Sentencing and beyond- Jodi Arias General Discussion #3

ElleElle said:

Ok... re-reading JAs manifesto.

I keep seeing her talk about her singing the National anthem. TA was supposed to go and she seems very, very upset by that. Maybe that's what motivated her to plot her road trip?

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I still think it was the new love interest TA was enthralled by that was JA's breaking point. Not that I don't think she had made backup plans, like the tape and pics, but that last week or so when she found out about the new interest was when I think she saw her control over him was gone(May 26) and she just couldn't let him have the last word("still hate me, brat?!").

Val1 said:

I still think it was the new love interest TA was enthralled by that was JA's breaking point. Not that I don't think she had made backup plans, like the tape and pics, but that last week or so when she found out about the new interest was when I think she saw her control over him was gone(May 26) and she just couldn't let him have the last word("still hate me, brat?!").

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There goes my Tgiving break resolution...


Don't think the killer knew about T's last flirt. He'd cut off the killer's access to his SM accounts by or on May 26th.

I'm increasingly convinced Lisa is the only woman the killer ever saw as a real threat. Months ago I thought Taylor, T's BF, was off in saying Travis had genuinely been in love with Lisa, and was in the process of trying to make his way back to her when he was slaughtered.

Now I'm convinced Taylor was right. And that the killer was well aware that Travis genuinely loved Lisa.

MistyM said:

remind me never to get on your bad side, LOL. you have very imaginative yet sneaky ways of offing people!

:noooo:​

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It took me a few seconds to realize you were kidding me....Well, sort of kidding. .I momentarily thought I'd better write an apology. LMAO.

Most of the examples of offing people have already been done.... There's the "do it to your brand new hubby while on your honeymoon out on a hike" motif, the "toss the girl over the edge" motif, the "drive off the cliff motif", there's the "bonk on the head and pretend it's a widowmaker" motif, the "oops he was taking a photo at Crater Lake and got onto a cornice which happened to drop into the lake" motif, there's the "burning a lantern in a tent and causing death by carbon monoxide poisoning" motif, the "car slipped in the rain" motif... Note how many of these involve a camera....

Also, in the long drives to the Oregon coast and Crater Lake, I'd get so worried about driving off the edge myself, or being held up by rock slides, or picnicking under hanging boughs, not to mention getting kidnapped by Charles Manson, running into a bad scene at a remote campground, or setting my tent on fire, that it's easy to imagine potential murder scenarios in those locations.

So, my imagination wasn't overly stretching in coming up with scenarios!

krkrjx said:

We know what TA's camera retailed for but do we know what he actually paid for it? Maybe he got some kind of special deal...it happens. Granted, even with a deal it was probably more than a person struggling financially should spend, but I wonder if he really paid retail.

Do we know for sure?

He was not into photography. I mean, everyone takes photos and he traveled so a camera is not an odd possession but he was not into photography as a hobby or special interest so a less costly camera would have served him just fine. I have always wondered why he had the one he had.

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Do we only have Jodi's word for it that he bought a camera? We have the camera in the washing machine. Jodi's?

Wing Ding said:

LOL! If there was a post of the month award, yours would win the Blue Ribbon, Hez.

Margaret Hamilton will get Jodi for that gaffe. And her little DOG, tooooo!

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In lieu of a Blue Ribbon, I would say this is a "Mean Green Witch Award". Maybe we should have such a thing? Do we have a mean green witch emoticon?

ElleElle said:

They were supposed to check off places in 1000 Places to Visit ... JA was in a different world. There is no way TA would of visit her. So, she had to go visit him.

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Something (maybe esoteric) just occurred to me, in all the time they knew each other or were "dating" before she moved to Mesa, she used to drive to Mesa frequently from what I understand, to check up on, see if he was messing with other people, etc., but once she leaves Mesa in early April of '08, she never makes a trip back, in almost 2 months, until she comes to kill him.

We know she planned the murder for a while, maybe back in March (taking his journal, leaving Zach's camera in the BMW, blowing up the BMW, whatever else she was doing then) and according to Ryan they planned her trip to do the last night of the Utah convention and see him for about 2 weeks before - but since she and Travis were still communicating, why didn't she ever drive down to see him or even spy on him? Can't wait till the May/June texts come out, hopefully it'll shed some light on this.

RickshawFan said:

Do we only have Jodi's word for it that he bought a camera? We have the camera in the washing machine. Jodi's?

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His roommate Zach knew he was going to buy one, Zach is a photographer and T asked his advice, Zach used a Sony which is why Travis bought one. The date he bought it is on the Resolving thread, in late April iirc.

geevee said:

Something (maybe esoteric) just occurred to me, in all the time they knew each other or were "dating" before she moved to Mesa, she used to drive to Mesa frequently from what I understand, to check up on, see if he was messing with other people, etc., but once she leaves Mesa in early April of '08, she never makes a trip back, in almost 2 months, until she comes to kill him.

