JLM: Morgan Harrington/Fairfax Rape Victim - *Forensic Link* to MH #2

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jbowman55 said:
ETA: Plug these coordinates into Google Maps and tell me what you think this is, ok? 38.00563,-78.461263
Click to expand...

Sorry if this has been answered, but that's an area that has recently (in the last five years?) been sold to Monticello. I imagine it's highly secured. However, it was a spot high on my list early on, particularly once they hit Carter's Mountain, in case there isn't much security.

There used to be houses on the top, and it was a beautiful place to live, overlooking the city. The residents held an annual Kite Day where locals would come fly kites and drink beer. No doubt JM would have been there some years. I assume LE has searched it or ruled it out due to security - one way in and one way out that is probably gated/has a security guard 24/7. But it might be worth a tip just in case.

EDIT: Looking at the Google map image, I see there is no security station....who's going to send this one in? Yikes!
 
Va. State Police Disputes Report That Jesse Matthew, Suspect in Hannah Graham Case, Questioned by Police in 2009
Friday, Oct 10, 2014 • Updated at 4:19 PM EDT

Virginia State Police disputes a report by NBC29 in Charlottesville, Virginia, that the prime suspect in the September 2014 disappearance of University of Virginia student Hannah Graham had been interviewed by police five years ago in connection with another missing young woman.
Report: Former Matthew taxi seized 2 weeks ago in Albemarle
Posted: Friday, October 10, 2014 9:05 am
RICHMOND TIMES-DISPATCH

State police spokeswoman Corinne Geller initially declined to comment, but later released a statement saying in part that “inaccurate information was released today by certain media outlets citing unnamed ‘sources’ regarding the Morgan Harrington investigation. Jesse L. Matthew Jr. was never interviewed in 2009 by state police in connection with the Morgan Harrington investigation.”

[...]

“Release of information from anyone other than the Virginia State Police concerning this case is not official nor factually confirmed,” Geller said. “The Harrington family and public deserve accurate representation of the facts of this case. State police will release new information at a time and in a manner that does not jeopardize the integrity of this ongoing, complex criminal investigation.”
 
On misinformation and the media frenzy around the Hannah Graham case
Courteney Stuart
10/10/14 at 1:34 PM

[...]

That didn’t stop the host of the show I was on from using those reports to draw an even more shocking—and utterly baseless—conclusion: that police have always known Morgan got into a cab driven by Matthew that night, but were somehow so bumbling that they let him get away. This is patently false, a statement released by Virginia State Police spokesperson Corinne Geller late last night attempted to set the record straight.

“Jesse L. Matthew Jr. was never interviewed in 2009 by state police in connection with the Morgan Harrington investigation,” she wrote, urging media to wait for official confirmation on such information before releasing it to the public. “The Harrington family and public deserve accurate representation of the facts of this case,” she wrote.

cont. at the link.
Excellent reading. Thanks for the link, wall0214.

Emphasis is mine.
 
snipped:
R.U.Kidding! said:
I had watched the MH case very closely and totally agree with your review of the facts. At NO time was it ever mentioned she was seen getting into a cab. There was a father and daughter who saw her when the father was dropping his daughter off, but when the father came back over the bridge on return she was GONE.
Click to expand...

R.U.Kidding!'s account coincides exactly with my memory of the events surrounding Morgan's disappearance. (I believe the man's daughter was a student at UVa.) When he drove by that spot again (after dropping off his daughter), Morgan was gone. I too followed Morgan's case closely at the time, and now am sadly doing so again.

My thoughts and prayers for her family as well as Hannah Graham's.
 
Pacific2011 said:
snipped:
R.U.Kidding! said:
]I had watched the MH case very closely and totally agree with your review of the facts. At NO time was it ever mentioned she was seen getting into a cab. There was a father and daughter who saw her when the father was dropping his daughter off, but when the father came back over the bridge on return she was GONE.
Click to expand...

