ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #21

kammiemc said:

Some people have no class and no filter and those comments make my jaw drop too. That said, I think shame (used with some responsibility) serves a purpose in society and IMO it is appropriate here. I don't mind some public pressure on the parents to come forward and be truthful. Especially if they are engaging in public conversation. I am surprised to read that there are people who think, based solely on photographs (and despite what LE, FBI and the family's PI are saying), that the father should be "proud" of himself. Yikes.


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desert-blue said:

Listening to the July 13th interview again...

NE: you say (pointing at DK) you were in the truck so was it you (pointing at JM) that first realized "oh no DeOrr's not here?"

Both: no, we both did

DK: after 20 minutes of up and down the creek and up and around the camp and he wasn't there, that's when I got in my pick-up truck and drove down the road to try and get some service

JM: especially after screaming his name, we have nicknames for him, no sound of him, no crying


So, if this is true, you would think the other campers, if they were around, would have heard the parents screaming his name? In the forest, it's very quiet and not a lot of background noise. Plus, they were in an enclosed bowl so I'd imagine sounds would echo a bit as well.

ETA: the exception might be if you were standing right next to the creek. Then you might not hear screaming.

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OSpyder said:

On the contrary, I think this is one of those cases where public shaming (if you will) is just pushing the knowledgable people further away from telling what they know. There is a big difference between guilt and anger. I think in this case, everybody is so angry, they may not have (or have had) enough, if any time to feel guilty. Don't get me wrong, 7 months is a LONG time for a 2.5 year old to be missing, but the last 7 months have seemed to be more focused on what is on the outside, rather than what is on the inside. Maybe I'm wrong though.

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kammiemc said:

I never caught that DK says in this interview that he left in his truck after searching for 20 minutes. That doesn't jibe with the fact that he could be heard talking to 911 in the background of JM's 911 call when she says DeOrr had been missing for about an hour. Whoops, DK!


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Rayemonde said:

Angry? Do you mean the parents have been angry since DeOrr vanished? Angry about what?

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OSpyder said:

On the contrary, I think this is one of those cases where public shaming (if you will) is just pushing the knowledgable people further away from telling what they know. There is a big difference between guilt and anger. I think in this case, everybody is so angry, they may not have (or have had) enough, if any time to feel guilty. Don't get me wrong, 7 months is a LONG time for a 2.5 year old to be missing, but the last 7 months have seemed to be more focused on what is on the outside, rather than what is on the inside. Maybe I'm wrong though.

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Rayemonde said:

It only adds up if they were at the creek looking at the minnows (or whatever!) for 40 minutes. And then they assumed that ggp had lost sight of DeOrr as soon as they left him. :fishy:

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kammiemc said:

I'm not sure that I understand 100%. But, to clarify, I am not talking about seven months ago when people were jumping to conclusions without information and harassing the parents.

But, in my own opinion, I think now that the sheriff said he "absolutely" believes the parents know where their son is and that repeatedly and consistently failed two majorly critical questions on their poly's, shame (on shameful behavior) is not misplaced.

I am not saying I think it's the public's role to strategize as to how to make them come forward. I just think in general that shame, along with laws, rules, etc., can help keep us in line and that some shame on the parents at this time doesn't bother me.


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OSpyder said:

I wasn't being clear either and I apologize. It makes sense in my head but that doesn't mean much today!

I agree w/ where you are coming from. I am not arguing w/ you one bit, believe me. I am also I thinking though, that the the extremes people are taking it to are beyond anything that will necessarily help anybody, especially Little D. All I meant was that I could see the VDK and JM (maybe even extended family?) being so overwhelmed by all the outside commotion or shaming, that it keeps them more focused on the anger directed towards them, then from feeling any shame or guilt or anything else b/c if it. Ack! I hope that makes more sense?

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OSpyder said:

I wasn't being clear either and I apologize. It makes sense in my head but that doesn't mean much today!

I agree w/ where you are coming from. I am not arguing w/ you one bit, believe me. I am also I thinking though, that the the extremes people are taking it to are beyond anything that will necessarily help anybody, especially Little D. All I meant was that I could see the VDK and JM (maybe even extended family?) being so overwhelmed by all the outside commotion or shaming, that it keeps them more focused on the anger directed towards them, then from feeling any shame or guilt or anything else b/c if it. Ack! I hope that makes more sense?

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Mickshawn said:

Sorry....the thread wavered Off Topic for a bit about yet another missing child we learned of today...name is Titus Tackett....I was just responding to that...Sorry about the near heart attack!!!! It was one of those knee jerk reactions when I posted that....

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desert-blue said:

Listening to the July 13th interview again...

NE: you say (pointing at DK) you were in the truck so was it you (pointing at JM) that first realized "oh no DeOrr's not here?"

Both: no, we both did

DK: after 20 minutes of up and down the creek and up and around the camp and he wasn't there, that's when I got in my pick-up truck and drove down the road to try and get some service

JM: especially after screaming his name, we have nicknames for him, no sound of him, no crying


So, if this is true, you would think the other campers, if they were around, would have heard the parents screaming his name? In the forest, it's very quiet and not a lot of background noise. Plus, they were in an enclosed bowl so I'd imagine sounds would echo a bit as well.

ETA: the exception might be if you were standing right next to the creek. Then you might not hear screaming.

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FromGermany said:

bbm

Why did she say that?? Because if some witness could have testified they didn't hear calling the name "Deorr" all over the camp ground? Protected against anything that might come? Odd - for me.

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CanadianWells said:

i still don't get everyone's hang ups on the nickname thing. We barely called my 15 month old by name until I started reading the Deorr threads. I'm pretty sure she thought her name was Bubbagirl until about 2 months ago. Had she gone missing before reading everything people have said about nicknames and it being odd and distancing and indicative of a lack of love, I would have been in the news bawling about "the Bubs" and "my sweet bubba girl," and I wouldn't have been calling her name when I searched. I now make a conscious effort to call her by name, but her nickname has more emotional value to me still ATM. One of my neighbourhood kid friends growing up was little guy. I thought that was his name. I never actually knew it, even after moving away at 10 yo.

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Han said:

There is something else that may be relevant. During the 911 call JM volunteers, "all down where we were camping at and we can't find him at all." Does she mean she's no longer there at the campsite? When she says "all down" does she mean she's moved to a higher elevation?

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persimmon said:

I agree and think at this point we are getting nowhere. This is why things get messy. In all honesty, I feel the parents are responsible but I cannot imagine a scenario wherein the other two individuals could not be at least complicit in a cover up.

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