We know she planned the murder for a while, maybe back in March (taking his journal, leaving Zach's camera in the BMW, blowing up the BMW, whatever else she was doing then) and according to Ryan they planned her trip to do the last night of the Utah convention and see him for about 2 weeks before - but since she and Travis were still communicating, why didn't she ever drive down to see him or even spy on him? Can't wait till the May/June texts come out, hopefully it'll shed some light on this.

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She didn't drive to spy because she was broke & because she was hacking in to his SM accounts, and because she was busy learning then using the tech to set him up.

Happy Thanksgiving, Geevee.....and all.

b_lab7410 said:

No wonder she needs the migraine meds; she's consistently determined about blunting her guilty body language. She's also panicking and getting mentally drained with purpose by Det Flores. The suspect maintaining such distance aides in controlling (target's) line of questioning I suppose...if they're a narcissist.

She couldn't do that with the female Det., whom wasn't as soft-spoken, and came across as generally concerned yet uninterested in her day-to-day/moment to moment imagination. Jodi's incessant fairy-tale sequence of events had nowhere to go (this Det. sure was good contrast, as were women like Dr. Demarte, Deanna, Lisa, and Mimi I thought, for that inferiority complex of her's that she tries to conceal so well).

At any moment Detective Flores could have found an opening. The predator had to mask her own vulnerabilities, pathological lying. Without context, no one can tell WHAT truths are being mixed in with her lies. I tend to believe she makes it up as she goes along as long as it sticks to her general sense of not wanting her image tarnished to her family, co-workers, friends. Yes, I know, no one of merit in those categories.

Flores asks, "So, did you kill him?" If she were remotely emotional, she'd have to act like a normal person and display genuine tears, shock, fear, etc etc. She can't do that and exudes no feeling. The threat of getting caught did do enough to indicate she was unstable IMO though. Like the detectives don't know her methods are a byproduct of not wanting anyone to get the better of her and/or discover her actual motivations. Any of the 30 cop dramas on tv could tell you, masking emotions and talking for five years are ALSO pretty obvious signs that you are guilty.

MY thing is, being trapped alone in a room having a 'conversation' with her, wow. :notgood: Detective Flores :therethere:

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Great post. And yes, the atmosphere in that interrogation room was scary. No telling what that woman would do, and it's a very claustrophobic and stripped down room: just Flores and Arias, that's it. I would imagine there was a live witness behind the glass, and of course EF is a crack shot; they even discussed his weapon. But still, that was close quarters with a psychopath.

I would imagine EF loved the challenge professionally, but was personally drained....

As I think about it too, EF worked extremely hard in his time at Yreka. All in one day, he had that endless interrogation of Jodi, his interviews with Bill and Sandy, the stakeout and arrest of Jodi, he had to have been on the other side of the one-way glass watching Jodi when she was by herself in the interrogation room, he had to be coordinating with the woman detective (who doesn't get enough credit for her work, IMO), he might have had to bring and set up his own video player so they could have a back up, he had to be managing the search at the grandparents' house and making sure evidence was taken, recorded, and safeguarded, he was probably communicating with his boss in Mesa and maybe with JM.... That's all in one day! Crazy!

I'm guessing the next day he observed Jodi and the other detective, talked to Jodi himself, wound up the evidence collection and stuff, and then flew back to Mesa. Poop!

EF's pager went off during the interrogation. Do you think that was a fake-out? Do you think he signaled and had the woman detective dial the pager? To manipulate Jodi? To make it seem as though he has better things to do than to be talking to Jodi? That time is short and she'd better get with the program? That she's just a dime-a-dozen criminal and he has more cases he's working that might take his attention from her? If he didn't want interruptions, he would have had the pager on OFF.

EquallyDivided said:

Oh lord, I would love to see everything and anything relating to when CMJA was acting as her own counsel. Transcipts, video, audio depositions - you name it. That has to be a treasure trove of idiocy and an inflated sense of abilities, all crashing into the ocean!

FWIW wasnt_me: You are so spot on with my ideas and theories that we MAY BE twins separated at birth! Keep them coming!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk

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Nurmi talks about CMJA questioning Heather, her old pod mate, about the coded messages in those magazines. (you f--ked up, what you told my attorney) Nurmi said she was so proud of herself getting that poor girl to lie for her. But it was a waste of time because Juan tore the poor Heather up on cross and infuriated Arias. So she asked that her former counsel be reinstated. She had questioned Deanna a few days earlier I believe

Hope4More said:

There goes my Tgiving break resolution...

I'm increasingly convinced Lisa is the only woman the killer ever saw as a real threat. Months ago I thought Taylor, T's BF, was off in saying Travis had genuinely been in love with Lisa, and was in the process of trying to make his way back to her when he was slaughtered.