R.U.Kidding!'s account coincides exactly with my memory of the events surrounding Morgan's disappearance. (I believe the man's daughter was a student at UVa.) When he drove by that spot again (after dropping off his daughter), Morgan was gone. I too followed Morgan's case closely at the time, and now am sadly doing so again.

My thoughts and prayers for her family as well as Hannah Graham's.
Click to expand...

Pacific2011, awareness is the key. It may not have been discussed on websleuths that MH was seen getting into a cab, but imo it was likely known by investigators and possibly MH's family in confidence. According to JM's coworkers this info was known to them and they reported JM's resemblance and bizarre behavior to authorities soon after MH's disappearance.. Evidently investigators held this very significant info close to their vest, imo..

This is only one example of of many, why the antiquated close to the vest investigative strategy of silence only causes other innocent victim's lives lost and mounting cold cases; 'the silent epidemic'.. When will they learn that the American public is their most valuable investigative resource? We are in the age of communications.
"Silence & misinformation by LE via MSM/Internet Social Media is the Predator's most lethal weapon"... jmo
<sniped & BBM>

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20861122,00.html

Police Seize Cab Hannah Graham Suspect Drove the Night Morgan Harrington Disappeared

Melvin Carter, Jr., of Carter's Taxi, told NBC29 that a Charlottesville detective told him Harrington had gotten into a taxi the night she vanished.

"[They] said, 'Yes, she did jump into a taxi cab her last time being seen alive,' " said Carter.

When Harrington disappeared, Matthew's former co-workers told CBS 6 News that they reported to investigators that they would joke with Matthew, saying he resembled a sketch of the man linked to a 2005 rape in Fairfax &#8211; as well as to the man linked to Harrington. While they said Matthew would sometimes shrug it off, he would also "get visibly upset and disappear for hours," reports CBS 6 WTVR

When Harrington disappeared, Matthew's former co-workers told CBS 6 News that they reported to investigators that they would joke with Matthew, saying he resembled a sketch of the man linked to a 2005 rape in Fairfax &#8211; as well as to the man linked to Harrington. While they said Matthew would sometimes shrug it off, he would also "get visibly upset and disappear for hours," reports CBS 6 WTVR.

Gil Harrington speaks at 6 min 30 secs into video - heartwrenching - candlelight vigil on the Cape Fear riverfront 2010 - CUE National Missing Person conference.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qN878keA6K0

CUE<Community United Effort--> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5rB2LTw1j4
 
'Strike Two': 19 months before Hannah Graham was abducted:

http://wtvr.com/2013/02/20/morgan-harringtons-family-urges-student-to-go-to-cops/
CHARLOTTESVILLE, Va. (WTVR) &#8212; The family of Morgan Harrington is asking a University of Virginia student to go to police - POSTED FEBRUARY 20, 2013,

The anonymous student reported being nearly sexually assaulted Sunday by a cab driver. She reported giving directions to her apartment but was instead taken somewhere else and was able to escape.

The Harringtons believe the anonymous student could help protect others and help in the case of their daughter.
<sniped - read more>
 
Foxfire said:
'Strike Two': 19 months before Hannah Graham was abducted:

http://wtvr.com/2013/02/20/morgan-harringtons-family-urges-student-to-go-to-cops/
CHARLOTTESVILLE, Va. (WTVR) &#8212; The family of Morgan Harrington is asking a University of Virginia student to go to police - POSTED FEBRUARY 20, 2013,

The anonymous student reported being nearly sexually assaulted Sunday by a cab driver. She reported giving directions to her apartment but was instead taken somewhere else and was able to escape.

The Harringtons believe the anonymous student could help protect others and help in the case of their daughter.
<sniped - read more>
Click to expand...

Isn't this the short guy with an accent?
 
