GUILTY CA - Leila Fowler, 8, murdered, 12yo charged, Valley Springs, 27 Apr 2013 - #1

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Heavy sigh....


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Kaliste said:
Wow. Just wow. Is this a grown woman? Yes, let's feed the police false information in a murder investigation because somehow that may "help".
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Sounds like she has some serious issues. They should either arrest her or get her some help!


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Regarding this being a random killing or not, didn't they initially say the same thing about the JR case? As it turned out it was COMPLETELY random, right? Or am I wrong?
 
If we want to compare the actions with another family, then look at John and Patsy Ramsey. JonBenet was also found dead in her home, discovered by a family member, and there is still the debate over whether it was an intruder or a family member (including her brother). Now, personally I think the family is guilty (either Patsy or Burke) and I think an intruder most likely killed Leila...

These are the biggest differences between the two families within the first week of the murders:

The Ramseys hired two lawyers. The Fowlers have not hired a lawyer.

The Ramseys spoke on CNN for 30 minutes.The Fowlers have spoken to CNN via FB, and Barney said a few words to the local media.

The Ramseys traveled to Georgia to bury their daughter, and stayed a few days afterwards. The Fowlers have not left the state.

The Ramseys hired an "investigative team to assist". The Fowlers have not hired any team.

JonBenet's brother was not interviewed until about 2 weeks later. Leila's brother was interviewed right away.

JonBenet's parents still had not spoken to police by the first week. By all accounts, the entire Fowler family is cooperating.

The Fowlers appeared at a press conference; The Ramseys did not show up to any press conference.

So I don't know if it means anything significant, but there aren't many cases out there where a child is found dead in the home, and people speculate whether it was an intruder or an inside job. I do think the difference between how the families behaved is very interesting.
 
sleuther317 said:
Regarding this being a random killing or not, didn't they initially say the same thing about the JR case? As it turned out it was COMPLETELY random, right? Or am I wrong?
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Wrong IMO


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Okay, here is something I don't understand:

Christy Lawson lives three doors down from where Fowler was killed and said she witnessed a harrowing scene at about noon Saturday.

Lawson said a man who she believed to be Barney Fowler, Leila’s father, came to the edge of her driveway.

“He was white as a ghost,” she said. “He had blood on his shirt, her body imprint was on his shirt, like you could tell he was cradling that little girl.”
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Okay, wouldn't LE have arrived before the parents got home? How would BF be able to cradle his daughter? I'm sure LE had the room blocked off, unless he somehow managed to run past them to her? Although "Her body imprint was on his shirt" sounds like sensationalism so maybe this neighbor isn't to be believed?

http://www.uniondemocrat.com/News/Local-News/Neighborhood-leery-after-Leila-Fowler-killing
 
eileenhawkeye said:
If we want to compare the actions with another family, then look at John and Patsy Ramsey. JonBenet was also found dead in her home, discovered by a family member, and there is still the debate over whether it was an intruder or a family member (including her brother). Now, personally I think the family is guilty (either Patsy or Burke) and I think an intruder most likely killed Leila...

These are the biggest differences between the two families within the first week of the murders:

The Ramseys hired two lawyers. The Fowlers have not hired a lawyer.

The Ramseys spoke on CNN for 30 minutes.The Fowlers have spoken to CNN via FB, and Barney said a few words to the local media.

The Ramseys traveled to Georgia to bury their daughter, and stayed a few days afterwards. The Fowlers have not left the state.

The Ramseys hired an "investigative team to assist". The Fowlers have not hired any team.

JonBenet's brother was not interviewed until about 2 weeks later. Leila's brother was interviewed right away.

JonBenet's parents still had not spoken to police by the first week. By all accounts, the entire Fowler family is cooperating.

The Fowlers appeared at a press conference; The Ramseys did not show up to any press conference.

So I don't know if it means anything significant, but there aren't many cases out there where a child is found dead in the home, and people speculate whether it was an intruder or an inside job. I do think the difference between how the families behaved is very interesting.
Click to expand...

I believe that the differences between how the Ramsey parents handled the aftermath of their daughter's murder had more to do with their elevated socioeconomical situation, connections, and experience with handling public relations than anything else. My comment doesn't have anything to do with my personal beliefs or opinions regarding guilt or innocence either.
 
