Australia - JS, 32 y.o. man, charged w/ murder of 9 y.o. girl , Mt Wilson, 13 January 2022 #2

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I can’t be the only one not buying Justin’s BS story. He is the classic DV perp - deny, blame, twist the narrative, turn himself into the victim. But maybe his narrative is smart - mother-blaming WORKS. Kallista’s choices have not prioritised her child’s welfare, we can all see that, but because she is a mother she will be judged more harshly than the actual murderer of her child. She will be unsympathetic to a jury (and there are more men than women on this jury). And if you don’t think this narrative can turn a jury, I refer you to the story of Ebony, a little child who starved to death in the care of her parents. The father, a known perpetrator of domestic violence, found guilty of manslaughter. The mother, his life long victim, guilty of murder. For the same crime. The argument? The mother was more responsible for Ebony’s care. No one was talking about coercive control then, sadly. This is a very different crime but it highlights the often higher standard that mothers are judged against. Starve death: mother jailed for life
 
The Daily Mail report from todays court….

The court was played a phone call which Justin Stein allegedly made to his mother days after his arrest, where he says he witnessed the moment the nine-year-old was shot.

In the call, Stein's mother, Annemie Stein, begged her son not to say the fatal shooting occurred on the family's luxury Mount Wilson property in the Blue Mountains, west of Sydney.

In reply, Stein agreed and said instead it was 'on crown land, behind the shed, on the fire break'.

Several prison phone calls between Stein and his mother after his arrest were played to the court, in which she asked him to explain why Charlise's body had been in a barrel in the back of his ute.

They also discussed the fact that Kallista was pregnant because, Stein explained, her medication '*advertiser censored**ed with the contraception', the jury heard.

So it's going to be born an ice addict,' Annemie allegedly asked her son in the call.

Stein had earlier said in the call that 'I don't want to have it', but Annemie replied that Kallista 'is going to have it', the court heard.

Annemie also said to her son in the call that Kallista had once threatened that 'she was going to take you and me down', the court heard.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Jury told of schoolgirl's last words before she was allegedly shot

The court was played a phone call which Justin Stein allegedly made to his mother days after his arrest, where he says he witnessed the moment nine year old Charlise Mutten was shot.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk
 
Observe_dont_Absorb said:
What do others think?
Click to expand...

I'm not giving her a pass, she may not have been there for whatever lead up to precious CM being murdered *but* she had a duty of care to & for that child - I've yet to read anything that shows anything about KM that shows she prioritised CM *above-all-else*.
Charlise Mutten murder trial told of schoolgirl's alleged last words before she was shot twice - as accused killer claims her mother pulled the trigger while on three-day meth binge
"Stein allegedly told his mother that having Charlise's body in a barrel in the back tray of his ute was Kallista's idea; he hadn't known the girl's remains were in there until later, the jury heard. 'That was her doing. She put it on back of (his vehicle). I picked up stuff to do cement work,' he said in the record call played in court."
KM must be *INCREDIBLY* strong to haul that barrel, full of her daughter's deceased body & sand, up onto the tray of the 4x4 ute, shown in post by @Marg944 Australia - JS, 32 y.o. man, charged w/ murder of 9 y.o. girl , Mt Wilson, 13 January 2022 #2.
*I have a big problem with the actions KM took or didn't take - after the event - that matters to me as much as what took place leading up to & CM's murder.
As for the smirking, smarmy, disgusting other 1/2 - IF her (KM) fingerprints aren't on the gun & OR the barrel & OR the blue tarp, the ropes & blah, blah, blah... He's screwed, another dumb *alleged-at-this-point-in-time* murderer.

Moo.
Edit: added linked article & quote.
 
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sunnybree said:
I can’t be the only one not buying Justin’s BS story. He is the classic DV perp - deny, blame, twist the narrative, turn himself into the victim. But maybe his narrative is smart - mother-blaming WORKS. Kallista’s choices have not prioritised her child’s welfare, we can all see that, but because she is a mother she will be judged more harshly than the actual murderer of her child. She will be unsympathetic to a jury (and there are more men than women on this jury). And if you don’t think this narrative can turn a jury, I refer you to the story of Ebony, a little child who starved to death in the care of her parents. The father, a known perpetrator of domestic violence, found guilty of manslaughter. The mother, his life long victim, guilty of murder. For the same crime. The argument? The mother was more responsible for Ebony’s care. No one was talking about coercive control then, sadly. This is a very different crime but it highlights the often higher standard that mothers are judged against. Starve death: mother jailed for life
Click to expand...

I agree with the points made above but I also feel that the birth mother of a child is naturally supposed to keep that youngster safe from harm as opposed to feed them to the wolf.

Nobody in their right mind would have expected the drug addicted violent schizophrenic recently released from prison male to have become a responsible care giver.

I fully appreciate that vulnerable women who do this are the victims of not only of their abuser but the patriarchy itself and they have lost agency and the power of correct decision making -but- they also created the perfect storm and set the whole situation up out of thin air by not putting their child's welfare first, or anywhere in fact. I think this is why the mothers are judged so harshly because we're all aware of what goes on in the world these days and there's less excuse for exposing a child to a predatory abuser, simultaneously there's a lot of help and support available for struggling mothers.

JMO MOO
 
Marg944 said:
The Daily Mail report from todays court….