FYI-
Today's schedule for CUE's On the road to Remember for Awareness
Lovingston VA 10am
Charlottesville VA 1pm
Fredericksburg VA 5pm

https://www.facebook.com/events/1527388374175127/
CUE Center For Missing Persons is on the road for the 11th year for its annual National Road to Remember tour! This event page is for the Charlottesville Virginia rally stop that will be held in honor of Dashad "Sage" Smith and Bonnie Santiago, as Monica Caison and her Virginia State Directors join with families and supporters on this nationwide journey to bring awareness and support for missing persons and unsolved homicides and their loved ones left behind.
 
Evie Ivy Over said:
I'm afraid that it's going to be revealed that an alarming amount of information relative to these cases has been withheld from the public.
Click to expand...

I understand your reasoning here (LE's failure to appreciate the contribution the public can make) and can only hope (with apologies!) that you're wrong... if you are correct, vital clues and testimony may well have been lost forever. Perhaps there were eyewitnesses to the alleged cab ride who have long since forgotten what they saw, given the information actually released about MH's last known sightings. I'm mindful, too, that -- if I recall correctly -- the Harringtons complained that LE was playing the game too close to its chest... I am hoping that LE plays stuff close to the chest whenever necessary to avoid compromising the prosecution, but releases information that might prove helpful in locating the victims.
 
Further to the conversation that started in the Hannah Search thread:

What if JM didn't know where MH was? What if he held her captive somewhere close to where she was found? She managed to escape, but then died on the way back to civilization? He didn't necessarily have to know that she'd escaped until the next time he came to wherever she was, perhaps thinking that she was secure enough and there was no way she COULD escape. What a shock that would have been, eh?

With a question like this it becomes really important to know more about MH's broken bones. A poster here on WS stated that the only way to tell if bones were broken before death would be to examine them microscopically to see if any healing had taken place. I wonder if that was done.

I don't necessarily hold all this as a personal opinion, but the thoughts occurred to me so I am putting them out for discussion.
 
jbowman55 said:
Further to the conversation that started in the Hannah Search thread:

What if JM didn't know where MH was? What if he held her captive somewhere close to where she was found? She managed to escape, but then died on the way back to civilization? He didn't necessarily have to know that she'd escaped until the next time he came to wherever she was, perhaps thinking that she was secure enough and there was no way she COULD escape. What a shock that would have been, eh?

With a question like this it becomes really important to know more about MH's broken bones. A poster here on WS stated that the only way to tell if bones were broken before death would be to examine them microscopically to see if any healing had taken place. I wonder if that was done.

I don't necessarily hold all this as a personal opinion, but the thoughts occurred to me so I am putting them out for discussion.
Click to expand...

Someone said there were signs that JLM had re-visited the site where MH was discovered partly buried in a shallow grave. Not having seen the crime scene photos, I can't confirm that.

As for tests of when the bones were broken - would that information have been released? Usually, that kind of information is not released until a trial...by witness testimony of the pathologist. Is that correct?
 
Evie Ivy Over said:
I'm afraid that it's going to be revealed that an alarming amount of information relative to these cases has been withheld from the public.
Click to expand...

Take it from someone whose family has been dealing with law enforcement in Virginia for 28 years in the Colonial Parkway Murders-- this is how LE plays it. Cards close to the vest, need to know, whatever you want to call it, somehow law enforcement have decided that they don't trust the public. So they don't tell the public what they are looking for, the years go by, memories fade and people move on. And we wonder why cases go cold? We can only hope that the Morgan Harrington (and related cases) investigation continues to move forward, that eventually there is a trial and that some of this comes out. Only then can we begin to change the bizarre notion that public servants don't trust the very public they serve.

Bill Thomas
Brother of Cathleen Thomas
Colonial Parkway Murders
 
Foxfire said:
Pacific2011 said:
snipped:

Pacific2011, awareness is the key. It may not have been discussed on websleuths that MH was seen getting into a cab, but imo it was likely known by investigators and possibly MH's family in confidence. According to JM's coworkers this info was known to them and they reported JM's resemblance and bizarre behavior to authorities soon after MH's disappearance.. Evidently investigators held this very significant info close to their vest, imo..

