VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #6

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Oddsocks said:
I am still so hung up on the footage where Wg ducks around the corner and then follows Hannah.
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This is where I'm at, after my Wertland Rampage Theory. WG's action was so classically strange, and I feel like its being discounted so quickly. If i watched that video 100 times, I would key in on him every time.
 
But that doesn't mean it's because he has been refusing to participate. It just means they haven't interviewed him yet.
 
otto said:
Why wouldn't she be texting about the party from in his car? Maybe she told him she was going to a party but couldn't find the address. Maybe he offered to help, or said he was going to the same party? She was visibly intoxicated, so she probably was not thinking straight. Maybe they went into Tempo to buy a bottle of wine for the party, each had a small glass, they put the top back on, and got in the car to go to the party.

"• After 1:08 a.m. Graham and a man with dreadlocks enter Tempo Restaurant & Bar on Fifth Street Southeast. He buys alcohol, they stay 15 minutes and leave together.

• 1:20 a.m. Graham texts friends, "I'm coming to a party...but I'm lost." It was the last time she had contact with anyone. If her phone pinpointed her location, police have not released the information, and police did not clarify whether the text was sent before or after leaving the bar."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/09/19/missing-virginia-student/15890571/
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Hi Otto, it's me again:seeya:
My theory: They enter Tempo, she goes to use the restroom and leaves her phone on the table/bar with JM. Her friend texts her-"Hey what's up? Where are you?"- JM texts back the "coming to a party, lost at 14th and Wertland" thing to make her friends think she's on her way but is held up, yada yada, knowing 14th & Wertland is an area frequented by students. This pacifies the friends for awhile and buys some time. This would also account for the mixed accounts of "was she or wasn't she with him at Tempo." They did not stay long and part of the time she was in the restroom. Just another theory.......
 
I hear you but if you or I were in JM's shoes right now, we would find a way, I'm certain.
 
gitana1 said:
Thank you so much. I'm just finding out about this case and have some questions too if anyone can answer:

1. How many on here feel the POI is a good suspect and if so, why and how many are skeptical that he is involved and why?
2. Has anyone discussed the possibility that this gal was purposefully drugged?
3. What other cases in the area are you all talking about as possible links and why?

I don't know much but I did read about the black squares on the POI's FB page and that rubs me the wrong way. I do find it odd and creepy and sort of an FU.

I also heard that he noticed Hannah as she wandered around, circled behind her and then put his arm around her. I find that creepy too.

But I don't know much about this case and haven't formed an opinion yet. Hoping everyone can help get me up to speed.

You know, it is horrible to me that young people can simply be walking around a bit inebriated and just disappear, likely at the hands of a predator. If the predator is young, even worse in a way. Like young people can't feel safe with their peers.

Finally, if she was taken by someone on foot, how far could she be? And can't search dogs be used to track her from the last places seen on surveillance?
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They've used dogs, helicopters and today an estimated 1,500 boots on the ground:
For a full week there has been no sign or evidence found to suggest that HG is lost, injured, or deceased within the general City limits of Charlottesville. But, IMO, that detail suggests that she was likely taken away in a vehicle.
 
otto said:
She was tracked throughout the area from when she had dinner to Tempo. There's already so much footage showing her movements throughout the evening that it simply makes sense that if she left Tempo on foot, there would be footage. If she was dropped off somewhere, there would be footage. Let him lawyer up fast, and let him go to the police and tell them what happened. He claims that they left Tempo and parted ways. Where's the footage of her after she left Tempo restaurant?
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You're getting to the end of the mall by Tempo. There's no camera at Tempo, for instance, and may not be much available thereafter--fewer businesses, less traffic etc. I saw a post a few pages back that said LE had a video of JM driving away from the mall. I would think they'd be able to tell if he had someone with him? But of course, maybe not.

