NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #14

[laytonian]

the Chevron employee was clearing brush along Red Butte Creek at around 11 a.m. when he spotted something sticking out of the water that looked like a partially decomposed foot. It was caught under a tree limb and other brush near the densely vegetated, steep creek bank.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700041885/Possible-human-remains-found-near-Red-Butte-Garden.html

Body removed from SLC creek near oil spill site

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_15339115

After saying (an hour ago) that it would be several days before the remains were ID'd, they just announced the ID: a 52-year-old man from Summit County (Oakley, near the Park City area).

Story about identity: KSL.com

Backstory (oddly, not well-publicized -- this news junkie doesn't remember reading it): Deseret News

 

[swjaxon]

http://www.abc4.com/content/news/to...or-Steven-Koecher/TZCiDFTSYE2nP5k9f99GpQ.cspx


I have seen no follow up about bones that were found at the search, other than they were being tested. So it was probably nothing but they did find bones.

Sorry folks, I'm catching up...

The bones were all animal.

 

[Fairy1]

I don't really know how they work, but maybe he had an external hard drive. Could've been in his pocket when he appeared on that SCA video....

 

[laytonian]

I don't really know how they work, but maybe he had an external hard drive. Could've been in his pocket when he appeared on that SCA video....

.....and would have left its traces on the host computer. You can't plug anything into a computer, without it installing "something" (ie, drivers, data transfers, history, etc).

That's why the first time you use a USB device, it goes through an initial "device driver" set-up -- and subsequent uses, it just starts working.

 

[Fairy1]

.....and would have left its traces on the host computer. You can't plug anything into a computer, without it installing "something" (ie, drivers, data transfers, history, etc).

That's why the first time you use a USB device, it goes through an initial "device driver" set-up -- and subsequent uses, it just starts working.

Well, there ya go - I told you I didn't know how they work!

I'm married to a computer guy - you'd think I would be up on this stuff.

 

[laytonian]

Well, there ya go - I told you I didn't know how they work!

I'm married to a computer guy - you'd think I would be up on this stuff.

Having experience with that myself, I find it's best just to wonk my own way around the computer.

One rule: "you can't do a thing on a computer without leaving a trace".

It's best just to take the entire hard drive out, and take it with you - then run over everything else with a road grader. Then set it all on fire.

 

[Fairy1]

Having experience with that myself, I find it's best just to wonk my own way around the computer.

One rule: "you can't do a thing on a computer without leaving a trace".

It's best just to take the entire hard drive out, and take it with you - then run over everything else with a road grader. Then set it all on fire.

Well - that would only be necessary if you had something to hide, right?

We may just have to face it, Steven had nothing to hide. At least, not on the computer.

 

[laytonian]

Well - that would only be necessary if you had something to hide, right?

We may just have to face it, Steven had nothing to hide. At least, not on the computer.

...or not on THAT computer.

An iPod touch gives you free wifi at any free hotspot.
You don't even need an iphone for that.

 

[Fairy1]

...or not on THAT computer.

An iPod touch gives you free wifi at any free hotspot.
You don't even need an iphone for that.

Oh - for crying out loud! Maybe he bought one on ebay - or maybe he bought one from some punk on the street!

Technology seems to be the key to unlocking this mystery - regardless of what happened to Steven. But there is just no smoking gun!

We've always believed anything he may have been hiding might be found on the library computers. But what must be done to determine that for certain?

It's been said Steven would have needed to use is library card to log-in on their computers. Has anything been done to check?

My head hurts.

 

[laytonian]

Oh - for crying out loud! Maybe he bought one on ebay - or maybe he bought one from some punk on the street!

Technology seems to be the key to unlocking this mystery - regardless of what happened to Steven. But there is just no smoking gun!

We've always believed anything he may have been hiding might be found on the library computers. But what must be done to determine that for certain?

It's been said Steven would have needed to use is library card to log-in on their computers. Has anything been done to check?

My head hurts.

Here, here. Mine does too

:banghead:

 

[SleuthyMcSleutherson]

<snipped>

IF that's him, that also explains how he spent his time: gaming. And that might actually explain how he was spending his time. Maybe he was somehow addicted to the gamer thing? Maybe he WAS going to Vegas more than suspected?

Thanks for the reminder; I've sent KC a few questions (did he own an XBox or other game system, etc - and also about the eBay thing). I want to find out if those two eBay IDs are his, or if we're gossiping about a relative. She should know or find out.