This is only one example of of many, why the antiquated close to the vest investigative strategy of silence only causes other innocent victim's lives lost and mounting cold cases; 'the silent epidemic'.. When will they learn that the American public is their most valuable investigative resource? We are in the age of communications.
"Silence & misinformation by LE via MSM/Internet Social Media is the Predator's most lethal weapon"... jmo
<sniped & BBM>

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20861122,00.html

Police Seize Cab Hannah Graham Suspect Drove the Night Morgan Harrington Disappeared

Melvin Carter, Jr., of Carter's Taxi, told NBC29 that a Charlottesville detective told him Harrington had gotten into a taxi the night she vanished.

"[They] said, 'Yes, she did jump into a taxi cab her last time being seen alive,' " said Carter.

When Harrington disappeared, Matthew's former co-workers told CBS 6 News that they reported to investigators that they would joke with Matthew, saying he resembled a sketch of the man linked to a 2005 rape in Fairfax – as well as to the man linked to Harrington. While they said Matthew would sometimes shrug it off, he would also "get visibly upset and disappear for hours," reports CBS 6 WTVR

When Harrington disappeared, Matthew's former co-workers told CBS 6 News that they reported to investigators that they would joke with Matthew, saying he resembled a sketch of the man linked to a 2005 rape in Fairfax – as well as to the man linked to Harrington. While they said Matthew would sometimes shrug it off, he would also "get visibly upset and disappear for hours," reports CBS 6 WTVR.

Gil Harrington speaks at 6 min 30 secs into video - heartwrenching - candlelight vigil on the Cape Fear riverfront 2010 - CUE National Missing Person conference.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qN878keA6K0

CUE<Community United Effort--> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5rB2LTw1j4
Click to expand...

I hate to say this, but I think we've all heard of some tactics used by LE that may not be totally on the up-and-up. I wonder if an investigator may actually have told Carter that MH was seen getting into a cab, even though it wasn't true, as a means of getting information he/she thought wouldn't otherwise be gotten?
Click to expand...
 
billthom56 said:
Take it from someone whose family has been dealing with law enforcement in Virginia for 28 years in the Colonial Parkway Murders-- this is how LE plays it. Cards close to the vest, need to know, whatever you want to call it, somehow law enforcement have decided that they don't trust the public.....

Bill Thomas
Brother of Cathleen Thomas
Colonial Parkway Murders
Click to expand...

Mr. Thomas, thanks so much for your enlightening post. I am confident that I can speak for everyone on this board in expressing our heartfelt sympathy and condolences for your loss.

--Bryan
 
billthom56 said:
Take it from someone whose family has been dealing with law enforcement in Virginia for 28 years in the Colonial Parkway Murders-- this is how LE plays it. Cards close to the vest, need to know, whatever you want to call it, somehow law enforcement have decided that they don't trust the public. So they don't tell the public what they are looking for, the years go by, memories fade and people move on. And we wonder why cases go cold? We can only hope that the Morgan Harrington (and related cases) investigation continues to move forward, that eventually there is a trial and that some of this comes out. Only then can we begin to change the bizarre notion that public servants don't trust the very public they serve.

Bill Thomas
Brother of Cathleen Thomas
Colonial Parkway Murders
Click to expand...

Thank you for being here and sharing your experience and knowledge of how things go. I'm so sorry for your loss and the torment that must cause. You have my sympathy and admiration for your resilience.
 
I've been spending some time reading up on the MH case, and one thing that piqued interest was the fire on Sutherland Rd. the night before MH was found. I wonder if JM may have been at that property as a cab driver to give someone a ride to the airport, or for any other reason? Or to take someone out to Anchorage Farms for one of the parties that are reported to have been fairly frequent? Just thinking that he may have come on the radar during the investigation of that fire.
 
Foxfire said:
snipped:

Pacific2011, awareness is the key. It may not have been discussed on websleuths that MH was seen getting into a cab, but imo it was likely known by investigators and possibly MH's family in confidence. According to JM's coworkers this info was known to them and they reported JM's resemblance and bizarre behavior to authorities soon after MH's disappearance.. Evidently investigators held this very significant info close to their vest, imo..
Click to expand...

