UK Bolton - Woman's body found in Bolton cellar, discovered 14 December 1982

[RobinCAL]

Woman's body found in Bolton cellar mystery reinvestigated

Detectives still do not know the identity of the woman whose remains were found exactly 40 years ago.

www.bbc.co.uk

Exactly 40 years ago, a woman's partially mummified remains were discovered in the cellar of a house, wrapped in a newspaper from 1966.
Detectives still do not know the real identity of the woman they nicknamed Mary Ellen.
Now a new BBC Radio Manchester investigation, The Forgotten Dead, has re-examined the case in an effort to solve the mystery.

The News of the World found around the woman's body was dated 13 March 1966, naturally leading police to believe her remains could have lain undiscovered for 16 years.
A later forensic examination suggested the woman had been white, about 40 years old and possibly only 4ft 10in (147cm) tall.

The Home Office pathologist also revealed there had been no sign of anyone else being involved in her death.


But that's not what former Bolton Evening News crime reporter Steve Howarth believes.
Among the first people on the scene, he covered the Mary Ellen story from the beginning.
"There was absolutely no way this poor woman crawled in there and just died," he said. "Somebody put her there. I'm pretty sure of it.

 

[Hochman]

Woman's body found in Bolton cellar mystery reinvestigated

Detectives still do not know the identity of the woman whose remains were found exactly 40 years ago.

www.bbc.co.uk

Exactly 40 years ago, a woman's partially mummified remains were discovered in the cellar of a house, wrapped in a newspaper from 1966.
Detectives still do not know the real identity of the woman they nicknamed Mary Ellen.
Now a new BBC Radio Manchester investigation, The Forgotten Dead, has re-examined the case in an effort to solve the mystery.

The News of the World found around the woman's body was dated 13 March 1966, naturally leading police to believe her remains could have lain undiscovered for 16 years.
A later forensic examination suggested the woman had been white, about 40 years old and possibly only 4ft 10in (147cm) tall.

The Home Office pathologist also revealed there had been no sign of anyone else being involved in her death.


But that's not what former Bolton Evening News crime reporter Steve Howarth believes.
Among the first people on the scene, he covered the Mary Ellen story from the beginning.
"There was absolutely no way this poor woman crawled in there and just died," he said. "Somebody put her there. I'm pretty sure of it.

Picture from source provided

 

[sonz82]

I can't find a description, more info or a photo but Florence Mary Ainger age 40 vanished from Brighouse in 1951 which is less than hour away from Bolton.

Florence Mary Ainger - Unsolved Murder 1951 - River Calder, Brighouse - Florence Mary Ainger Unsolved Mysteries UK

Florence Mary Ainger vanished.

www.unsolved-murders.co.uk

 

[MarziPanda]

Interesting that the end of the article mentions genetic genealogy. As far as I know it hasn't been used in the UK because of privacy concerns/laws. It says you can find out more by listening to the BBC Sounds episode about it. I might do that when I get the chance, would be interesting to see if there's anything new on using that technique in the UK. There are lots of UK Does I'd love to see ID'd.

Personally I think this woman could be Irish. She had rosary beads, and it was quite common in the 60s for young Irish women to come to the UK to look for work. A lot ended up in Lancashire because they'd come over on the ferry to Liverpool. Sadly some ended up being taken advantage of, jobless and homeless. That being said, I'm not entirely convinced she was a homeless lady who perished seeking shelter. For me it would depend on just how wrapped up in newspaper she was. If every part of her was covered, that leads me towards murder instead.

That being said, from some historical weather data, March in 1966 was a cold one, with a mild start but snow showers from the 11th. So I could see how a homeless person might get desperate.

 

[Luwin]

I read an article the other day (completely unrelated) about a guy who was previously homeless and he said he often wrapped himself in newspaper at night whilst homeless to keep warm

 

[Luwin]

I also think if you were homeless in freezing conditions you'd likely access any undercover/inside area that you could

 

[Terryb808]

Just finished listening to the BBC Sounds podcast on Mary Ellen. It’s very interesting and covers a lot more than just Mary Ellen.

I wondered if the newspapers could be misleading, often areas like that are likely to have old newspapers that have been there for years.

Also, many rough sleepers said they found it odd that if she was sleeping rough why didn’t she have more things with her?

Another thing they said was that rough sleepers share locations, so why wasn’t she found earlier?

IMO she wasn’t a rough sleeper and was hidden there by someone.

 

[Nell91]

Hello everyone!
This may sound a little crazy but please bare with me.
My great nan disappeared in the mid 60's. Just vanished. My still living nan (her daughter) hasn't heard from her since, not once. She will not talk about her mother however which makes things harder.
The location between the house this lady was found in and the house my great gran lived in at the time is a 7 minute journey.
I have searched high and low for this lady for years, I have found marriage certificates but not a single inkling of what happened to her and no death record. It baffles me. I know this is a huge long shot but I feel I have to know conclusively whether this is Elsie or not.
Does anybody know who I would contact please?

 

[Nell91]

Bump

 

[DanceCard]

Hello everyone!
This may sound a little crazy but please bare with me.
My great nan disappeared in the mid 60's. Just vanished. My still living nan (her daughter) hasn't heard from her since, not once. She will not talk about her mother however which makes things harder.
The location between the house this lady was found in and the house my great gran lived in at the time is a 7 minute journey.
I have searched high and low for this lady for years, I have found marriage certificates but not a single inkling of what happened to her and no death record. It baffles me. I know this is a huge long shot but I feel I have to know conclusively whether this is Elsie or not.
Does anybody know who I would contact please?

