NY - Karina Vetrano, 30, found murdered, Queens, 2 Aug 2016 #2

Inthedetails said:

I think so too - and the second sketch is two years after the first one. I think the sketches show the effect of time.

I don't know for sure, OF COURSE, but I think it's a strong possibility this is the same person.

The B/C subway line where the attack occurred in Manhattan runs to Howard Beach, FWIW.

jmopinion

Click to expand...

Was the Morningside guy ever caught? I see a lot of similarities and it does show as a person would age especially on the streets, effects of drugs and/or alcohol.

Dollcat said:

Was the Morningside guy ever caught? I see a lot of similarities and it does show as a person would age especially on the streets, effects of drugs and/or alcohol.

Click to expand...

I believe this photo comparison is 99% certain it's the same person.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Inthedetails said:

Graphic warning:

A thought came to me about the "not finishing" part of the rape - the detail about LE not finding semen on her.

What if Karina kicked him in the groin really, really hard?

That would not only hurt, but anger him. Looking at her legs on the video, she was strong! LE has said, IIRC, that the attack escalated because she fought so hard. Perhaps she fought so hard in one particular area, and that escalated the violence dramatically. And maybe that's why he threw her shoe? Maybe he grabbed her foot that kicked him, tore off her shoe, and threw it?

She was brutally raped without semen. Perhaps he raped her with something else - his fist or a stick? Sorry for being graphic.

If this kick to the groin happened, surely his pain was felt for awhile? I'm female so I don't know how long an injury like that would hurt, but I would think he might be walking a little funny for awhile...in addition to being ANGRY after this crime. I assume some rapists feel elated, relieved, or remorseful....but I envision this guy very angry if he was injured to the point of not being able to function in the rape.

Surely someone who knows him would've noticed not only scratches but perhaps him hunching a bit in pain, scowling, angry. I have a feeling that anger would stick around for awhile - longer than the scratches on his skin. Perhaps the anger flares up whenever the story hits the news again, like yesterday with the video release.

This worries me very much because it's possible he'll want another victim to prove he can do it.

Total hunch, speculation, thinking aloud.

JMOpinion

Click to expand...

If the guy is the same one from a few years ago, he was over 6 feet tall and about 250 pounds. She is petite and 105 pounds. I don't think he had too much trouble to subdue her unless she has martial arts expertise.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Google Daily Mail, Mother of Central Park murdered jogger speaks out about Karina Vetrano. Both savagely beaten and both had their teeth knocked out. Her daughters killer was never caught.

deedee21 said:

Google Daily Mail, Mother of Central Park murdered jogger speaks out about Karina Vetrano. Both savagely beaten and both had their teeth knocked out. Her daughters killer was never caught.

Click to expand...

Here is the link. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rk-murdered-jogger-speaks-Karina-Vetrano.html


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

OldSteve said:

In the video of her running, is it just me, but it looks like where she was staring at the brush was deliberately blurred out!?

From the friend she was texting with, we now learn the last time they texted was before she had gone onto the weeds trail - throwing allot of what we wrote about out the window...

Looking at her running in the video, she appears to run fast.

Click to expand...

I believe someone upthread states it was blurred out to protect the addresses of the homes in the background. I could be wrong though. Based on the maps is this even possible?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

OldSteve said:

In the video of her running, is it just me, but it looks like where she was staring at the brush was deliberately blurred out!?

From the friend she was texting with, we now learn the last time they texted was before she had gone onto the weeds trail - throwing allot of what we wrote about out the window...

Looking at her running in the video, she appears to run fast.

Click to expand...

Thank you OldSteve, for posting your Colombo list. It's a big help for me as I think about her. The area that is blocked out wasn't in the very first preview broadcast, but in later versions there was more editing, but this spot was never edited out. Karina running, even slowed down @.25 seems fast. I get the impression from the way her stride falls and the change in her posture that she may have slowed down just as she first notices something there, while besides the car. Then picks up her pace just about at this point, focus of the caps below. [video=youtube;jtKvoTZgUME]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtKvoTZgUME[/video]











If that is the perp, and if he was online or connected in anyway, could it have left an electronic foot print there?

FindHG said:

You too are very welcome. What do you make of these? Also seen here:

[video=youtube;jtKvoTZgUME]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtKvoTZgUME[/video]

here it looks like he may have his arm out, extended with the shiny thing in his hand. Then see the equally shiny thing about waist high for him? Are those handles of some kind?

Click to expand...

This is where Im thinking person on a bike possibly with a cell phone in hand.. It's just too odd to me that something to the left distracted her which is why Im thinking she heard something pretty loud or someone called her name out. And It would make complete sense to me that she only had 1 earbud in while running on street so that she could hear the cars, bikes etc.

Forager said:

A bike or a partner would provide some of the ingredients needed to flesh out the theory that Karina's killer was in the bushes just south of 165th Ave when she started her jog. He would either have needed transport to travel the 0.9 miles he needed to get in position to make his attack. Or he would have needed to alert a partner that Karina was on her way on her usual route. (I'm not really sure about the "usual route" stuff. She apparently jogged regularly with her father (according to the CWD video), but I'm only assuming that they had a regular route.)

Click to expand...

i agree. I went on google maps satellite last with where she may have entered and where she was found and Im just not feeling someone was waiting.. I'm honestly really thinking 2 people were involved

Laura817 said:

I haven't commented on this in a few days. I have been trying to keep up. I see all the zoomed images but that's zooming in on the guy in the white shirt who appears to be looking at Karina and moving around, correct?

