GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 1

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LayzeeDayzee said:
More questions:

1 - I wonder how long this gated community's security cameras haven't been working for? Why weren't they fixed? Who would have been responsible for doing so? Is it possible that "someone" was responsible for the cameras (conveniently) not working?...had intentionally done something so that they weren't working - in preparation for this tragedy?

2 - You would think that tracking dogs would have been able to pick up Mrs D's scent, to at least give any idea as to which direction she'd have been removed from the property? --- or would that be difficult to pick up a helpful scent due to the fact that it was her home and her scent be all over?

3 - It seems to me, and this is JMO, but that this was all done to send a message to someone else in the family....to one of the Dermonds' children. What could be worse than to learn your elderly father was decapitated, head taken, and your mother appears to have been abducted? I don't see this as anything other than some kind of 'revenge' or 'warning/threat' to someone in the immediate family.
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I'm beginning to think number 3 is the likely why of this crime......because there is such an evil attached to it.
 
LayzeeDayzee said:
More questions:

1 - I wonder how long this gated community's security cameras haven't been working for? Why weren't they fixed? Who would have been responsible for doing so? Is it possible that "someone" was responsible for the cameras (conveniently) not working?...had intentionally done something so that they weren't working - in preparation for this tragedy?

2 - You would think that tracking dogs would have been able to pick up Mrs D's scent, to at least give any idea as to which direction she'd have been removed from the property? --- or would that be difficult to pick up a helpful scent due to the fact that it was her home and her scent be all over?

3 - It seems to me, and this is JMO, but that this was all done to send a message to someone else in the family....to one of the Dermonds' children. What could be worse than to learn your elderly father was decapitated, head taken, and your mother appears to have been abducted? I don't see this as anything other than some kind of 'revenge' or 'warning/threat' to someone in the immediate family.
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LayzeeDayzee, I like the way that you are thinking..

Seems there are way too many unanswered questions after over a week of investigating this mysterious crime. I don't think that the timing of the abduction/murder/decapitation of the Dermonds occurring on the same weekend as the festive Kentucky Derby/Cinco De Mayo celebrations/parties were simply a coincidence. No more than the security cameras being inoperable..
Imo, this horrific crime wasn't impulsive, but was very well planned and executed. I agree that the crime was likely meant to send a message, but not sure it was intended for the family. The message was sent to the entire community, imo.

RE: #3
LayzeeDayzee, if you ask the family members, friends, and loved ones of the missing/murdered victims; "What is the worst"? Virtually all will say; "By far, it is the not knowing"..
 
I've always thought this crime was about some sort of revenge BUT I also thought MrD's head would be sent/delivered to the intended recipient, AND... I've occasionally been wrong in my thinking ;)

I don't know if this plays a part (maybe not since this occurred in 2012)... I wonder if some homeowners sold their property and lost a great deal of money?

"But many of Reynolds Plantation's 3,600 property owners are concerned, he said, about the status of membership deposits, which were as high as $110,000 for some. They worry they will not see that money returned as they initially were promised if they were to sell their properties."

http://www.ajc.com/news/business/reynolds-plantation-purchase-part-of-longterm-plan/nQTmT/
 
fred&edna said:
I've always thought this crime was about some sort of revenge BUT I also thought MrD's head would be sent/delivered to the intended recipient, AND... I've occasionally been wrong in my thinking ;)

I don't know if this plays a part (maybe not since this occurred in 2012)... I wonder if some homeowners sold their property and lost a great deal of money?

"But many of Reynolds Plantation's 3,600 property owners are concerned, he said, about the status of membership deposits, which were as high as $110,000 for some. They worry they will not see that money returned as they initially were promised if they were to sell their properties."

http://www.ajc.com/news/business/reynolds-plantation-purchase-part-of-longterm-plan/nQTmT/
Click to expand...

Guess, Reynolds Plantation owners can forget about their investments being a quick flip now, huh? Especially if this horrific crime is not quickly solved by investigators. The dark cloud of evil residue left in the wake of the unspeakable events of a week ago will linger much longer in the present and future resident's minds..
Ironically, the 5,000 acre development; Reynolds Plantation, was previously known as 'Linger Longer', a Hunting & Fishing Retreat..

ABOUT REYNOLDS PLANTATION
https://www.reynoldsplantation.com/live-here/real-estate-overview

Nearly 100 years ago, the land now known as Reynolds Plantation was established as a family hunting and fishing retreat.

Affectionately known as “Linger Longer,” visitors to this special place knew they could always count on it to restore their spirit. Decades later, the decision was made to share this land with others seeking such a rejuvenating oasis.