The journalist has left her email at the bottom of the linked bbc article in post #1. You could email her if the details in the article, dates etc seem to fit. She may have current police contacts she can refer you to. Alternatively contact GM Police at Bolton.


ETA...Her case is listed here. UK Missing Persons Unit
Try that contact first.

 

[Nell91]

Thank you so much! I will do that

 

[Lyndaloo]

Thank you so much! I will do that

Please let us know how you get on x

 

[Melt71]

Does anybody know who I would contact please?

You could also contact the police and ask them to check into the possibility. You would need to be prepared with the information on how closely she matched these remains - for example provide any photographs you could find or any information on her height etc.

 

[Nell91]

Thank you everyone- unfortunately I know little to nothing about Elsie, just her name and vague year of birth (and the street she lived on when she disappeared, which is 7 mins from where this Doe was found). I know it's a huge long shot but I'd like to rule it out. Height wise, all the women in my family are below 5ft which would match but plenty of people are on the shorter side. Elsie could have simply started a new life, but I'm not sure how easy that would have been in the 60's, or how easy changing her name could have been. It's just really frustrating that nobody seems to know what happened to her. I will keep you all updated! Thanks again

 

[Legally Bland]

Thank you everyone- unfortunately I know little to nothing about Elsie, just her name and vague year of birth (and the street she lived on when she disappeared, which is 7 mins from where this Doe was found). I know it's a huge long shot but I'd like to rule it out. Height wise, all the women in my family are below 5ft which would match but plenty of people are on the shorter side. Elsie could have simply started a new life, but I'm not sure how easy that would have been in the 60's, or how easy changing her name could have been. It's just really frustrating that nobody seems to know what happened to her. I will keep you all updated! Thanks again

You may have already done this, but name changes are supposed to be notified in the London Gazette. There's a filter for it under 'people'.

But you may want to also search all types of notices as it has bankruptcy notices etc.

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/all-notices?ref=topmenu

 

[Lyndaloo]

Thank you everyone- unfortunately I know little to nothing about Elsie, just her name and vague year of birth (and the street she lived on when she disappeared, which is 7 mins from where this Doe was found). I know it's a huge long shot but I'd like to rule it out. Height wise, all the women in my family are below 5ft which would match but plenty of people are on the shorter side. Elsie could have simply started a new life, but I'm not sure how easy that would have been in the 60's, or how easy changing her name could have been. It's just really frustrating that nobody seems to know what happened to her. I will keep you all updated! Thanks again

Nell do you know at all if your great grandmother Elsie was reported to police as a missing person at the time of her disappearance?

 

[Nell91]

Thank you both so much for your info!
Elsie was not reported missing. All I know is that when my nan was a teenager in the mid 60's, her mum walked out one day and never came back. Nan always thought that when she had her own children, Elsie would reappear but she never did. I think everyone assumed she left her (apparently abusive, from what I've been told) husband, and made a new life for herself. I really hope this is the case, but it'll also be very sad for my Nan that her mum did in fact just leave her. I will check the name change registry now, thank you! I'm thinking of approaching Salvation Army to try and track her down- I've combed through Ancestry and all the local parish records available at our Town Hall and she isn't on any of them though.

 

[Melt71]

Have you done a commercial DNA test @Nell91 ? If Elsie left and started a new life with other children you may find you can match up with members of her 'new' family and find out what happened.

 

[Lucy6226]

Thank you both so much for your info!
Elsie was not reported missing. All I know is that when my nan was a teenager in the mid 60's, her mum walked out one day and never came back. Nan always thought that when she had her own children, Elsie would reappear but she never did. I think everyone assumed she left her (apparently abusive, from what I've been told) husband, and made a new life for herself. I really hope this is the case, but it'll also be very sad for my Nan that her mum did in fact just leave her. I will check the name change registry now, thank you! I'm thinking of approaching Salvation Army to try and track her down- I've combed through Ancestry and all the local parish records available at our Town Hall and she isn't on any of them though.

Salvation Army are very good at tracing family members. I know someone who's mother walked out when they were 2yrs old, Salvation Army traced her 40+ years later. The mother said she hadn't been in touch as she just presumed they would hate her for leaving. Might be similar in Elsie's case?

It's possible if she was in an abusive relationship that she moved far away and perhaps changed her name?

 

[Lucy6226]

Thank you both so much for your info!
Elsie was not reported missing. All I know is that when my nan was a teenager in the mid 60's, her mum walked out one day and never came back. Nan always thought that when she had her own children, Elsie would reappear but she never did. I think everyone assumed she left her (apparently abusive, from what I've been told) husband, and made a new life for herself. I really hope this is the case, but it'll also be very sad for my Nan that her mum did in fact just leave her. I will check the name change registry now, thank you! I'm thinking of approaching Salvation Army to try and track her down- I've combed through Ancestry and all the local parish records available at our Town Hall and she isn't on any of them though.

Forgot to say, if you live near Bolton, the library have a history centre and can help with family tree searching and have full ancestry membership access