This is an interesting idea. My brother in law is a gamer, and I know he's mentioned that you can surf the internet with gaming systems. I have no idea how, but maybe that's Steven's "other" computer (if he had one). Also, just because he didn't have internet access at his apt. doesn't mean that a neighbor close by didn't. It's pretty easy to pick up a connection if a neighbor has left theirs unsecured. I'm just trying to think of how he might have used the internet at his apt. with either his own computer or something like an XBox.

Here's an example of what I mean: http://www.ehow.com/how_4451247_surf-internet-playstation-3.html

 

[laytonian]

<snipped>


This is an interesting idea. My brother in law is a gamer, and I know he's mentioned that you can surf the internet with gaming systems. I have no idea how, but maybe that's Steven's "other" computer (if he had one). Also, just because he didn't have internet access at his apt. doesn't mean that a neighbor close by didn't. It's pretty easy to pick up a connection if a neighbor has left theirs unsecured. I'm just trying to think of how he might have used the internet at his apt. with either his own computer or something like an XBox.

Here's an example of what I mean: http://www.ehow.com/how_4451247_surf-internet-playstation-3.html

The closest unsecured network was out of the cul-de-sac and a couple houses 'round the corner -- but not accessible from Steven's house itself.
There's a map of Steven's home's location on the timeline.

I talked to KCN yesterday, and she said that Steven wasn't a gamer.

She's unsure whether either of those eBay accounts could be his, since he was on his mission in 1999 -- but I can't find the exact dates. Does anyone here know?

One account was established in July 1999 but never left feedback until 2001.

The account established in April 1999, never left any feedback at all and only received feedback between April 26 and July 4, 1999.

 

[carbuff]

After saying (an hour ago) that it would be several days before the remains were ID'd, they just announced the ID: a 52-year-old man from Summit County (Oakley, near the Park City area).

Story about identity: KSL.com

Backstory (oddly, not well-publicized -- this news junkie doesn't remember reading it): Deseret News

It appears from the background article that at one point Nelson told his son he was going out hiking in the canyon, and headed out in clothing and footwear totally inadequate to hiking in that terrain. Flip-flops? Ouch.

It makes me think once again how easy it is to get hurt and even kill yourself in rugged country if you're not paying attention. And if something like that happened to Steven, we're not going to find an answer until somebody stumbles across his body, because he could have gone so many places...

 

[laytonian]

It appears from the background article that at one point Nelson told his son he was going out hiking in the canyon, and headed out in clothing and footwear totally inadequate to hiking in that terrain. Flip-flops? Ouch.

'cept "that terrain" (University of Utah campus, eastern edge of SLC) is 43 miles away in Oakley, Utah -- his home, where his son saw him wearing flip-flops and talked to him.

It seems what happened, was that he told the family he was "going hiking" but somehow got himself to the University of Utah psychiatric ward, and checked himself in. I can't imagine how he got there. Oakley's a tiny rural place with no cab or bus service. Maybe he hitchhiked? Maybe he had a "friend"?

It makes me think once again how easy it is to get hurt and even kill yourself in rugged country if you're not paying attention. And if something like that happened to Steven, we're not going to find an answer until somebody stumbles across his body, because he could have gone so many places...

Sadly, I agree.

In the Nelson case, unless there's a better explanation, it seems he tried to walk out of the U of U area and found himself in the Red Butte gully -- and slipped into the water. Or maybe even committed suicide.

Where the body was found, was very close to where people congregate for the gardens, the concerts...for many nature activities. It's strange he could have been there for all that time. (Water doesn't run uphill, so the body had to have been in that general area.)

It just goes to show that you can be "right there" and you're not visible.

 

[carbuff]

'cept "that terrain" (University of Utah campus, eastern edge of SLC) is 43 miles away in Oakley, Utah -- his home, where his son saw him wearing flip-flops and talked to him.

It seems what happened, was that he told the family he was "going hiking" but somehow got himself to the University of Utah psychiatric ward, and checked himself in. I can't imagine how he got there. Oakley's a tiny rural place with no cab or bus service. Maybe he hitchhiked? Maybe he had a "friend"?

Poor man, it sounds like he had really gone off the deep end. I can picture him getting out of the psych ward and thinking, "What was I doing? Oh, right, hiking. Gotta go hiking." Maybe somebody who saw what distress he was in picked him up and took him there, trying to be helpful.

Sadly, I agree.

In the Nelson case, unless there's a better explanation, it seems he tried to walk out of the U of U area and found himself in the Red Butte gully -- and slipped into the water. Or maybe even committed suicide.

Where the body was found, was very close to where people congregate for the gardens, the concerts...for many nature activities. It's strange he could have been there for all that time. (Water doesn't run uphill, so the body had to have been in that general area.)

It just goes to show that you can be "right there" and you're not visible.

