Trial Discussion Thread #50 - 14.08.8, Day 40 ~final arguments continue~

G.bng said:

It sure could reach. But I posted already yesterday, and it's it day, I did some work on the photo Nel used for the cross, and I suppose it may not have looked like it could reach to Nel but but it sure did to me and when I tested, I confirmed it.

So good for Nel for upholding his oath to the court and keeping to what should be his ethical code and disclosing it to the defence just as anything exculpatory is obliged to be, but it's not only exculpatory, it's tardy, was in the states possession and should have been disclosed ages ago but even more importantly as a lesson a photo in perspective should never have been used in cross unless the State had tested it at the scene taken measurements, parallel photos, and taken into chain of custody the cord. JMHO but from a knowledge base

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Actually, whether the extension cord could or could not reach is quite irrelevant…

IF the fan was to be place where OP pointed to :

1- The available slack in the extension cord would have to be pulled out from underneath the bedside table… Consequently, the cord would NOT retreat back underneath the bedside table when police moved the fan where it was shown to be on the photo… unless we are dealing with a MAGICAL cord.

2- The multi-plug at the end of the extension cord would have moved in the same direction as the fan… Consequently, the multi-plug would have been closer to the end of the bed to accommodate OP's version of where he put the fan AND then when police moved the fan where it was shown to be on the photo, the multi-plug would be facing the opposite way, it would be turned around… unless we are dealing with a MAGICAL cord.

3- The extension cord would have been at an angle : from the wall socket to the corner of the bed… Consequently, when police moved the fan, the cord would have looped on itself NOT be in a straight line from the socket to the fan… the same goes for the hair-clipper cord which would have looped.

4- The cord of the hair-clipper would have been pulled along with the multi-plug and would have been extended to accommodate the position of the fan… that clipper cord would also NOT retreat back on its own when Police moved the fan… unless we are dealing with a MAGICAL cord.

… this is precisely WHY Nel specifically said "leaving the multi-plug where it is could the fan reach the location alleged by OP"

I suspect we have had a Defence mole in our midst since March 2014…

… the striking similarities and in some cases exactness between the content of that individual's posts with the content of Roux's closing arguments cannot be a coincidence LOL

… makes sense though… why not take advantage of many learned and laymen individuals who analyze, theorize and debate the case.

I suspect that individual will not post much or even at all now that the closing arguments are finished.

AJ_DS said:

I suspect we have had a Defence mole in our midst since March 2014…

… the striking similarities and in some cases exactness between the content of that individual's posts with the content of Roux's closing arguments cannot be a coincidence LOL

… makes sense though… why not take advantage of many learned and laymen individuals who analyze, theorize and debate the case.

I suspect that individual will not post much or even at all now that the closing arguments are finished.

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Well, it isn't really worth dwelling on. WS is open to almost all, and we aren't allowed to sleuth or speculate about members.

Most important thing, imo, is that I don't think the judge and assessors will be influenced by any factors except what they've heard in court. Hope so, anyway.

@OscarPistorius
Thank you to my loved ones and those that have been there for me, who have picked me up and helped me through everything.

https://mobile.twitter.com/OscarPistorius

atthelake said:

Hey y'all...want some southern b'fast in addition to the other great spreads already out? How about New Orleans southern from Cafe DuMonde? Chicory coffee and beignets!!! :lick:

http://civilwartalk.com/attachments/beignetsscottgulbransen-jpg.32607/

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http://shop.cafedumonde.com/originals.html

zwiebel said:

Well, it isn't really worth dwelling on. WS is open to almost all, and we aren't allowed to sleuth or speculate about members.

Most important thing, imo, is that I don't think the judge and assessors will be influenced by any factors except what they've heard in court. Hope so, anyway.

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I agree… but I find it sad and a little maddening that we inadvertently assisted OP in his Defence.

'Prosecutors have twisted the facts to discredit South African athlete Oscar Pistorius in his murder trial, his lawyer has said in closing remarks.

Barry Roux said the double amputee should have faced a lesser charge of culpable homicide over the shooting of his girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp.'

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-28698887

'Oscar Pistorius thanked his family and those who have 'picked me up through everything' after the judge retired to consider her verdict in his murder trial.
Both teams of lawyers wrapped up their cases today at the end of a months-long case that has seen Pistorius vomit, retch and break down in tears on several occasions in court.'

'Prosecutor Gerrie Nel ended proceedings by making a final plea for the South African athlete to 'face the consequences' of shooting dead his girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...e-convince-judge-innocence.html#ixzz39osmimWe

'Oscar Pistorius murder trial: The case for and against'

Defence
'It is up to the state to prove that Oscar Pistorius knew Reeva Steenkamp was behind the bathroom door, and that he fired through it with the intention of killing her. They have not done so......'

Prosecution
'Throughout the course of this trial, Mr Pistorius has changed his defence on several occasions, yet none of these different defences show him to be not guilty of murder.'

