All About Chloroform#2

[Searchfortruth]

Casey did not use chloroform to knock Caylee out while partying or to use once and only once.....

I firmly disagree that Caylee was stuffed in the trunk while she partied and she used chloroform. The pings, cell texts, calls and police interviews do not support this. Click here for a play by play..

However, police interviews do support Cindy watching Caylee and in the first weeks of June stated she was getting a little tired of having her all the time.

Truthfully, (not supporting Casey here....) Caylee was with her grandma in her home with her toys and blankie more often than not. Out of the respect for Caylee.... we should remember her life as it truly was spent.

Which "party" do we propose Caylee spent in the trunk in the car -chloroformed?

Most would be surprised to know when this all got fired up around May 24th, when Casey's partying picked up steam with the party when Casey met Tony, it appears that Cindy had Caylee it was the beginning of her vacation. Cindy just happened to think that Casey was at work... she became suspicious only after May 25th the ABC party, when at some point before June 15th Cindy found out that Casey was not working on the 25th but at the ABC clothes party. This was one of the straws that broke the camels back. The next straw was when Casey did not come home until 5 AM after the night out at FUSION on June 6th. The next straw was June 13th when Casey did not get home until....3:12 AM.

MAmy states.. 4 out 5 times.. Casey was with her Grandma... police interview.

Casey's partying REALLY picked up after June 20th once she was free of Caylee. It appears that she was telling everyone that Caylee was with a Nanny, no longer using her mother as a caretaker.

So it gives the illusion, when seeing the June 20th party pics or any party pics that Caylee was "put in a trunk" since there is NO nanny and Cindy did not have her.

However, by this time... Caylee was already thrown out in the woods and Casey did not need to use the trunk nor any drugs.

She only used the trunk to put a DEAD child in as the evidence supports thus far has collected. There is no discovery or evidence that supports a LIVE Caylee in the trunk.

She did not use it on a one -time basis.. are we crazy???? Why go to all that trouble, when OTC's or the handy benzo's at the house would have worked. Evidently, Doc G supports this.

But then how do we explain the duct tape ?

 

[eddeva]

But then how do we explain the duct tape ?

i'm not following you here search (and i have a sneaking suspicion that it's my fault, not yours) what does the duct tape have to do w/ chloroform?

 

[Jolynna]

But then how do we explain the duct tape ?

The duct tape was used to gag Caylee. Caylee was not unconscious. She fought back. The duct tape and her scalp were covered from the fabrics of whatever Caylee was rolling around in or on...trying to get away.

Casey put the duct tape into and over Caylee's hair. She didn't intend for it to come off. She used duct tape for the same reason any other assassin would.

JMO

 

[Jolynna]

How chloroform really works.

The writings of civil war surgeons illustrate why NOBODY would use chloroform for a babysitter.

At the time of the Civil War, ether or chloroform or a mixture of the two was administered by an assistant, who placed a loose cloth over the patient's face and dripped some anesthetic onto it while the patient breathed deeply. When given this way, the initial effects are a loss of consciousness accompanied by a stage of excitement. For safety reasons, the application was usually stopped quickly, which is why surprisingly few deaths occurred. The Civil War surgeon went to work immediately, hoping to finish before the drug wore off. Although the excited patient was unaware of what was happening and felt no pain, he would be agitated, moaning or crying out, and thrashing about during the operation. He had to be held still by assistants so the surgeon could continue.


​

http://www.braceface.com/medical/Articles/Civil_War_surgery_truth.htm

 

[Jolynna]

In the picture are various funnels and filters through which chloroform was administered a DROP at a time during the 1800s by an assistant standing at the patient's head.

http://www.herkimertelegram.com/news/x1378747104/Living-History-event-lives-up-to-name

Here is a picture of a mask and filter through which chloroform was DRIPPED. It was used for midwifery in the late 1800's.

http://www.fcgapultoscollection.com/midfact2.html

 

[ibyoungr]

But then how do we explain the duct tape ?

I have 2 thoughts on the duct tape.

1. She duct taped her mouth while she was sleeping and then proceed to smother her with a pillow. Already planned to use a kidnapping story so the duct would fit with that or...