And today, with its six challenging golf courses, restaurants, swimming pools, pedestrian trails, marinas, tennis center and more -- all framed by the sparkling waters of Lake Oconee --

Reynolds Plantation provides residents and guests a unique lifestyle that few other locations can offer. Reynolds Plantation is also home to The Ritz-Carlton Lodge, a 251-room lakefront resort and spa, which earned 2013 AAA Five Diamond Hotel and 2013 Forbes Travel Guide Four-Star awards.
 
gngr~snap said:
You making fun of my houseboat?

Lol... just kidding
http://www.pensacolafishingforum.co...d1327006475t-redneck-pontoon-boat-pinhead-jpg


Seriously, though I bet residents were none too pleased to hear about non functioning cameras.

Also, the greens were just redone in the last year.... with sod. That seemed to make some members angry. Reconstruction on the greens would bring in a LOT of work men.
Mr. D walked a lot. I wonder if he befriended one of them.

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk
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:floorlaugh: That picture takes the cake! :floorlaugh:

I had not heard about the greens being redone with sod. Mr. D probably did walk and check on the progress of work and probably became familiar with the people who were doing this job. We just keep adding to the suspect pile. Hard to eliminate people when there are so many that were allowed with the confines of the community legitimately. It is so unfair that someone took advantage of this older couple and did the unthinkable to someone who probably would have helped anyone.
 
Bootsctr said:
:floorlaugh: That picture takes the cake! :floorlaugh:

I had not heard about the greens being redone with sod. Mr. D probably did walk and check on the progress of work and probably became familiar with the people who were doing this job. We just adding the suspect pile. Hard to eliminate people when there are so many that were allowed with the confines of the community legitimately. It is so unfair that someone took advantage of this older couple and did the unthinkable to someone who probably would have helped anyone.
Click to expand...

Here is a picture. My phone won't upload so all I have is a link.
http://reynoldsplantationblog.com/2013/03/08/laying-sod-on-15-rl-3813-330pm/

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Destini said:
But the sheriff said there was no blood spatter such as would come from a gunshot wound.
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At first Sheriff Sills wasn't sure if RD was killed where he was found but now I do think he was killed right there.

The only time blood spatter would be evident is if the bullet made an exit wound out of the skull. If he was shot at close range right up against his skull there would be little or no blood spatter. And if there was a slight spray pattern it would blowback onto the hands of the shooter. Remember when Julie S shot her son, Beau, in the head at close range? They only found a small amount of his blood spatter on the back end of the gun she used. Her hand and arm would block most of the spatter. She used a ,38 revolver.

I do believe Russ was shot at very close range...even a contact wound... and the bullet didn't leave the brain cavity. That is why they found no imbedded bullet in the walls where it would strike after it passed through. This makes me think the firearm used was maybe a .22, .32, or .38 revolver. These caliber of weapons tend to leave the bullet inside the skull with no exit wound.

Sills probably found only a large pooling of blood around Russ' torso. That would show that Russ was dead when decapitated. If he had been alive at the time of decapitation as soon as the arteries were severed the blood would spew in an outwardly direction leaving blood spatter.

Sills now believes that Russ could have either been bludgeoned or shot in the head. I think if bludgeoned he would have found blood spatter from when the suspect was wielding the weapon over his head to strike him over and over again. So I think he was shot and that would explain why no blood spatter was found at the crime scene.

IMO
 
Is it possible Mr dermond starts his walks while still dark? Is it possible he came upon something or someone on the course or in a secluded area who quickly bludgeoned him, perhaps with a golf club or shovel?

If it was a RP employee or resident, perhaps they decided to put him back at home so whatever they were doing originally wouldn't be discovered in the crime scene?

My guess is both the weapon and the original location offer enough evidence to figure out who the killer is.
 
Bootsctr said:
Earlier in thread, someone posted a link to a MSM article that showed some pictures taken from above. It showed LE gathered around a vehicle that appeared to be the driveway leading into the garage area and you can definitely see some sort of stain right there. I was taken aback. Now if it was blood LE had already removed the little markers they use to measure the span of the pool of blood - if indeed it was blood. Check it out if you get a chance. Would love to hear everyone's opinion if they thought it was blood.
Click to expand...

Is this the pic you are referring to?
I think it was determined the spot was actually equipment bags that cameras, computers, etc. are stored in. Hth.
 

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LayzeeDayzee said:
More questions:

1 - I wonder how long this gated community's security cameras haven't been working for? Why weren't they fixed? Who would have been responsible for doing so? Is it possible that "someone" was responsible for the cameras (conveniently) not working?...had intentionally done something so that they weren't working - in preparation for this tragedy?