I do hope JM has lawyered up and is talking. We don't know that he hasn't. JMO
 
Oddsocks said:
I am still so hung up on the footage where Wg ducks around the corner and then follows Hannah.
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But WG (unlike JLM) came forward and called the tip lone BEFORE he was even identified in the footage. LE just hadn't gotten to his tip yet. That speaks volumes about him. It would have pretty impossible to identify him from the video

But JLM? He had an even more direct contact with Hannah, spoke with her (not just observed her as WG did). JLM was also more easy to identify based on the video. But even then, did he come forward? No. Even when he was met with a search warrant and his car seized, he clams up. A girls life is on the line - there is no body yet - she could just be missing and show up. IF he is innocent he could have info that could HELP the investigation and saved them THOUSANDS of hours of work,

But what does he do? Clam up, suddenly move, and never express a single concern for Hannah who he obviously met. I never met and neither did hundreds here but we all want to help find her. But JLM? Not so much.

Hmmm, I wonder why he does not want to help find her. What does he know that WE don't know yet?????
 
This is making me want to get off the grid and don a little tinfoil hat.

mo
TravelingBug said:
You'd think that if he (somehow) didn't know that, that someone would clue him in. :waitasec:

We've already had one WSer (who was here long before this case, so it isn't like someone who came as a result of it, and who was following the case before discovering a link) who discovered mutual FB friends with him.

And that's just from our pool of WS regulars who also happen to be following this particular case - there could well be more not following it and/or who haven't looked at his FB and seen his friends list to also notice connections!

Heck, I live on the opposite side of the country and he's got a FB friend I recognize (but don't actually know) who is a server at a place I eat at with some degree of regularity. And I only recognized the face, thought I was nuts (I mean, the POI lives on the other coast and w/ no real ties to the state I'm in), then saw more on that person's FB and where they worked, confirming it's the person I thought. :scared:

I'm sure the media and others are finding the same, especially since he's been in the same general area for a long time so relative locals tend to pay more attention and the odds of a common tie are far, far, far higher!

Only blocking his picture (someone had access to his account to do it - really doesn't even matter if it was him, a friend, a family member, etc) and leaving his friend list, etc. wide open is a little odd to me.

It's like an open invitation asking for trouble even if he's completely innocent because it gives names (and at least an indirect way) to contact others who could have known him - asking questions, perhaps having things shared that wouldn't be helpful (even if innocent) as people think back on things they recall about the person, or just giving more info out.

Heck, maybe that's how the DM got Grandma to give the "good boy" and "loves my [her] greens" quotes :happydance:

Just strange to me the pictures would be changed - especially since it's not like he/they locked things down enough for even THAT change not to show up on his wall. If the privacy was different, the picture changing could be noticed, but it wouldn't show to the public WHEN it was changed. It just looks more attention getting (at the least) this way.

It's just strange to me (and I realize you likely are thinking all the same things - just jumping off what you said :) ) but I'm also someone who finds the openness on some FB pages very odd (and naive) so who knows. LOL.
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leilarose68 said:
because it's a lot more complicated than that, and many LE just want someone to throw in jail + don't care if they're railroading an innocent guy. a lot of innocent black dudes are in this situation, unfortunately.
the POI quite rightly lawyered up, and will do what his lawyer tells him to do, as anyone who finds themselves involved in a crime situation should.
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I somehow seriously doubt that is going to happen in such a high-profile case. Based on the level of competence and compassion show by the police chief in his press conferences, you can be sure they are going to make sure that every "i" is dotted and every "t" is crossed here.

I just dont understand this level of mistrust where the police is concerned. Keep your nose clean, do what your suppposed to and live a good life and you shouldnt have anything to worry about.

IMO Dreads should have known better than to take an intoxicated underage girl out for a drink to start with. Its been my experience that guys typically dont do that unless they are expecting something in return.And that makes both him and motives suspect in my eyes regardless of race.

There are two sides to this case IMO and they arent black and white. They are right and wrong. If dreads is refusing to talk to the police then he's helping the wrong side.
 
I would find a way with legal representation which may take some arranging on both sides, especially with a massive search going on and presumably other avenues of investigation than a non-suspect (POI =/= suspect). I just take issue with assumptions that he is obstructing in some way with no proof of that.
 
I just want to say that at first I thought dreads guy was so super guilty. Now I am second guessing that based on context clues.

He has been named and his online presence could have been damning..but it isn't. Based on his online persona, he seems like someone I would be friend with.

This is all JMO. But personally I think he could very well be innocent and maybe whatever happened to Hannah has nothing to do with him.


