Oral Arguments Tammi Smith Motions 6/18/12

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artsy1

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Here's a new thread for today's hearing.


Hopefully AZ Family and/or KPHO will be covering it at 1:30 AZ time.
 
Thanks for the new thread, Artsy.

Can't wait. I was thrilled by the verdict. I was thrilled the jury found aggravating factors. So note to Judge K - c'mon and thrill me some more!
 
Well, I suspect that if the defense motions are all denied, that, provided Judge Kraemer has the following information, Tammi will go to jail, go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200 today....

IF he found out about Stones of Grace, I think he will realize that she didn't learn her lesson about getting involved in single mother's lives, and sentence her to jail for rehabilitation.

or

IF he learned that Music City Colonics in TN was a sham - that it only existed on the internet and wasn't a real business, he will realize that he was bamboozled when he allowed her in Sept 2011 to move back to TN for "her husband's job", and sent her straight to jail.

JMHO
 
I am hoping to be here to ride along during the hearing . . .

I am looking forward to her sentencing . . . I am anxious to see what her prior bad acts (along with her ongoing bad acts) roles play into her convicted bad acts. Can't wait to see her hand over her cheesy bling ring and get handed the standard prison garb instead of the cleavage boobage "miss t!ts LaRue" ensembles she is so used to wearing. I hope her bio children come to see her get charged and wave goodbye to her as she is handcuffed and taken into custody.
 
artsy1 said:
Well, I suspect that if the defense motions are all denied, that, provided Judge Kraemer has the following information, Tammi will go to jail, go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200 today....

IF he found out about Stones of Grace, I think he will realize that she didn't learn her lesson about getting involved in single mother's lives, and sentence her to jail for rehabilitation.

or

IF he learned that Music City Colonics in TN was a sham - that it only existed on the internet and wasn't a real business, he will realize that he was bamboozled when he allowed her in Sept 2011 to move back to TN for "her husband's job", and sent her straight to jail.

JMHO
Click to expand...

BBM . . . seriously the worst choice of business names I have ever heard in my life!
 
Well, I did a little reading on the law yesterday, and found a couple of interesting points. Wonder how much input Tammi gave as to 2 points: 1) severing the trials of Tammi and EJ; and 2) pressing the Dec 17 date of Logan getting parental rights. Because I think Tammi sc#%&ed herself if she pushed for either of those, if I understood the law right. Here's why:

Severing the trials: If conspirators are tried together, and one is found guilty and one is found not guilty, then the guilty verdict is thrown out and both are judged not guilty. However, if the trials are severed, if one conspirator is found guilty and one is found not guilty, the guilty verdict STANDS, because the same evidence is not presented the same way to the same jury.

Dec 17 parental rights: Pushing this issue almost certainly leans the sentencing towards jail time. The 703 issue, as I understand it, is being argued that the forgery on Dec 14 IS the prior bad act, since there was at least one act done by Tammi after Logan was legally given parental rights on the 17th. One in particular I can think of, which I've mentioned in previous posts, was Tammi texting EJ and Logan while Tempe PD were in her home the first time, with Tammi texting Logan that EJ would return if he would just sign the papers. And the fact that Tammi didn't include those texts from that night when she emailed her texts to TPD the following day, indicate that she knew she was wrong and didn't want to get caught. And that occured AFTER Dec 17, AFTER EJ ran away to SA. So now she has 2 separate felonies committed on at least 2 separate occasions, which makes the forgery charge the prior bad act. Doesn't even take into account Tammi's criminal history.
 
artsy1 said:
Well, I did a little reading on the law yesterday, and found a couple of interesting points. Wonder how much input Tammi gave as to 2 points: 1) severing the trials of Tammi and EJ; and 2) pressing the Dec 17 date of Logan getting parental rights. Because I think Tammi sc#%&ed herself if she pushed for either of those, if I understood the law right. Here's why:

Severing the trials: If conspirators are tried together, and one is found guilty and one is found not guilty, then the guilty verdict is thrown out and both are judged not guilty. However, if the trials are severed, if one conspirator is found guilty and one is found not guilty, the guilty verdict STANDS, because the same evidence is not presented the same way to the same jury.