Click to expand...

Maybe but who really knows.. Could be just my mind wanting it to be.. When I 1st saw the video on the news they showed it complete without anything blocked out. I had dvr'd it and watched it a few times because I saw Karina look to her left a few times then focused on that area and thought I saw movement. So here we are.. I have to say that I do find it odd that I can't find the complete video anymore and they only show the 1st 16secs or whtever it is and the area to the left is blurred out..

Bklyngrl007 said:

This is where Im thinking person on a bike possibly with a cell phone in hand.. It's just too odd to me that something to the left distracted her which is why Im thinking she heard something pretty loud or someone called her name out. And It would make complete sense to me that she only had 1 earbud in while running on street so that she could hear the cars, bikes etc.

Click to expand...

I think the way the shadows fell, it may have been a hard place to make things out clearly. Let's say she noticed somebody there, she may have been trying to make out what they were doing, she may have thought it odd, as we do now, thus looked again and again. Whatever she was able to see at the closest point to that spot, as she seems to look right there passing by, did not cause her to stop running. There are objects that are not plants or trees or stumps or boulders around the figure that are unnatural, man made and reflect light differently, it seems to my eye.

Bklyngrl007 said:

i agree. I went on google maps satellite last with where she may have entered and where she was found and Im just not feeling someone was waiting.. I'm honestly really thinking 2 people were involved

Click to expand...

hmm... going off your idea, Bklyngrl007. Just thinking out loud (speculating awful stuff, sorry) Two people, could be or more with, maybe a bike, maybe a computer, hand held devices, kind of like a perfectly planned gang rape gone wrong, if not shapes in clouds? LE seems pretty sure it's one left handed person who may have grabbed her, according to Chief Det. Boyce. Interesting, because could that explain the lack of tips? The only people who know what happened are covering up for each other? Then, the very nature of a coordinated crime like that would have been to provide maximum cover for the one, two or/and another individual. So, following that logic or leap, it would have been two or three young men never in the system with deep bonds of loyalty trying to pull this off. Then having it all fall apart. So two or three young men, one really beat up, told a story that isn't true to everybody else they know about what happened to the beat up guy, possibly? Maybe family took care of any wounds or he crept under a rug, but it must have hurt, considering Karina's strength and the struggle she seems to have put up, with weeds still clutched in her hands.

A rapist/killer like this would typically work alone. It's not to say he won't tell others about it though.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

RPsleuth said:

A rapist/killer like this would typically work alone. It's not to say he won't tell others about it though

Click to expand...

rsbm


That would be typical, I guess, am not an expert on any of this by any stretch, but groups of men do rape women and scheme to do it often enough. Could there be a reason the other perp you think is similar may have been eliminated as a possibility by LE already, as being the witness in the sketch LE seeks in this case, not yet even named a suspect or POI?

FindHG said:

Could there be a reason this perp may have been eliminated as a possibility?

Click to expand...

I don't think he was eliminated. They are just saying he isn't a suspect yet. A typical ploy to get someone to identify him so the detectives can talk to him before they consider him a suspect.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Go over to Curtis and Kuby Fb. I'm so sick over this. I never posted here so I hope I can direct you without breaking rules.

Sallie22 said:

Go over to Curtis and Kuby Fb. I'm so sick over this. I never posted here so I hope I can direct you without breaking rules.

Click to expand...

For those who don't know, Curtis Sliwa is the founder of the Guardian Angels. Ron Kuby is a lawyer (IIRC). Together, they host a radio program on WABC radio in NYC.

They have a post on FB now about the sketch. https://www.facebook.com/CurtisandKuby/

Sallie22 said:

Go over to Curtis and Kuby Fb. I'm so sick over this. I never posted here so I hope I can direct you without breaking rules.

Click to expand...

Not sure if this is legal, so mods I apologize if not okay. I just looked Sallie22. Do you know how they got those pics?

Inthedetails said:

For those who don't know, Curtis Sliwa is the founder of the Guardian Angels. Ron Kuby is a lawyer (IIRC). Together, they host a radio program on WABC radio in NYC.

They have a post on FB now about the sketch. https://www.facebook.com/CurtisandKuby/

Click to expand...

Oh, and around the eyes especially!

updated after second look:

hmmm looking again this guys face, you can hardly see the cheek bones. If you could see the cheek bones, the sketch guy's look higher and wider maybe. The beard line and and mouth area resembles. The the upper lip on the sketch guy, however, looks more full under the nose and over the lip on the sketch guy, whose face still seems shorter somehow. Thinner, the jaw and the neck line seem the right proportions to match the sketch guy, but the picture guys neck seems longer, than the sketch guy. His nose seems bigger. Chin seems wider. Has a double chin.


Thank you Inthedetails for news of this update from the Guardian Angels being "on it."

RPsleuth said:

I don't think he was eliminated. They are just saying he isn't a suspect yet. A typical ploy to get someone to identify him so the detectives can talk to him before they consider him a suspect.

Click to expand...

rsbm

Thank you for RPsleuth, for this and all your well informed thought provoking posts and the time you take. Good to know.

Thank you. After posting I realized maybe they are not so well known outside of NY.

FindHG said:

Oh, and eyes especially! Thank you Inthedetails for news of this update from the Guardian Angels being "on it."

Click to expand...

Well, it was Sallie who found it, not me. Credit were credit is due!