OMG I just want her to be found.


And then again I look at all the missing people on this site and I wonder why have I (and others) given so much attention to Hannah and ignored them? Why do some missing people get media coverage and others get ignored?


Should I feel guilty for spending so much time on Hannah's case and less time on others?
 
Coldngrey said:
This is where I'm at, after my Wertland Rampage Theory. WG's action was so classically strange, and I feel like its being discounted so quickly. If i watched that video 100 times, I would key in on him every time.
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I'm not suggesting WG shouldn't still be looked into, but I am the one who stays in the store and watches the unattended baby stroller while the mom is off shopping in the aisles; and my husband and I once stopped to stay with a college girl with car trouble on the side of the road until the person she called arrived. I think I'm on here too much. ;)
 
otto said:
She was tracked throughout the area from when she had dinner to Tempo. There's already so much footage showing her movements throughout the evening that it simply makes sense that if she left Tempo on foot, there would be footage. If she was dropped off somewhere, there would be footage. Let him lawyer up fast, and let him go to the police and tell them what happened. He claims that they left Tempo and parted ways. Where's the footage of her after she left Tempo restaurant?
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I don't believe she had dinner at Tempo. She ate with friends at another restaurant. I think the only time that night she was in Tempo was with JM. I also remember reading Tempo does not have cameras.
 
ptandj said:
But that doesn't mean it's because he has been refusing to participate. It just means they haven't interviewed him yet.
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Respectfully, that is one of the first things LE does in an investigation. They don't wait until he knows what evidence they have.
 
And I like Longo, but his PC yesterday reeked of a witch hunt. If I am POI and I'm thinking of talking, after the Sheriff throws me to the wolves like that, I'm not saying anything until I have a competent attorney.
 
zapped said:
I somehow seriously doubt that is going to happen in such a high-profile case. Based on the level of competence and compassion show by the police chief in his press conferences, you can be sure they are going to make sure that every "i" is dotted and every "t" is crossed here.

I just dont understand this level of mistrust where the police is concerned. Keep your nose clean, do what your suppposed to and live a good life and you shouldnt have anything to worry about.

IMO Dreads should have known better than to take an intoxicated underage girl out for a drink to start with. Its been my experience that guys typically dont do that unless they are expecting something in return.
Click to expand...

BBM. What a nice idea! How I wish it was reality in this country.
 
leilarose68 said:
because it's a lot more complicated than that, and many LE just want someone to throw in jail + don't care if they're railroading an innocent guy. a lot of innocent black dudes are in this situation, unfortunately.
the POI quite rightly lawyered up, and will do what his lawyer tells him to do, as anyone who finds themselves involved in a crime situation should.
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Do you have a link to the fact that he has a lawyer?
 
SheltieMom1 said:
User Actions
Via Twitter, 2 minutes ago:

Rick Boone
‏@RickBooneFOX5DC
Person of interest apt in the #HannahGraham. Friends and family taking clothing and boxes out the apt. Jessie Matthew not seen.@fox5newsdc
Virginia, US
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There was a planned move from that building before this happened; maybe that's who's moving?
 
I am sure that LE is presently reviewing any/ all possible video footage from businesses/ private residences to ascertain the path of Matthews car after it left the mall area to see where it could possibly have travelled and to compare this with his explanation ( if one was given)...his car may not have shown up at hessian hills until a day later for all we know...
I am sure that LE is working with a lot of evidence that they are keeping close to their chest...if this POI is indeed innocent than his alibi should match up with concrete evidence ( ie...video recording of his car and himself at a place he said he was etc.)
It takes time for this information to become available...I am reminded if the Mickey Schunick case and the eventual corroboration of his truck recorded leaving the area...
If this POI is in fact the suspect there will undoubtedly be a lot of evidence that can help to ascertain a conviction...which is what Chief Longor emphasized is the desired result...
I have faith that there is much more that has been collected that we, as the public, are not privy to, but that will help provide a preponderance of evidence which will switch the term from" POI " to " Suspect" ....

As always, continued prayers of strength to Hannah's family and friends and those of us who care...
May there be justice for this beautiful, innocent young girl...
 
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