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...r-trial-the-case-for-and-against-9653153.html

zwiebel said:

'Prosecutors have twisted the facts to discredit South African athlete Oscar Pistorius in his murder trial, his lawyer has said in closing remarks.

Barry Roux said the double amputee should have faced a lesser charge of culpable homicide over the shooting of his girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp.'

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-28698887

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RBBM

The silly thing about that statement is that at any time he could have accepted culpability and plead guilty to culpable homicide. Perhaps the State may have once considered a plea deal - but Roux, or Oscar, or perhaps both placed their bets on a full acquittal which was unlikely at even the outset, imo, and much less likely since his rather damning testimony. Now CH seems like the best bet (for the defence)...were it not for those blood-curdling screams (which were the very reason the State ever pursued a murder charge in the first place).

All JMO

Hi, I haven't been watching too much but what is going on regarding Fresco?

@BBCAndrewH
Oscar Pistorius's father told me he thought defence arguments went well. Uncle Arnold even more upbeat.

https://mobile.twitter.com/BBCAndrewH/tweets

zwiebel said:

'Oscar Pistorius murder trial: The case for and against'

Defence
'It is up to the state to prove that Oscar Pistorius knew Reeva Steenkamp was behind the bathroom door, and that he fired through it with the intention of killing her. They have not done so......'

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...r-trial-the-case-for-and-against-9653153.html

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But that's not true, is it?

It makes no difference whether he knew it was her or not. Not to the charge of murder.

See HoA 219.

@BBCAndrewH
My sense from various conversations... Prosecution thinks it's got murder (dolus eventualis) in the bag. Defence hoping culpable homicide.

https://mobile.twitter.com/BBCAndrewH/tweets

I am just 1 hour into Nel's closing --- he is ah-mazing. All details, all pieces of evidence no matter how small... wonder if I should listen to Roux's at all... thoughts?

According to Sky’s Alex Crawford, Pistorius’ family clearly thought Roux was successful. There was much hugging, smiling and kissing and they were slapping Roux on his back and shaking his hand after the conclusion.

She then had a brief exchange with Arnold Pistorius:

Alex:” How do you think it’s gone?”

Arnold: “It’s like watching a Mercedes car against a Fiat.”

Alex: “Do you think he’s done enough?”

Arnold: “Oh yes, more than enough. I want him (gesturing towards Oscar) back in the Olympics.”

Alex:” Really, do you think that’s possible?”

Arnold:” I flippin’ hope so.”

zwiebel said:

'Prosecutors have twisted the facts to discredit South African athlete Oscar Pistorius in his murder trial, his lawyer has said in closing remarks.

Barry Roux said the double amputee should have faced a lesser charge of culpable homicide over the shooting of his girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp.'

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-28698887

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Did anyone ever got the impression that OP wanted to plead culpable homicide during the trial?! What the heck is this??

I haven't had the chance to listen to Roux's closing myself yet, but from what I've read here it doesn't look good for the defense.

Roux admits to OP's guilt of the Tasha's incident in the 11th hour during his very last opportunity to address the court, because it was glaringly clear that charge had been proven beyond any reasonable doubt. He probably thought it would look better for OP to finally accept responsibility for something, but I personally think it hurts him at this late stage because the motive is clear, and also proves he lied under oath. OP adamantly denied having his finger on the trigger. Now he admits he obviously did.

Roux argued against murder by seemingly accepting that the court may find him negligent and guilty of CH. I'm astounded that he didn't steadfastly maintain that he was acting in PPD, even though it's common knowledge that firing four rounds into a tiny cubicle through closed door without knowing who is behind it is negligent as hell. Still, if his defense is PPD, Roux should have not blurred the lines by admitting to Masipa she may find him negligent.

Roux tried to explain the DT's reasoning behind not entering scream tests into evidence because after the ear witness testimonies he felt it was unnecessary? Which makes absolutely no sense whatsoever when they ALL unequivocally said they heard a woman. It was stupid on his part to proclaim to the court in the first place that he would prove he screams like a woman, and then even stupider to not produce the evidence.

Was an affidavit signed by OP's father regarding the ammo submitted in the 11th hour too, as was suggested yesterday?

Maybe I'll change my view once I watch the closing in its entirety, but somehow I doubt it.

I think it's safe to say at this point OP is going to jail.

MOO

Giles said:

According to Sky’s Alex Crawford, Pistorius’ family clearly thought Roux was successful. There was much hugging, smiling and kissing and they were slapping Roux on his back and shaking his hand after the conclusion.

She then had a brief exchange with Arnold Pistorius:

Alex:” How do you think it’s gone?”

Arnold: “It’s like watching a Mercedes car against a Fiat.”

Alex: “Do you think he’s done enough?”

Arnold: “Oh yes, more than enough. I want him (gesturing towards Oscar) back in the Olympics.”

Alex:” Really, do you think that’s possible?”

Arnold:” I flippin’ hope so.”

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BIB - Delusional