2. After a bit of a rage, smothering.. she then taped her mouth and decided to "blame the nanny."

 

[ibyoungr]

The duct tape was used to gag Caylee. Caylee was not unconscious. She fought back. The duct tape and her scalp were covered from the fabrics of whatever Caylee was rolling around in or on...trying to get away.

Casey put the duct tape into and over Caylee's hair. She didn't intend for it to come off. She used duct tape for the same reason any other assassin would.

JMO

That works for me as well.

 

[karenmamo]

In the picture are various funnels and filters through which chloroform was administered a DROP at a time during the 1800s by an assistant standing at the patient's head.

http://www.herkimertelegram.com/news/x1378747104/Living-History-event-lives-up-to-name

Here is a picture of a mask and filter through which chloroform was DRIPPED. It was used for midwifery in the late 1800's.

http://www.fcgapultoscollection.com/midfact2.html

Thank for those sites (I think-yuk).

 

[Jolynna]

Thank for those sites (I think-yuk).

I'm sorry.

But, I really wanted to convey why chloroform is not something young people use to knock kids out with in order to party (as Dr. Baden told Geraldo).

I also think people need to know that IF Casey used chloroform, it would not have happened the way it does on television where the victim immediately passes out. Even with chloroform, what Casey would had to have done was cold-blooded and ugly.

MOO

 

[Jolynna]

I have 2 thoughts on the duct tape.

1. She duct taped her mouth while she was sleeping and then proceed to smother her with a pillow. Already planned to use a kidnapping story so the duct would fit with that or...

2. After a bit of a rage, smothering.. she then taped her mouth and decided to "blame the nanny."

I think Casey smothered Caylee, too.

 

[mitzi]

I watched Geraldo tonight, and K. Guilfoyle was subbing for him. She asked Gloria Allred what she thought of the fact that the doc dump said the FBI hadn't tested the hair for chloroform. Gloria stated that the test for chloroform was sent to some other lab...not the FBI, so does anybody remember seeing anything in previous dumps that states this? If not, maybe Ms. Allred knows more than we do.

Quoting myself here, to add an article from WFTV:

http://www.wftv.com/news/19346147/detail.html

New Documents May Give Casey's Defense Ammunition
Posted: 5:31 pm EDT May 1, 2009
Updated: 6:24 pm EDT May 1, 2009

-snip
The FBI did not test the hair found with Caylee's remains for chloroform, because its chemists said it wouldn't prove anything.

Chloroform is a by-product of decomposition. Even so, Eyewitness News has learned that prosecutors had someone else test Caylee's hair for chloroform and say the results will be in soon.

 

[doogiesgirl]

I googled chloroform, how to make it, how to administer it again last night. I read that storing it is difficult and dangerous if you don't know what you are doing. It is to be stored in an airtight container (glass) away from sunlight as it reacts to light and heat. It talked about brown glass bottles for storage. Am I remembering correctly that some brown glass bottles/containers were logged from the crime(or remains) scene? I suppose this could simply be long neck beer bottles but I am wondering. And to be honest, if I had ill intent in my heart/head against someone, it didn't seem like it would be that difficult to make. Just sayin. jmo

 

[Searchfortruth]

i'm not following you here search (and i have a sneaking suspicion that it's my fault, not yours) what does the duct tape have to do w/ chloroform?

Sorry for not checking back sooner, I was wondering how the duct tape would fit into ibyounger's theory of a dead Caylee being put in the trunk. IMO, the duct tape was used on an alive, but maybe drugged Caylee, I can't see her using the duct tape if Caylee was already deceased.

 

[Valhall]

Sorry for not checking back sooner, I was wondering how the duct tape would fit into ibyounger's theory of a dead Caylee being put in the trunk. IMO, the duct tape was used on an alive, but maybe drugged Caylee, I can't see her using the duct tape if Caylee was already deceased.

Well, as I mentioned before (not sure if it was in this thread), there is an explanation for using the duct tape postmortem. If Caylee was just in the trunk (or just in the laundry bag in the trunk) from the 16th to the 18th/19th/20th, by that time her little face, due to decomposition processes, would have become very distorted including protruding tongue and excessive fluids issuing from the mouth. If KC was "double bagging" the body and doing bizarre stuff like sticking heart stickers on things, it may have been at that time that she put the duct tape over the mouth (both to avoid seeing what she was seeing, but also to try to stop the fluid).

