"a specific tool ...designed for a specific audience."

Over the past couple of days, there's been a lot of internet activity in regards to Dede Spicher--everything from support groups popping up to defenders posting hither and yon in defense of Dede. It seems almost reactionary.

Some people, here and elsewhere on the net, have said that they think that Staton's press conference last week (in which he announced the task force creation) seemed to indicate that Dede is no longer a suspect. I was not left with that impression, but I do feel that there are some pieces from a couple of recent pressers we've seen that may fit together in one fashion or another. To me, it appears that this investigation has moved from being a net cast wide in the beginning to a more focused investigation today--and I think that Dede remains a subject of the more focused investigation.

First, from mid August, we have MCSO Capt. Jason Gates responding to a question about the flier with Dede's photo: "That is a specific tool that the investigative team is using that was designed for a specific audience."

(Start THIS VIDEO at 7:45 to hear the question and Gates' response.)

Then, a month later (September 16), Staton speaks: We have closed multiple doors and have target areas that we are focusing on. It is not as broad as it was before. We have reached the point where we have closed a lot of questions we've had. ... After the briefing that I had last Friday I am very confident with continuing this investigation along the lines that we've already initiated....I believe that some of the info through some of the discussions--there are going to be concerns, not necessarily cases, there may be cases that come out of this but through the discussion there are going to be issues that the sheriff's office is going to have to address. I believe the Portland Police Bureau will be actively involved in that. A lot of these issues we won't address until we actually do a debrief on this investigation once it's come to a conclusion. There are a lot of issues that have developed. There is a lot of information that our detectives have developed through the course of this investigation that have developed some concerns, and I think that those concerns need to be addressed. Whether it's going to turn into an investigation and or a notification process to other government entities, that still remains to be accessed. (Are we talking criminal?) (Pause) I can't comment on that, not at this point.

Staton video Part 1 and Part 2.

I'd like to discuss this more--whether Dede and co. have gone into defensive mode because of something that's happened in the past couple of weeks. To be honest, things had seemed to died down as far as she was concerned. But just recently, a flurry of internet activity around Dede makes me wonder if something is going on with her again. The people who are posting around the internet on her behalf are doing so with her permission, or so they claim. WHY NOW?

The above quotations make me wonder just what she--or other unnamed potential suspects--were involved in. What would be the specific audience that Gates mentioned? Why would other governmental entities be notified, and especially the Portland Police Bureau?

It may seem like I'm stringing disparate pieces together, but I really don't feel that I am. Targeting a specific audience with a flier, and then stating that the investigation is becoming more focused and may result in other jurisdictions being notified. I won't even add to this the comment of Staton's that closed his presser, about people being surprised...

Any ideas anyone want to share?

pufnstuf said:

What would be the specific audience that Gates mentioned?

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Hi pufnstuf. I'm confused by your question. Per MSM reports, the flier was distributed only to people in a specific neighborhood. It seems obvious to me that that is the specific audience to whom Gates was referring.

Again per MSM reports, the flier was distributed on or before August 9.

It could be that between the time LE distributed the flier, and the time of the August 11 LE/DA press conference, that Dede may have been cleared. That is, that LE may have received information that confirmed that she did not leave the property at which she was working.

At the Aug 11 press conference, LE and the DA had the perfect opportunity to ensure that they received the information they sought via the Dede flier from the subject audience. However, they did not even mention the flier, the info contained therein, and when asked by reporters about it, refused to so much as discuss it.

This would also be supported by Staton's comments the other day regarding having closed doors and questions.

Or it could be that LE was trying to avoid the influences on the memories of their subject audience for the Dede flier by not addressing it and publicizing it further in the August 11 press conference. Note that immediately following the questions from the reporter about this flier, Gates speaks about those uninfluenced memories.

Or it could also be that LE received info from members of the subject audience that confirmed she was indeed in the area targetted, and therefore there was no further need to address it in the August 11 presser. I have doubts about this because that means finding and vetting one or more credible witness within a timeframe that appears to me to be entirely inadequate.

Thanks for a great topic,pufnstuf!

Do we know where DeDe and Terri most often interacted? Was it the gym? I know they had a common interest in gardening and fitness...but where exactly did their lives most intersect? I think it is there that we might find the "target group" that LE is interested in.

Now here is my speculation...and it is only that:

The pictures of Terri when she was "buff" have made me wonder about certain body-enhancing drugs that athletes often convince themselves should not be illegal. I can almost understand how someone who believes that she needs these drugs to compete... might convince herself that it's no big deal. From using ...to selling might be just an easy moral slide down the road.