TheDuchess said:
Katydid-are you a local? You should get verified as such. We would love to have the local insight into the situation. While I am obviously not up for sleuthing this family, I think it is quite reasonable to sleuth this woman who inserted herself into this situation.

How close does she live to the Fowlers? Is she tall and thin with long grey hair that could look like a perp? Could she have gotten into the home? Does she have a strange spouse, SO or other family members?
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NOOO. I am talking about MY crazy neighbor, not the same as the neighbor in this case. I was saying this woman may be similar to the crazy neighbor we have, who also makes false police reports.

Sorry for the confusion.
 
Helenstreet said:
I believe that the differences between how the Ramsey parents handled the aftermath of their daughter's murder had more to do with their elevated socioeconomical situation, connections, and experience with handling public relations than anything else. My comment doesn't have anything to do with my personal beliefs or opinions regarding guilt or innocence either.
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Yeah but the Fowler case is high-profile; If the family wanted a lawyer, there are many that would offer their services pro-bono. Also, Lisa Irwin's parents are probably in the same socioeconomic group as the Fowlers, yet they managed to get an entire team working for them, and also have not cooperated much with LE.

I just think that if the brother did it, the parents would know by now (I don't think they could be completely oblivious) and they would either take the position of "We cannot lose another child" and would get a lawyer and stop cooperating with LE or they would turn their son in.
 
katydid23 said:
I don't know what to think either. I feel like we are getting very mixed messages from LE---and then I wonder if they are doing it on purpose, to keep a suspect off guard---but then again, they might really have no clue, and the messages are mixed because they got nothing.
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Jumping off this because I feel like we are old friends Katy (I see you on almost all the boards I follow :)), I'm really hoping this aspect of the case turns out like Sierra Lamars. While it seemed to us that there were no real leads, LE was following the suspect and had him arrested within a few weeks. Maybe the perp in this case isn't a threat because he's being watched carefully by LE, and they are just waiting on that one final piece of the puzzle (whether its DNA or something else). JMO and my hopes.

:twocents:
 
KKazoo87 said:
Jumping off this because I feel like we are old friends Katy (I see you on almost all the boards I follow :)), I'm really hoping this aspect of the case turns out like Sierra Lamars. While it seemed to us that there were no real leads, LE was following the suspect and had him arrested within a few weeks. Maybe the perp in this case isn't a threat because he's being watched carefully by LE, and they are just waiting on that one final piece of the puzzle (whether its DNA or something else). JMO and my hopes.

:twocents:
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I would agree with this expect for that confusing statement they said the other day about knowing he is from the area but not sure if he left or something along those lines. The only explanation I can come up with is that they have surveillance on his house (maybe a car in the driveway) and there hasn't been any activity one way or another.
 
eileenhawkeye said:
Yeah but the Fowler case is high-profile; If the family wanted a lawyer, there are many that would offer their services pro-bono. Also, Lisa Irwin's parents are probably in the same socioeconomic group as the Fowlers, yet they managed to get an entire team working for them, and also have not cooperated much with LE.

I just think that if the brother did it, the parents would know by now (I don't think they could be completely oblivious) and they would either take the position of "We cannot lose another child" and would get a lawyer and stop cooperating with LE or they would turn their son in.
Click to expand...

My response was in regards to your entire post--not just about lawyers. Also, I wasn't implying possible guilt or innocence in either family. Anyway, it has just been a week today; who knows what Barney Fowler's or Crystal Walter's plans are regarding lawyers. I don't know. They could have even been in contact with legal counsel already--do you really know for sure? Another thing--you were comparing two cases in which children were brutally murdered inside the family home. The Lisa Irwin case is that of a missing child. The mother was on law enforcement's radar very quickly. Again, I am not implying guilt or innocence in that case either. We can agree to disagree and respect that we may look at things from a different perspective. Is that okay with you?
 
eileenhawkeye said:
Yeah but the Fowler case is high-profile; If the family wanted a lawyer, there are many that would offer their services pro-bono. Also, Lisa Irwin's parents are probably in the same socioeconomic group as the Fowlers, yet they managed to get an entire team working for them, and also have not cooperated much with LE.