2 - You would think that tracking dogs would have been able to pick up Mrs D's scent, to at least give any idea as to which direction she'd have been removed from the property? --- or would that be difficult to pick up a helpful scent due to the fact that it was her home and her scent be all over?

3 - It seems to me, and this is JMO, but that this was all done to send a message to someone else in the family....to one of the Dermonds' children. What could be worse than to learn your elderly father was decapitated, head taken, and your mother appears to have been abducted? I don't see this as anything other than some kind of 'revenge' or 'warning/threat' to someone in the immediate family.
Click to expand...

BBM

It is impossible to get into the mind of the real killer to even begin to know why they did this the way they did it. Only they know in their evil depraved mind why these crimes were carried out the way they were.

But just guessing, I don't think this has anything to do with any family member or revenge of any kind. Imo the Dermonds were 'targeted' because they both were easy prey.

I remember when another elderly couple in their 80s were kidnapped from their home. It was a big story here on WS at the time. Posters were convinced it was some kind of personal vendetta to get back at the children or grandchildren of the elderly couple or even something the elderly couple had done themselves.

In truth it had nothing to do with any family member or even revenge against the elderly couple themselves. The murderer turned out to be someone who had done odd jobs for them and they had even rented him the house he lived in. His intentions to kidnap and murder them was to steal their car and iirc he was a drug addict. I guess he thought if he took them along with their vehicle people would think they had left on their own free will. Thank goodness, that was not believed. I don't think they ever found the elderly woman's body but did find her husband's.

So this is mentioned often as the motive. That it had to be a personal revenge of some kind. It was mentioned also in the Husted double murder case and others. Although in the end it wasn't revenge at all but just evil rearing its head against those who were unsuspecting of their impending doom.

The decapitation of the head has been done before by other sociopaths. I think they left it behind because each sociopath carries out the crime depending on their own depraved individual thoughts. Often times they will place their victims in certain demeaning positions, intact, or dismembered/decapitated for the shock value for when they are found.

IMO
 
princesspjs said:
I wonder how recently it was that they sold their boat.

The people who came to look at the boat would have had a convenient tour of the property down to the dock and then for a spin in the boat.

I wonder if the "security" gate kept a log of license plate numbers or something, anything.

IMO, those people should be questioned!
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This could be the security cameras that people reported do not work. I vacation on an island that has guards at the gate and security cameras recording your license plate and car when entering and exiting the island.
 
Annie1004 said:
No splatter as that which would come from a decapitation. A gunshot wound to the head doesn't leave "splatter." IMHO.
Click to expand...

princesspjs said:
I think that they mentioned the fact that there was no blood spatter because they were referencing the fact that Mr. Dermond would have been deceased when he was decapitated. (Thank goodness)

IMO
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Snipped by me for space:
oceanblueeyes said:
At first Sheriff Sills wasn't sure if RD was killed where he was found but now I do think he was killed right there.

IMO
Click to expand...

My post is bouncing off these above and CAUTION is graphic - relating to the discussion on blood spatter.
First, I noted LE said something like they are not sure whether Mr. D was even killed at the address. It would seem that evidence observed/collected along with autopsy results has given LE a good deal more information than is being reported to public at this time.

If Mr. D. had trauma to head prior to beheading and his heart stopped, there would most likely be significantly less blood at the site of the beheading compared to a beheading with the heart still beating. A beheading on a living person would produce A LOT of blood; and not something we would refer to as spatter. It would be gushes or jets of blood producing a good deal of spray and pooling at the location of the body. In addition, an autopsy would determine the amount of blood remaining in the body - thus being a very good indicator of whether the person was deceased prior to the beheading.

So it seems possible Mr. D. could have been killed/beheaded at another location and returned to the home. Even then, the observation of the body and immediate area around it would give evidence. I guess they are holding this information back from public - which very well may be prudent at this point in the investigation. Still trying to get my head around such a horrific event.
 
Suthrnqt said:
Is this the pic you are referring to?
I think it was determined the spot was actually equipment bags that cameras, computers, etc. are stored in. Hth.
Click to expand...

Yes. Thank you. I see the bag now.
 
This supposedly quiet town has had two suspicious deaths within days of each other, 15 miles apart connected by water way.

Let me go way out on a limb here and suggest that the Dermond perpetrator was someone well known to the community and that he had been responsible for the death of Vicki Stephens. Perhaps the Dermonds confronted the perp about Vicki Stephens having some knowledge of the perps motive or actions?