This might be a way to make money...if you are not working and your husband does not cooperate in giving you what you feel you need. Again, easy to slip into justifying an illegal activity. Telling yourself these drugs should NOT be illegal.

But taking them is one thing, however selling them moves one into a whole different segment of criminal society. A much more frightening environment.

I wonder if LS want to know more about Dede and Terri's interactions with people at the gym in regard to a little sideline of selling drugs? Perhaps this is one of the target groups? What did you see? What have you ever heard them saying?

Also, was there a place..a bar, a coffee shop where they were often seen in the company of specific others? Another "target" group. Tell us about Terri and Dede's friends, etc. Ever see any money change hands, etc.

How about the Landscaper? Has anyone seen either Terri or Dede with him in some other meeting place? Does his life fit into Terri's beyond yard work and "sexual activity."

Some don't believe the MFH because they don't think Terri would approach a virtual stranger. But what if he wasn't? Just because he is doing yard work that her husband knows nothing about...doesn't mean they do not have much more tangled connections.

Then there is the question of where an unemployed housewife gets a retainer of $350,000. I think LE wants to know about that as much as Kaine. I think it is another "clue."

How, by the way, does Dede support herself? What exactly is her job?

I think the "specific audience" may be people at the gym...and also at other places they met. I think they are gathering information on who else they were most often interacting with...whether Kyron was with them, etc.

Did Terri overspend what she owed these people? Was she in fear for herself? Was her first thought to kill Kaine to get her hands and control of cash to pay these people back? When that didn't work...was she trading Kyron to these people ...her last desperate solution?

Are LE holding off on charges because they are still trying to walk this back to whomever may now have him (or sadly once had him) And does Terri know that THEY know...but is too fearful to help...and that's what Desiree means about her "selfishness?"

Just speculation...just postulating a theory...which, I believe is part of a lively discussion.

Dede has no income that I know of. She's unemployed, unless she's receiving payment for her work with the HOA.

Her gardening is volunteer and she receives no pay for that.

Maybe she, like Terri, is sponging off her parents.

pufnstuf said:

Dede has no income that I know of. She's unemployed, unless she's receiving payment for her work with the HOA.

Her gardening is volunteer and she receives no pay for that.

Maybe she, like Terri, is sponging off her parents.

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Interesting.

Yet her parents are not wealthy people. Her Father is retired LE, no? Living on a pension?

And DeDe has a condo or an apartment. Does she have a car? Does she belong to a gym? Meet friends out at restaurants, bars, coffee shop? Is Portland an inexpensive city in regard to cost of living?

This is very interesting. Kaine is asking wherefore cometh Terri's $350,000 retainer and her unemployed friend lives fairly well with no obvious income.

HMMMM

Yeah... it's all interesting.

She may receive unemployment, but I don't know how long she'd receive it. If I remember correctly, she lost her job in January (?) of 2009.

I read somewhere that she owns a tree farm 15 miles from Portland, but, so far, that's just a rumor with no way to verify it.

I think that the investigation has resulted in lots of info about both Terri and Dede, and whatever it is that they were into, it's shocking.

pufnstuf said:

Yeah... it's all interesting.

She may receive unemployment, but I don't know how long she'd receive it. If I remember correctly, she lost her job in January (?) of 2009.

I read somewhere that she owns a tree farm 15 miles from Portland, but, so far, that's just a rumor with no way to verify it.

I think that the investigation has resulted in lots of info about both Terri and Dede, and whatever it is that they were into, it's shocking.

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BBM, puf-really? What could these friends have gotten up to that would shock seasoned LE? I am not being fresh; I apparently have completely lost track of this case....

believe09 said:

BBM, puf-really? What could these friends have gotten up to that would shock seasoned LE? I am not being fresh; I apparently have completely lost track of this case....

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BBM. Personally, I don't think anything. I've never heard of any case where LE said they were "shocked", and there's certainly been nothing reported in this case that LE are "shocked" by anything at all.

Who said anything about being "shocked" ?

If LE had criminal information on Terri and/or Dede about which they were shocked, they would have evidence, and Terri and/or Dede would be arrested. IMHO, it's beyond the realm of possibility to assume LE has mountains of evidence against either or both women, but that they're not arresting them as part of some strategy. IMHO, that would've only been viable very, very early on and certainly before Terri retained her lawyer.

IMHO, it's a bit disingenuous for LE to continue to make indirect accusations but not back it up with arrests, and there is either evidence of criminal activity or there is not. If there is not then LE needs to stop feeding the rumor mill to cover up what are possibly their shortcomings and/or misdirection in this case.