 

[Searchfortruth]

Quoting myself here, to add an article from WFTV:

http://www.wftv.com/news/19346147/detail.html

New Documents May Give Casey's Defense Ammunition
Posted: 5:31 pm EDT May 1, 2009
Updated: 6:24 pm EDT May 1, 2009

-snip
The FBI did not test the hair found with Caylee's remains for chloroform, because its chemists said it wouldn't prove anything.

Chloroform is a by-product of decomposition. Even so, Eyewitness News has learned that prosecutors had someone else test Caylee's hair for chloroform and say the results will be in soon.

WOW ! I missed that part of the article !!!!! I just wonder if they have already received the results and the defense knows there was chloroform...thus the media blitz we saw recently ? It seems to me that Jose and friends would be screaming from the roof tops about this latest document dump and how the evidence shows Casey is "innocent", if there was nothing else...

 

[Searchfortruth]

Well, as I mentioned before (not sure if it was in this thread), there is an explanation for using the duct tape postmortem. If Caylee was just in the trunk (or just in the laundry bag in the trunk) from the 16th to the 18th/19th/20th, by that time her little face, due to decomposition processes, would have become very distorted including protruding tongue and excessive fluids issuing from the mouth. If KC was "double bagging" the body and doing bizarre stuff like sticking heart stickers on things, it may have been at that time that she put the duct tape over the mouth (both to avoid seeing what she was seeing, but also to try to stop the fluid).

I have a hard time seeing Casey bother with the remains after death. The bagging she had to do is as far as I can go, I just don't see her getting that close, duct tape close, once Caylee was dead...

 

[Valhall]

I have a hard time seeing Casey bother with the remains after death. The bagging she had to do is as far as I can go, I just don't see her getting that close, duct tape close, once Caylee was dead...

Yeah, but think about it. That takes at least lifting the body up if not outright picking it up. If she went to move the body around to get the second bag over Caylee and stuff started oozing all over the place, she probably would've had to do something to stop the "icky" from getting on her.

Sorry for the gross...but you can't avoid it when you get to this point. I can see KC putting the duct tape on Caylee's mouth to avoid getting "icky stuff" on herself, before I can see her doing anything with something "gross".

 

[Searchfortruth]

Yeah, but think about it. That takes at least lifting the body up if not outright picking it up. If she went to move the body around to get the second bag over Caylee and stuff started oozing all over the place, she probably would've had to do something to stop the "icky" from getting on her.

Sorry for the gross...but you can't avoid it when you get to this point. I can see KC putting the duct tape on Caylee's mouth to avoid getting "icky stuff" on herself, before I can see her doing anything with something "gross".

I picture her putting Caylee in a bag, but not looking too long at her face. Now, I could very well be wrong, but I worked in the medical field and the first couple of times I had to prep a deceased person before they were sent down to the morgue... it was essential to not look at the face too long. It was how I protected myself. Of course after a while you get used to it, but I am basing my opinion on the first couple of times I experienced death up close and personal. Casey of course is a whole other breed and maybe her cruelty, her detachment, allowed her to look at her daughter's face while putting duct tape on her.. I just don't see her getting any closer than she had to.

 

[steadychick]

I also worked in the medical field, and IMO, it doesn't make sense that the duct tape would have been applied to avoid the "icky stuff". Sorry if this offends, but after a few days the whole body is decomposing and the tissues are sloughing off easily when touched. I'm not sure tape on the mouth would have been of any benefit. This is one of the things that leads me to believe the tape was placed before death.

 

[steadychick]

I googled chloroform, how to make it, how to administer it again last night. I read that storing it is difficult and dangerous if you don't know what you are doing. It is to be stored in an airtight container (glass) away from sunlight as it reacts to light and heat. It talked about brown glass bottles for storage. Am I remembering correctly that some brown glass bottles/containers were logged from the crime(or remains) scene? I suppose this could simply be long neck beer bottles but I am wondering. And to be honest, if I had ill intent in my heart/head against someone, it didn't seem like it would be that difficult to make. Just sayin. jmo

Or how about a green plastic soda bottle? I don't think we've seen any results from this bottle with the tp roll and syringe.