where we can't even access the newest articles. I wish The Telegraph wasn't going down this path at this time, but I do realize it's hard times for newspapers.

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Regarding the search warrant, I checked the date after I posted. The search I was talking about, the one where the large brown bag was removed, was the "blue fiber" SW issued July 12. The bayonet and sword were removed earlier. The items from the July 12 search have not been revealed, but article accompanying the video says the two large bags appeared to hold soft items. IDK...didn't look like soft items to me.

http://www.13wmaz.com/news/article/135428/175/Investigators-at-Giddings-Apartment-Complex

As for the Telegraph becoming a pay site, it will present a problem. Paid subscribers can paraphrase what they read and provide a link, but the link doesn't do much good if you can't see the article. I'll double check the rule on this situation. Hopefully, the other media outlets will give good coverage.