IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #50

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Status
Not open for further replies.
Aren't they older?
Where were they when abducted? Links all seem to be to Facebook and I don't use social media.

I haven't found the specifics of how missing but they are still missing...one was 5'10 and 15 (turned 16 few days after missing); other was 5'3 and 14 at the time. They were sisters. Not sure what it all means but iy's about an hour from Delphi.
 
Sorry, no. I have CRS right now. I was hoping someone else would. I'm still looking.

Hahha me too. if you saw my ridiculous last post of the night , can't remember the name of anything and retired for the evening from posting .I'm just reading a few more now....
 
I don't believe they have, but have also never said that they're absolutely unrelated either. I believe they also used their ambiguous "at this time" phrasing in regard to this, as well.
Has LE walked back the statement by the FBI agent that no SK or similar and/or related crimes were suspected?
 
Absolutely true, but there do seem to be a few coincidences between these two cases. Could all be nothing. Could be someone tried to make it look like a connection. Could be they are connected. All I know is that I hope justice is served in both cases.

BBM

Important point IMO. There are some very detailed coincidences, that I find peculiar. What is the difference between "making it look like a connection" and actually copying or connecting it? It's the same, isn't it? The only way to copy is, if there are two different killers. Looking at the common denominators like for example the rearranged numbers of the dates and the similar location components like bridge(s), water, woods etc. , time (afternoon), small towns (4000 residents and less), these are all variables very difficult to match IMO, if one is looking for a particular kind of victim or victims to locate at any given time, date and location.

IMO the killer tried so hard to either copy the Iowa case to some extent, or he is involved in both cases. I am not just pointing out the obvious, I am pointing out the necessary intellectual capacity of the killer, whether he tried to copy or whether he is responsible for both cases. The intellectual capacity is in direct proportion to the case, like in a complicated puzzle. However, the puzzle is only complicated to the observer, not to the creator of the puzzle.

After taking a good look at the Iowa case today I see so many detailed commonalities, that I am inclined to believe the killer of Libby and Abby possibly took advantage of an opportunity, that was semi planned and meticulously executed. The plan included the approximate where and how, but not necessarily the when. Then, it developed from there.

So, who is he and why did he do it?

The who-part

Two ways to answer the question. The killer of Libby and Abby is either a serial killer - then he may also be responsible for Elizabeth's and Lyric's case- or he just happened to kill Libby and Abby. Really? That's where I am greatly differing. RL was a great red herring IMO. It could not have been played out better. LE knew, why they did not publish a height and weight estimate. Do you really believe they don't know exactly how tall and heavy the POI/BG is? They may be off a inch and a few ounces, yet I am positive they know. How can the not? They can literally go to that bridge and re-enact it. I am not sure they did though. Perhaps they did not need to. I am not suggesting LE knows, who the POI/BG is. But they got to know the height and the weight IMO big time.

Not "labeling RL a suspect" was giving it away IMO. Not "clearing" him for any involvement into the murder was giving it away IMO. Fast tracking DNA (of course they had DNA..really?) was giving it away. The list is ongoing.

Look at the short time-frame between drop off and pick-up, at the location the bodies were found, at the creek separating the CS from the last known location (assuming) of the girls. Look at that humongous bridge, dangerous to walk, folks look down and not around (towards the CS) a textbook trap IMO. So many more things. I think we are looking at either a very smart "stager", who is almost getting lost in ingenuity (in his own mind..) or we are looking at a very vicious and smart SK.

The why-part

Motive. COD. Signature. None of those is known to us at this time. It is therefore impossible to know why he killed Abby and Libby, or why he possibly killed the Iowa kids, if the cases were connected. We can theorize and say, the only victims he ever killed are Abby and Libby. Hard to imagine, but possible. We can also say, he has killed before and will kill again. Again, that is possible.

Motive may have to do with purpose only. Was Libby in the way? Was Abby in the way? Were both in the way?

Motive may have to do with the killer's past. What happened to him when? Was he misused? Did he kill someone as a child? Was he witness of someone who killed someone else or himself? Did he ever find someone else, who was killed or who killed himself? Resentment? Hate? Reenactment?

Do they know by now, who the killer may be? I don't know.

I hope we will eventually find out, why this person killed Abby and Libby, and if he was involved into additional criminal activity. There are scenarios, that would require a more than perfect case buildup. And there are also situations, that can be very sensitive to any partners or family members possibly living in a relationship involving the killer. The killer may or may not know, how close he is to detection. Let's leave it at that.

All IMO

-Nin
 
IIRC, they are suspected runaways. Maybe someone else remembers?

That would explain why there are no media stories about their disappearance. Where were they last seen?
 
I haven't found the specifics of how missing but they are still missing...one was 5'10 and 15 (turned 16 few days after missing); other was 5'3 and 14 at the time. They were sisters. Not sure what it all means but iy's about an hour from Delphi.

Wait, what case are you talking about? -Nin
 
I think a man who murders children in rural, secluded parks drives a vehicle, not a motorcycle simply because no one wants to be seen or recognized after murdering children. Vehicles are much better for obscuring identification and recognition than motorcycles.

Motorcycle riders typically wear helmets, they're fast, easy to maneuver in small places and easier to hide than a car or van, unless your assumption is the murders happened in a van?