Now I'm convinced Taylor was right. And that the killer was well aware that Travis genuinely loved Lisa.

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Oh god! That is heartbreaking! I have to say, according to Chris & Sky he HAD in fact cheated on Lisa...um, I think w/JA? *vomit* He experienced some deep regret.

But that's just so sad if somehow they were going to end up making amends... I forget if the trial covered this or not. I don't know if I could do that, but Travis finding his true love? Yeah, THAT would certainly be the motive that would finally make sense.

Urg, I seriously need to start brining the turkey, I'm off folks! Happy T-Day!

geevee said:

Something (maybe esoteric) just occurred to me, in all the time they knew each other or were "dating" before she moved to Mesa, she used to drive to Mesa frequently from what I understand, to check up on, see if he was messing with other people, etc., but once she leaves Mesa in early April of '08, she never makes a trip back, in almost 2 months, until she comes to kill him.

We know she planned the murder for a while, maybe back in March (taking his journal, leaving Zach's camera in the BMW, blowing up the BMW, whatever else she was doing then) and according to Ryan they planned her trip to do the last night of the Utah convention and see him for about 2 weeks before - but since she and Travis were still communicating, why didn't she ever drive down to see him or even spy on him? Can't wait till the May/June texts come out, hopefully it'll shed some light on this.

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BBM ~ Me too. Something "sparked" inside of her to go there, and I don't think TA "guilted" her into it as she always says.

b_lab7410 said:

Oh god! That is heartbreaking! I have to say, according to Chris & Sky he HAD in fact cheated on Lisa...um, I think w/JA? *vomit* He experienced some deep regret.

But that's just so sad if somehow they were going to end up making amends... I forget if the trial covered this or not. I don't know if I could do that, but Travis finding his true love? Yeah, THAT would certainly be the motive that would finally make sense.

Urg, I seriously need to start brining the turkey, I'm off folks! Happy T-Day!

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Is there any evidence that JA and TA had sex while Travis was dating Lisa?

Also, one thing on Interrogation Tape #1 got my attention this evening. Jodi said she knew they started "dating" in early February 2007 (3rd?). She says Travis always maintained he had no idea when they began dating.

I think Jodi slipped up. What I got out of this is I don't think TA even thought of their relationship in dating terms..... In fact, they never went on a single "date", no dinner at a restaurant, no movie, no tickets to a baseball game..... Everything they did, as far as I can tell, she had to pay her share.

Hope4More said:

There goes my Tgiving break resolution...


Don't think the killer knew about T's last flirt. He'd cut off the killer's access to his SM accounts by or on May 26th.

I'm increasingly convinced Lisa is the only woman the killer ever saw as a real threat. Months ago I thought Taylor, T's BF, was off in saying Travis had genuinely been in love with Lisa, and was in the process of trying to make his way back to her when he was slaughtered.

Now I'm convinced Taylor was right. And that the killer was well aware that Travis genuinely loved Lisa.

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Perhaps you should reread one of your own older posts...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-Alexander-s-Journals-and-text-messages/page2
" And she knew that he had met a sexy very Mormon "cutie pie" who he seemed very interested in, and who he was flirting with via Facebook emails on May 24 and May 25. "

RickshawFan said:

Do we only have Jodi's word for it that he bought a camera? We have the camera in the washing machine. Jodi's?

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The only question would be whether we're sure it was indeed TA's new camera, I would hope the police had double checked the serial number against TA's box/receipt.

@28:55
[video=youtube;DDiJA09iK7Q]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDiJA09iK7Q[/video]

RickshawFan said:

I'm guessing that this whole text exchange is a Jodi concoction. Font: Travis' real words. Bold: Jodi saying there's no evidence if anyone wants to check up on whether she sent it or not. Underline: A bizarre detail about a postmark (huh??????) so if anyone ever reads this text, it'll seem like she has to have sent the manuscript back, it's just that Travis destroyed the evidence. Font: Travis again.

I can think of several possibilities:
1. JA is messing with texts and this has something to do with setting Travis up.
2. this is a practice run for Jodi; she's trying to figure out how to piece together TA's words interspersed with hers.
3. she's trying to figure out what to do with TA's handwriting, so she doesn't want to send him the chapter right back, and she'd like to mess with him anyway.
4. JA is trying to get TA to say something compromising so she can set up another batch of fake evidence against him
5. at the very least, she's making it seem as though there's something wrong with his brain.
6. the "postmark" is the kind of "florid" detail, which is the symptom of her lying (bwahahaha! since when do we even look at postmarks or use them? Jodi has clearly been reading pulp fiction......)

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I believe the problem is that her manifesto says she gave Travis the handwritten chapter on june 4th. i was telling Elle that Jodi was lying in the manifesto because it appears, according to the texts, she already mailed those pages to Travis. She says in the manifesto that she had emailed them (i guess scanning them like he suggested.)