WHAT!!! Are you saying that this Melvin Carter made this statement at the time of Morgans disappearance and the co-workers were joking with JM about his likness to the Sketch,,even as the public was blissfully unaware of any of this????

I know through ALL of my reading this two statements were never conveyed to the public......and why on God's green earth would they withhold that kind of info?? ....and why would the Harringtons allow them to keep this quite. Surely they did not want another girl getting into a CAB??

I remember the frustration we all felt with the lack of information forthcoming from LE, but if this was withheld then Virginia Law Enforcement has some serious culpability in the MH case as well as the HG case. In fact had they released that info there is a good chance HG would not be missing----UGH!!!
 
Evie Ivy Over said:
I hate to say this, but I think we've all heard of some tactics used by LE that may not be totally on the up-and-up. I wonder if an investigator may actually have told Carter that MH was seen getting into a cab, even though it wasn't true, as a means of getting information he/she thought wouldn't otherwise be gotten?
Click to expand...

Further, many people believe that forensics means DNA means irrefutable scientific proof. Not so. It has been proven that it is actually engineer a crime scene and plant DNA. Not saying that is case here, but frankly JM has already been condemned in the absence of any sort of crime scene in either case. Just something to think about. LE is trying to find support in proving their case beyond reasonable doubt; it is neither objective nor scientific. Evidence that may weaken their case should be considered and discounted as a means to validate or test their basic theory, just because that info is not shared does not mean it is in any way irrelevant or invalid. Furthermore, when police cannot even locate a body or crime scene, there should be full disclosure. IMO

See this article for starters: https://www.prisonlegalnews.org/new...-shoddy-forensics-used-to-secure-convictions/
 
I read an article this morning that contained an interview with Gil Harrington. She said they know the cause of Morgan's death but have been asked not to reveal it publicly. I've always wondered--mostly because of Gil's blog writings and Jane Vance's painting and poem tribute to Morgan that is titled "The Hunted"-- if indeed MH was hunted down.

Since Morgan's remains were skeletonized, the cause of death would have to be something radical and something that her bones would reveal. I have always wondered if she had been shot.

Perhaps the police found the gun used in Morgan's murder when they searched JM's apartment and car. Just my opinion.

http://www.roanoke.com/news/crime/r...cle_86e9e9da-4d9f-54ff-9f2c-e8ffa88c9712.html

http://www.roanoke.com/arts_and_ent...cle_9280c428-fb8b-50cf-a3b6-8d733477a35e.html
 
Moonchime said:
I read an article this morning that contained an interview with Gil Harrington. She said they know the cause of Morgan's death but have been asked not to reveal it publicly. I've always wondered--mostly because of Gil's blog writings and Jane Vance's painting and poem tribute to Morgan that is titled "The Hunted"-- if indeed MH was hunted down.

Since Morgan's remains were skeletonized, the cause of death would have to be something radical and something that her bones would reveal. I have always wondered if she had been shot.

Perhaps the police found the gun used in Morgan's murder when they searched JM's apartment and car. Just my opinion.

http://www.roanoke.com/news/crime/r...cle_86e9e9da-4d9f-54ff-9f2c-e8ffa88c9712.html

http://www.roanoke.com/arts_and_ent...cle_9280c428-fb8b-50cf-a3b6-8d733477a35e.html
Click to expand...

No cause of death has ever been released by the medical examiner, but her death has been ruled a homicide. From what I have read, this means not natural causes, but I don't think shooting was involved.

Sorry to be so graphic, but it is reported that most of the bones in her body were crushed. At first I thought she may have been left there and then was hurt by farming equipment (non-intentional), but not so because she was found in the only field in which the hay had not been harvested, so it was waist high. Whoever did this knew that property well in advance. I shudder to think what might have crushed her ...horrible!
 
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