I misremembered some details. He was being surveilled and that's how he was caught in the act. Im pretty sure there was another case that CHP pulled a guy in a van over and found a body. ETA it was a car and Bonin was the van.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Bonin

Randy Kraft.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Steven_Kraft
 
I think a man who murders children in rural, secluded parks drives a vehicle, not a motorcycle simply because no one wants to be seen or recognized after murdering children. Vehicles are much better for obscuring identification and recognition than motorcycles.

Well I believe you followed the James Dean Worley case last summer with me didn't you? He actually did use the motorcycle ..he parked it off the road and hid it in cornfields before he pounced on Sierrah Joughin and abducted her and killing her. however that was in the end of July and very hot the weather... but Delphi in February was not exactly motorcycle riding weather even with it being warmer-than-normal 40 something degrees not really warm enough for motorcycling ..it would probably draw more attention to himself if he were riding one on that cold of a day.
 
I haven't found the specifics of how missing but they are still missing...one was 5'10 and 15 (turned 16 few days after missing); other was 5'3 and 14 at the time. They were sisters. Not sure what it all means but iy's about an hour from Delphi.

Here they are together ... three sets of two girls missing or murdered in Indiana and Iowa in the last 5 years.

IndianaX2Iowa.jpg
 
Me too. The locations are the same. If this is the same person, the river is significant, but I don't know why ... childhood memory? grew up near a creek?

If this is the same person, the big difference in this case is there is a photo, there is audio, and the bodies were found within 24 hours. That bodes well for police. That might mean that the suspect is getting a bit careless, which could also mean murdering closer to home ... thinking outloud ...
So would it make sense that RL is connected to the Iowa murders also?
 
Thanks Nin for your inquiring mind ...I believe that as long as people "like to think" it's RL, it keeps them from wanting to believe there is a SK who was in Iowa as well. No one wants to think SK...it creates alot of fear. So, the FBI involvement (I believe) was for just that purpose but they are not disclosing anything because it's fearful plus very important to keep details close (because there may be many similarities). I have great faith that this will eventually be solved. This has been quite a year for SK's being brought down and LE has been very smart!! My opinion of course!!
 
Wait, what case are you talking about? -Nin

This was probably answered already but I brought up another 2 teens that are missing from Indiana. (Lauren and Emily Stratton)

I did a search here, BTW, and they were discussed a bit on Thread #13

(Thanks for the help with my CRS, kat!)
 
Unfortunately I don't have much time to do much research related to this case at this time ... that work thing getting in the way ... but things should slow down for me in a month or so. Let's keep it in mind for a few weeks from now.

I kind of expect that this will still be unsolved in a month, just like the Iowa case, and I think that may be in part because the suspect's appearance in the still image is completely different than his every day appearance. I think the suspect in this case is experienced at doing what he did to the children and that he has gotten away with this long enough to have considered all the factors in not getting caught. I never viewed him as a homeless person, and I think it's possible that he's a middle management person who is clawing his way up the corporate ladder.

Emphasis mine, and I agree 100%.

Within days of this case hitting the wires, I knew this killer or killers is/are sophisticated. I hike a lot, and often times alone on very difficult terrain, in downright remote places. This case scares the daylights out of myself and many other avid outdoors folks, downright frightening. Looking at the maps of the area, the terrain, etc., this killer or killers was in and out in a matter of hours, maybe 2-3. I may not be in BG's target demographic for murder and mayhem, but even folks like myself are spooked by this case.

The killer is a disgusting sociopath of the worst order. This was a brazen attack in broad daylight, on an unusually mild February day here in Indiana. The girls had the day off from school, a snow day that had to be burned. The perp must have known this. He may be new to the area, but may not yet live there, or may have moved to Carroll Cty since the attack, if you catch my drift. Bottom line is he knows that park and that bridge.

Various circumstances had to have conspired in order for this crime to occur. That's why I believe it's a SK.

What socio-economic demo is he in? We don't know, and no offense to any members, but I don't believe BG is homeless, a drifter, a vagabond, etc. He's been on the run for two months, now. He could be LE. Could be a factory or food processing worker. Could be plant maintenance, maybe a contractor. Could be a sociopathic management type. Who knows?

I just think the perp is a lot smarter than a lot of folks initially thought.
 
So would it make sense that RL is connected to the Iowa murders also?
We can only sleuth the RL who does not work with wind power. The RL connected to wind power in Iowa and Indiana is not to be sleuthed.
 
Thanks Nin for your inquiring mind ...I believe that as long as people "like to think" it's RL, it keeps them from wanting to believe there is a SK who was in Iowa as well. No one wants to think SK...it creates alot of fear. So, the FBI involvement (I believe) was for just that purpose but they are not disclosing anything because it's fearful plus very important to keep details close (because there may be many similarities). I have great faith that this will eventually be solved. This has been quite a year for SK's being brought down and LE has been very smart!! My opinion of course!!

Sometimes le gets linkage blindness. Iirc in the ted Bundy case it took them a bit to connect the dots. Jmo
 
So would it make sense that RL is connected to the Iowa murders also?

I cannot see how a man would violate probation in the morning, and leave dead bodies on his property in the afternoon. Common sense dictates that investigators will scrutinize the owner of the property where the remains are found. Why go to jail for probation violation as a coincidence of having dead bodies in the backyard. It makes absolutely no sense to me, so no, the property owner did not murder the girls.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
118
Guests online
1,361
Total visitors
1,479

Forum statistics

Threads
602,178
Messages
18,136,217
Members
231,261
Latest member
birdistheword14
Back
Top