"The body of a south Putnam County woman found in Lake Sinclair Thursday evening was discovered by family members, Detective Terrell Abernathy of the Putnam County Sheriff's Office said Friday.

Vicki Stephens, 50, was found "not far from the dock of her residence" at 109 Flat Rock Circle at about 8 p.m., according to the PCSO reports. Authorities were called at about 7:41 p.m.

"While we were on our way there, the family found her off the dock in about 7 feet of water," Abernathy said Friday afternoon. He said one of Stephens' friends reported she had spoken with her at about lunchtime Thursday.

Stephens had worked as a real estate agent in the area for several years.

A neighbor called the sheriff’s office and said Stephens had not been seen since Thursday morning. Her personal belongings were found on the dock, according to the report of the call.

Abernathy said an autopsy of the body was scheduled Friday, and he had not received a report."

http://www.msgr.com/news/article_1082bb3c-d79a-11e3-9aab-0019bb2963f4.html
 
Rhyolite said:
This supposedly quiet town has had two suspicious deaths within days of each other, 15 miles apart connected by water way.

Let me go way out on a limb here and suggest that the Dermond perpetrator was someone well known to the community and that he had been responsible for the death of Vicki Stephens. Perhaps the Dermonds confronted the perp about Vicki Stephens having some knowledge of the perps motive or actions?


"The body of a south Putnam County woman found in Lake Sinclair Thursday evening was discovered by family members, Detective Terrell Abernathy of the Putnam County Sheriff's Office said Friday.

Vicki Stephens, 50, was found "not far from the dock of her residence" at 109 Flat Rock Circle at about 8 p.m., according to the PCSO reports. Authorities were called at about 7:41 p.m.

"While we were on our way there, the family found her off the dock in about 7 feet of water," Abernathy said Friday afternoon. He said one of Stephens' friends reported she had spoken with her at about lunchtime Thursday.

Stephens had worked as a real estate agent in the area for several years.

A neighbor called the sheriff’s office and said Stephens had not been seen since Thursday morning. Her personal belongings were found on the dock, according to the report of the call.

Abernathy said an autopsy of the body was scheduled Friday, and he had not received a report."

http://www.msgr.com/news/article_1082bb3c-d79a-11e3-9aab-0019bb2963f4.html
Click to expand...
Vicki Stephens-
Death ruled accidental drowning.
http://m.therepublic.com/view/story/4eb9e0fcc3d349b39fb14cd40ed785eb/GA--Lake-Drowning


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fred&edna said:
I've always thought this crime was about some sort of revenge BUT I also thought MrD's head would be sent/delivered to the intended recipient, AND... I've occasionally been wrong in my thinking ;)

I don't know if this plays a part (maybe not since this occurred in 2012)... I wonder if some homeowners sold their property and lost a great deal of money?

"But many of Reynolds Plantation's 3,600 property owners are concerned, he said, about the status of membership deposits, which were as high as $110,000 for some. They worry they will not see that money returned as they initially were promised if they were to sell their properties."

http://www.ajc.com/news/business/reynolds-plantation-purchase-part-of-longterm-plan/nQTmT/
Click to expand...

Curiouser and curiouser I say...

"Many big names were said to have stalked the property, including a group that counted Mercer Reynolds as a partner. Bolnick declined to identify other bidders for the properties.

But he said Reynolds Plantation garnered interest “from some of the strongest people in real estate and the golf business that I know.”

I'm not sure if this plays into the case or not either. However, no matter how you look at it, stalking is not a positive word :moo:. Ugh! Makes me think of OJ who loved to golf and how he stalked Nicole and Ron. Then his book "If I Did It" The situation makes me realize that from the outside this might have seemed the perfect place to live, in reality it was far from ideal. :scared:
 
I actually think that the developers of the area declared bankruptcy and sold out to MetLife. Not 100% about that, but I skimmed the blog and it gives details of some financial decisions made in RP that residents were displeased about.


In relation to the Vicki Stephens death, the coincidence is that the Dermonds have an acquaintance with whom Vicki worked at Coldwell Banker. I did read earlier her death was ruled an accident, but there was never another blip about it after that.
 
Bethanthony said:
I actually think that the developers of the area declared bankruptcy and sold out to MetLife. Not 100% about that, but I skimmed the blog and it gives details of some financial decisions made in RP that residents were displeased about.


In relation to the Vicki Stephens death, the coincidence is that the Dermonds have an acquaintance with whom Vicki worked at Coldwell Banker. I did read earlier her death was ruled an accident, but there was never another blip about it after that.
Click to expand...

You are correct they did declare bankruptcy.
 
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