I don't know what she did. I'm confused.

4/16
Travis:completion reminder. My book. =) Have a great day.
reply: Remind yourself. I mailed it two days ago! =)
reply Silly-willy
Travis: I got it. Are you still gonna type it?
reply: Wow,you got it that fast. When is it postdated?
Travis: It's already in the recycle bin. I don't mess around.

That's obviously about the book, right? the handwritten pages he'd been asking for in the texts prior to this? I think she might write in the manifesto something different because she doesn't believe there is a record of what actually happened.

I'm not one to believe Jodi planned this murder any farther in advance than when she started documenting her journal with painful detail about her trip PRIOR to going on it, and then when she got back, she barely describes what she did and the plans are different with stuff added in as if she'd planned to do it all along. I think sh started planning on the 26th, jmo. That's why her ninja story is so bad, too. Because she was not planning. she actually thought the first plan would be all she needed. If she doesn't think that far ahead after the crime, I can't imagine she did beforehand. Her lies were so bad in the interrogation. If she was planning the whole time, she sucked at it.

What are your thoughts? You read the manifesto yet, cause it has some more clues in it. Reading it after knowing the facts and seeing what she lied about in the manifesto kind of gives some clues to the timeline. I want to discuss them.

Val1 said:

The only question would be whether we're sure it was indeed TA's new camera, I would hope the police had double checked the serial number against TA's box/receipt.

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Travis texted Jodi that he wanted to buy a new camera on 4/23/15 at about 630pm. So yeah, I guess after talking to her, he must have gotten to best buy by 9pm!

geevee said:

Something (maybe esoteric) just occurred to me, in all the time they knew each other or were "dating" before she moved to Mesa, she used to drive to Mesa frequently from what I understand, to check up on, see if he was messing with other people, etc., but once she leaves Mesa in early April of '08, she never makes a trip back, in almost 2 months, until she comes to kill him.

We know she planned the murder for a while, maybe back in March (taking his journal, leaving Zach's camera in the BMW, blowing up the BMW, whatever else she was doing then) and according to Ryan they planned her trip to do the last night of the Utah convention and see him for about 2 weeks before - but since she and Travis were still communicating, why didn't she ever drive down to see him or even spy on him? Can't wait till the May/June texts come out, hopefully it'll shed some light on this.

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Who knows for sure, though it seems GS may know more than he's saying. In JA's journal she had said on her April 6.2008 that she'd got a Helio phone, then on May 18, 2008 claims it went "missing" and on May 22, 2008 says she got a new phone. So if GS was hooking her up with phones it sounds like she may have had some contact with him shortly before the May 26th texts, plus GS himself said:

http://radaronline.com/exclusives/20...h-says-friend/
GS - "I was alone in a motorhome with Jodi five days before this happened and nothing happened to me,”

"this" being the murder.

wasnt_me said:

I believe the problem is that her manifesto says she gave Travis the handwritten chapter on june 4th. i was telling Elle that Jodi was lying in the manifesto because it appears, according to the texts, she already mailed those pages to Travis. She says in the manifesto that she had emailed them (i guess scanning them like he suggested.)

I don't know what she did. I'm confused.

4/16
Travis:completion reminder. My book. =) Have a great day.
reply: Remind yourself. I mailed it two days ago! =)
reply Silly-willy
Travis: I got it. Are you still gonna type it?
reply: Wow,you got it that fast. When is it postdated?
Travis: It's already in the recycle bin. I don't mess around.

That's obviously about the book, right? the handwritten pages he'd been asking for in the texts prior to this? I think she might write in the manifesto something different because she doesn't believe there is a record of what actually happened.

I'm not one to believe Jodi planned this murder any farther in advance than when she started documenting her journal with painful detail about her trip PRIOR to going on it, and then when she got back, she barely describes what she did and the plans are different with stuff added in as if she'd planned to do it all along. I think sh started planning on the 26th, jmo. That's why her ninja story is so bad, too. Because she was not planning. she actually thought the first plan would be all she needed. If she doesn't think that far ahead after the crime, I can't imagine she did beforehand. Her lies were so bad in the interrogation. If she was planning the whole time, she sucked at it.

What are your thoughts? You read the manifesto yet, cause it has some more clues in it. Reading it after knowing the facts and seeing what she lied about in the manifesto kind of gives some clues to the timeline. I want to discuss them.

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Umm, recycle bin... why would TA put his own journal in the recycle bin... what else did she send him?

Yikes. Remember when Jodi asked Travis to send her something in the mail and to include a handwritten note? That was very soon after she left Mesa - looking back I bet that was part of her plan to learn to write like Travis, or copy/paste his writing to make that letter. Could she really have been planning that far back?