Dec 17 parental rights: Pushing this issue almost certainly leans the sentencing towards jail time. The 703 issue, as I understand it, is being argued that the forgery on Dec 14 IS the prior bad act, since there was at least one act done by Tammi after Logan was legally given parental rights on the 17th. One in particular I can think of, which I've mentioned in previous posts, was Tammi texting EJ and Logan while Tempe PD were in her home the first time, with Tammi texting Logan that EJ would return if he would just sign the papers. And the fact that Tammi didn't include those texts from that night when she emailed her texts to TPD the following day, indicate that she knew she was wrong and didn't want to get caught. And that occured AFTER Dec 17, AFTER EJ ran away to SA. So now she has 2 separate felonies committed on at least 2 separate occasions, which makes the forgery charge the prior bad act. Doesn't even take into account Tammi's criminal history.
Click to expand...

I think the law refers to a prior conviction rather than a prior bad act. My understanding is that if the crimes here are separate, the forgery becomes a prior felony conviction when sentencing on the conspiracy charge. If so, Tammi will be sentenced on the conspiracy count as a category 1 repetitive offender and some period of incarceration is mandatory. If the crimes are not separate offenses, she is eligible for probation as a first time felony offender.

Here is what I looked at-the top two charts for non-dangerous offenses and then for category 1 offenders on the second chart. Both crimes are class 4 felonies. I tried to copy and paste but it just didn't work out-




http://azcourts.gov/Portals/0/aoc/pdf/2011CriminalGuidelines.pdf
 
saba said:
I think the law refers to a prior conviction rather than a prior bad act. My understanding is that if the crimes here are separate, the forgery becomes a prior felony conviction when sentencing on the conspiracy charge. If so, Tammi will be sentenced on the conspiracy count as a category 1 repetitive offender and some period of incarceration is mandatory. If the crimes are not separate offenses, she is eligible for probation as a first time felony offender.

Here is what I looked at-the top two charts for non-dangerous offenses and then for category 1 offenders on the second chart. Both crimes are class 4 felonies. I tried to copy and paste but it just didn't work out-




http://azcourts.gov/Portals/0/aoc/pdf/2011CriminalGuidelines.pdf
Click to expand...




Thanks! There was a reason I didn't follow through on trying to become a lawyer. :seeya:
 
I'm confused: Since sentencing is scheduled for July - Why is it possible that Tammi Smith could be arrested at today's hearing?
 
SAgal said:
I'm confused: Since sentencing is scheduled for July - Why is it possible that Tammi Smith could be arrested at today's hearing?
Click to expand...


She has been out on bail all this time.

If the defense motions are denied, and the judge rules no probation, he could: 1) revoke her bond and take her into custody today; 2) continue her bond until sentencing; or 3) set a new bond to allow her to remain free until sentencing.

That's the way I understand what could happen today.
 
I'm checking around, but so far I don't find a media outlet planning to stream this hearing. Court pio usually gives updates during the hearings but does not detail the arguments. Maybe Pat McReynolds from KPHO plans to be there- he has covered a lot of these hearing- just dunno.
 
saba said:
I'm checking around, but so far I don't find a media outlet planning to stream this hearing. Court pio usually gives updates during the hearings but does not detail the arguments. Maybe Pat McReynolds from KPHO plans to be there- he has covered a lot of these hearing- just dunno.
Click to expand...


Hopefully SOMEONE will be there - especially since it looks like the court pio twitter is sleeping.....
 
Any WSers in the Phoenix area who can go watch the hearing & give us updates - especially IF she is taken into custody today????
 
saba said:
I'm checking around, but so far I don't find a media outlet planning to stream this hearing. Court pio usually gives updates during the hearings but does not detail the arguments. Maybe Pat McReynolds from KPHO plans to be there- he has covered a lot of these hearing- just dunno.
Click to expand...


I think everybody needs to go to www.kpho.com & hit the "send us your news" big red action button at the top left corner and say that you want to see the hearing this afternoon. The only "required" into on the news tip is an email address, zip code & your message.... (I did - but I won't say whose zip code I used. :floorlaugh: )
 
I have it on my Outlook that it will be streamed by kpho... wonder if I was wishful thinking.
 
Ooh, Maricopa County PIO is waking up! Just tweeted about the hearing!
 
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