Yeah You don't have to be very far off the beaten path to be totally invisible.

 

[laytonian]

Poor man, it sounds like he had really gone off the deep end. I can picture him getting out of the psych ward and thinking, "What was I doing? Oh, right, hiking. Gotta go hiking." Maybe somebody who saw what distress he was in picked him up and took him there, trying to be helpful.

It depends what time it was, when he was last seen, if someone took him there.
Red Butte Garden closes at 9pm in August, and it costs $6 to get in.

It would have been a severe hike to get into the creek *above* the gardens. But if he was in mental distress, who knows what he was thinking.

Yeah You don't have to be very far off the beaten path to be totally invisible.

Yeah.
Like the mother-daughter who disappeared in our Uinta mountains a few years ago, and who took shelter to keep warm, after they (evidently) got lost.
Searchers walked right by them, many times - but didn't move the brush they'd piled around themselves.
It wasn't until the next year, when their personal effects were found strewn (animal activity) that they were discovered.

Much like how Steve Fossett was found.

That's why I wonder if something of Steven's, was found out by the Henderson airport.

 

[Fairy1]

I can't understand why there haven't been more searches planned for Steven. If the possibility of him lying out in the desert or up in the hills is really still on the table, why isn't anyone looking?

Is it possible there is reason to believe something else happened? Or he is gone, but it happened somewhere else?

Sometimes, I wish I was the detective in charge of this investigation so I had the power to question certain people. There's only so much we can do here. Tossing out ideas, theories, nuggets of potentially important info. But if it's all falling on deaf ears (well, eyes), it's all just dying on the vine.

 

[laytonian]

I can't understand why there haven't been more searches planned for Steven. If the possibility of him lying out in the desert or up in the hills is really still on the table, why isn't anyone looking?

Where to look?

Is it possible there is reason to believe something else happened? Or he is gone, but it happened somewhere else?

Sure. Anything's possible.

Sometimes, I wish I was the detective in charge of this investigation so I had the power to question certain people.

Fourth and Fifth Amendments to the Constitution, Miranda rights, etc.

LE actually has no more "power" to talk to someone than you do, except that LE has rules to abide by. They can bring them in, but all they have to say is that they're aware of their rights and will not talk.

It takes evidence before LE can get an arrest warrant.

There's only so much we can do here. Tossing out ideas, theories, nuggets of potentially important info. But if it's all falling on deaf ears (well, eyes), it's all just dying on the vine.

Well....we're trying to help. But we don't know the scope of information that's been developed, and we really have no right to that info.

This case is similar to the Erick Wales case, except Erick left a note. But maybe Erick left it to spare his parents the pain of a suicide?

 

[Fairy1]

Where to look?

Well, they could go back to the areas surrounding SCA, for starters. There's a lot of land out there. AND, as mentioned in earlier posts today, he may very well have been passed by during the first search.

Fourth and Fifth Amendments to the Constitution, Miranda rights, etc.

LE actually has no more "power" to talk to someone than you do, except that LE has rules to abide by. They can bring them in, but all they have to say is that they're aware of their rights and will not talk.

It takes evidence before LE can get an arrest warrant.

Yes, but they have weapons and are not afraid to knock on doors or bring someone in for questioning! At least, if someone SAID they are aware of their rights and refused to answer questions, it may be an indication of guilt and the investigation might take on a whole, new life. If all of LE took everyone's word for everything, no crimes would ever be solved. Sometimes, deeper digging is necessary.

Well....we're trying to help. But we don't know the scope of information that's been developed, and we really have no right to that info.

This case is similar to the Erick Wales case, except Erick left a note. But maybe Erick left it to spare his parents the pain of a suicide?

No, we don't. But that's what I'm saying! We can sort of figure out which way the wind is blowing by the activity - or inactivity - in the case. Or the direction it seems to be taking. For instance, last week on FB, the PI basically asked the perp to come forward and lay it out. Now see, that tells me they don't know where to turn next. No searches planned, no rattling the media. And most important of all, no Steven.

 

[sbakker]

Today, our autistic daughter was missing from her day training place. My daughter went to pick her up. Nobody could find her. She was found four plus miles away. She went from Clearfield to Layton. She walked into a office, my daughter's sis-in-law (who lives in SLC) was working in Layton for the day, noticed Codee(has only met her 4-5 times) and called my daughter. We do not know how she made it there, we think someone gave her a ride. She could not cross streets,stop lights, busy roads,etc. let alone find her way home.

It was so frrightning, just losing someone for that short of a time. many thoughts ran through my head. She is 36.

It really made me think of all our friends, who have lost someone dear to them. Bless you all.