I just think that if the brother did it, the parents would know by now (I don't think they could be completely oblivious) and they would either take the position of "We cannot lose another child" and would get a lawyer and stop cooperating with LE or they would turn their son in.
Click to expand...

While ITA with this, would it be possible the family either
A: in denial?
B: realize their child (speculation here only) has a history of sorts so they come to accept he needs help rather than risk more incidents?

In California, it is true that a minor can only be interviewed with parents or lawyer present, correct? I am not sure.
 
Helenstreet said:
My response was in regards to your entire post--not just about lawyers. Also, I wasn't implying possible guilt or innocence in either family. Anyway, it has just been a week today; who knows what Barney Fowler's or Crystal Walter's plans are regarding lawyers. I don't know. They could have even been in contact with legal counsel already--do you really know for sure? Another thing--you were comparing two cases in which children were brutally murdered inside the family home. The Lisa Irwin case is that of a missing child. The mother was on law enforcement's radar very quickly. Again, I am not implying guilt or innocence in that case either. We can agree to disagree and respect that we may look at things from a different perspective. Is that okay with you?
Click to expand...

I replied to the lawyers part because I felt it was the comparison that most represented the socioeconomic difference between the two parents. For example, I don't think talking to the media has anything to do with socioeconomic differences; Both parents have/had the opportunity to talk to national media, yet only one set has taken it. As for traveling out of the state, we know the Fowlers have other children out of state; They could have easily hopped in the car and went there. If the Fowlers wanted to protect their son, if he was guilty, they could get a lawyer pro-bono who would advise them to stop talking to LE, stop cooperating, etc.

You're right that the Fowlers could hire lawyers eventually. But I was just looking at the first week of the cases. IMO, there's a pretty big contrast.

I brought up the Lisa Irwin case, because her parents had an entire team to work for them. I was showing how you don't need to be wealthy to have multiple lawyers. If you're part of a high-profile case, they will offer their services.

I am confused by the end of your post. Why wouldn't it be okay with me if we disagreed on this? :confused:
 
alp1981 said:
Its 5611 or 5612
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Not sure why you are trying to correct the Fowler address to Rippon Rd 5611or 5612 ???

The Fowler address IS indeed :

5621 Rippon Road, Valley Springs, CA

I saw the housenumber ON the house wall myself in a newsvideo from the house, and if you google the address I provided, it indeed show the Fowler house.
 
Theforeigner said:
Not sure why you are trying to correct the Fowler address to Rippon Rd 5611or 5612 ???

The Fowler address IS indeed :

5621 Rippon Road, Valley Springs, CA

I saw the housenumber ON the house wall myself in a newsvideo from the house, and if you google the address I provided, it indeed show the Fowler house.
Click to expand...

5611 go to google maps and put in the address as 5611 you'll see the pool that used to be there on the left hand side. You can move past with street view and see the children's toys that match up to the police photos of the house someone else posted.

If the address is supposed to be a secret, whoops then i suppose it is really 5621

map link:
https://maps.google.com/maps?safe=o...=1366&bih=643&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&sa=N&tab=wl

Then you have to move down the road downhill past the pool and house on left*
 
katydid23 said:
NOOO. I am talking about MY crazy neighbor, not the same as the neighbor in this case. I was saying this woman may be similar to the crazy neighbor we have, who also makes false police reports.

Sorry for the confusion.
Click to expand...

:facepalm: Doh! Never mind!
 
miimaa said:
{mod snip}

Most people do react the same. Compare Mark Lunsford to Hailey Dunn's mother - world of difference. Yes the parents are victimized by this tragedy but as of today no one knows who murdered poor Leila. IF IF IF there was no intruder then the parents have a trauma beyond imagination. I believe that people's actions/reactions emotions/lack of emotions tell a lot. You don't know either why the parents are not comforting each other - it could be the cameras, it could be things from their past. No one knows so don't slam the poster who wonders what it could mean.[/QUOTE]

I disagree. I believe it is within my rights to take issue with a poster who is implying how the family (victims!!!!) are "acting." And no-actually I believe you are wrong. The way people act or don't act really tells us absolutely nothing whatsoever. EVIDENCE tells us a lot, however.
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