I don't know Puf. I really get the feeling that all the latest "talk" surrounding Dede is in fact because she is no longer on the radar. People feel they can talk now because she isn't a direct suspect any longer. I don't think she's been cleared per se, but that they have now turned their focus towards criminal activity in the "under belly of Portland" that Terri got herself tangled up in. (through the LS in my opinion) I go back and forth on whether Dede had anything to do with it at all with the exception that maybe she introduced them in the beginning. Tomorrow I'm sure I'll change my mind. I'm seriously confused...and I have a few contacts and it still doesn't help me! :banghead:

I haven't seen anything reported about Dede recently, and I'm not currently reading out on the net.

Could somebody please link in where the talk on the net about Dede is that's being referenced in the above posts so I can read up?

TIA

loves2bmom said:

I don't know Puf. I really get the feeling that all the latest "talk" surrounding Dede is in fact because she is no longer on the radar. People feel they can talk now because she isn't a direct suspect any longer. I don't think she's been cleared per se, but that they have now turned their focus towards criminal activity in the "under belly of Portland" that Terri got herself tangled up in. (through the LS in my opinion) I go back and forth on whether Dede had anything to do with it at all with the exception that maybe she introduced them in the beginning. Tomorrow I'm sure I'll change my mind. I'm seriously confused...and I have a few contacts and it still doesn't help me! :banghead:

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As a side note, I wonder if DeDe is not involved (especially considering what LE said about her and the truck), what is going to come of that not-so-subtle public threat made by K/D/T?

cypress said:

If LE had criminal information on Terri and/or Dede about which they were shocked, they would have evidence, and Terri and/or Dede would be arrested. IMHO, it's beyond the real of possibility to assume LE has mountains of evidence against either or both women, but that they're not arresting them as part of some strategy. IMHO, that would've only been viable very, very early on and certainly before Terri retained her lawyer.

IMHO, it's a bit disingenuous for LE to continue to make indirect accusations but not back it up with arrests, and there is either evidence of criminal activity or there is not. If there is not then LE needs to stop feeding the rumor mill to cover up what are possibly their shortcomings and/or misdirection in this case.

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I think they do have evidence but it's all in the way of circumstancial and so hard to prove. They can connect the dots just fine but will a juror?? Also, I think they are hoping the loosening of the lips will help them find Kyron and the longer "people" are free, the more chance someone will slip. My guess for today is that Dede doesn't know much but the people they are targeting are part of a group that may be out of the country and Terri got herself involved somehow. I just don't know though, I'm so confused.

Calliope said:

As a side note, I wonder if DeDe is not involved (especially considering what LE said about her and the truck), what is going to come of that not-so-subtle public threat made by K/D/T?

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And to that end, if Dede is cleared, will she be moved into the victim category? Her name and reputation have been destroyed and for what purpose? Because she tried to be a good friend? She says she spent hours with LE but that she didn't tell them what they wanted to hear. I tend to believe her because she hasn't been arrested for anything and she never went back before the grand jury to testify.

cypress said:

And to that end, if Dede is cleared, will she be moved into the victim category? Her name and reputation have been destroyed and for what purpose? Because she tried to be a good friend? She says she spent hours with LE but that she didn't tell them what they wanted to hear. I tend to believe her because she hasn't been arrested for anything and she never went back before the grand jury to testify.

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Her attorney is one who specializes in liability, IIRC. Perhaps a slander/defamation suit on the horizon?

Calliope said:

Her attorney is one who specializes in liability, IIRC. Perhaps a slander/defamation suit on the horizon?

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Gosh, I don't think so...her attorney was the one who said Terri Horman was about to be arrested.

I thought they were pretty straightforward about wanting to verify some information they had at that point but needed more for a solid case. They could have been fishing, but if so, with a pretty specific species in mind.

The fact that they have fewer people working the case and more focus on a more narrow target (and I do think they could say more about the scope of that) puts pressure on somebody. From what you're observing, it might be Dede. I'd be interested in learning more about it.

citigirl said:

Gosh, I don't think so...her attorney was the one who said Terri Horman was about to be arrested.

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He made that statement in response to the focus of the investigation being on Terri, not on any insider information, IMHO, and certainly not based on any information from his client.

believe09 said:

BBM, puf-really? What could these friends have gotten up to that would shock seasoned LE? I am not being fresh; I apparently have completely lost track of this case....

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That's what I want to know, too. It's going to be something that will surprise us all, according to Staton, and he, indeed, is a seasoned LE officer.

When Staton said this, he seemed to be very emotional. Watch the end of the second video in my OP. If you haven't watched those vids, you must.