The court was played a phone call which Justin Stein allegedly made to his mother days after his arrest, where he says he witnessed the moment the nine-year-old was shot.

In the call, Stein's mother, Annemie Stein, begged her son not to say the fatal shooting occurred on the family's luxury Mount Wilson property in the Blue Mountains, west of Sydney.

In reply, Stein agreed and said instead it was 'on crown land, behind the shed, on the fire break'.

Several prison phone calls between Stein and his mother after his arrest were played to the court, in which she asked him to explain why Charlise's body had been in a barrel in the back of his ute.

They also discussed the fact that Kallista was pregnant because, Stein explained, her medication '*advertiser censored**ed with the contraception', the jury heard.

So it's going to be born an ice addict,' Annemie allegedly asked her son in the call.

Stein had earlier said in the call that 'I don't want to have it', but Annemie replied that Kallista 'is going to have it', the court heard.

Annemie also said to her son in the call that Kallista had once threatened that 'she was going to take you and me down', the court heard.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Jury told of schoolgirl's last words before she was allegedly shot

The court was played a phone call which Justin Stein allegedly made to his mother days after his arrest, where he says he witnessed the moment nine year old Charlise Mutten was shot.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk
Click to expand...
I think it's really interesting that...... IMO

JS's mother particularly wanted to know if the shooting was on their property.

And JS said it was on "Crown Land"

Well done KM for at least carrying out the shooting just off the property.(Sarcastic eye roll) Hang on JS - really!! IMO

I mean let's work out who would know how to use guns, KM or JS ?? who steals guns KM or JS?? MOO

Annemie also said to her son in the call that Kallista had once threatened that 'she was going to take you and me down', the court heard.

I wonder when this happened - was it after the death of CM??? IMO

Or is AS implying that KM was setting it all up from the beginning?? JMO

It is interesting that KM was staying in a caravan quite a distance from the property - I guess AS was not a fan. JMO
 
Observe_dont_Absorb said:
Nobody in their right mind would have expected the drug addicted violent schizophrenic recently released from prison male to have become a responsible care giver.
Click to expand...

And that is where the plan for a happy and safe reunion fell apart. KM wasn't in her right mind, and the carers were under the mistaken impression that she was.


"[Kallista Mutten] was a woman who had been an ice user since she was in her early 20s and she continued to use ice … [she] admitted to using ice on the very day the Crown says the child was killed," Ms Davenport said.

www.abc.net.au

Charlise Mutten shot in face and back by stepfather before he dumped her body in barrel, court told

Justin Laurens Stein pleaded not guilty on Monday to the murder of nine-year-old Charlise Mutten, on day one of a six-week trial at the NSW Supreme Court in Parramatta.
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au
 
drsleuth said:
I'm taking everything he says with a grain of salt.
Click to expand...
I agree 100%, he is not to be believed. But there is some relevance of the Crown land in this case. The gardener was questioned when he was on the witness stand, about the gate between the Wildenstein property and the Crown land which is at the back of the property, behind a shed. He was asked if he had a key to the gate, and he said that he did not, as he had no need to access that area as it was Crown land.

I heard this the day I attended court, but I didn’t know why he was being questioned about this. Maybe we will find out in the days to come.

IMO
 
I think the defence are continuing to try to create reasonable doubt by pointing the finger at KM. I think this exchange was trying to establish that KM may have hidden the firearms.
But it is still not clear to me which firearm was used to kill Charlise.


On Wednesday Carolyn Davenport SC, representing Mr Stein, told the court Ms Mutten drove off with Mr Stein’s car twice in the early hours of January 13, 2022.
...
Under cross-examination of Detective Sergeant Bradley Gardiner, Ms Davenport asked whether Ms Mutten was tracked when she left with Mr Stein’s car the second time that morning.
She asked: “There’s no tracking of her phone after she left the property the second time?”
“No, that’s correct,” Det Sgt Gardiner said.

Ms Davenport confirmed: “There’s no tracking of where she went between 9am and 10.30am on January 13”.
Det Sgt Gardiner told the court Ms Mutten had told police where she went.
“There’s no evidence to show us where she went,” Ms Davenport asked.
The officer-in-charge responded: “No”.

 
This case really gets to me. Every time the MSM publishes photos of Charlise I think why did such a child deserve to be around such garbage humans as her mother and Stein -- both of whom IMO are complicit, one way or another in her murder.

I can only imagine the enormous anguish the grandparents must feel at having let her 'holiday' with this pair of drug-addled losers.
 
Last edited:
SouthAussie said:
I think the defence are continuing to try to create reasonable doubt by pointing the finger at KM. I think this exchange was trying to establish that KM may have hidden the firearms.
But it is still not clear to me which firearm was used to kill Charlise.


On Wednesday Carolyn Davenport SC, representing Mr Stein, told the court Ms Mutten drove off with Mr Stein’s car twice in the early hours of January 13, 2022.
...
Under cross-examination of Detective Sergeant Bradley Gardiner, Ms Davenport asked whether Ms Mutten was tracked when she left with Mr Stein’s car the second time that morning.
She asked: “There’s no tracking of her phone after she left the property the second time?”
“No, that’s correct,” Det Sgt Gardiner said.

Ms Davenport confirmed: “There’s no tracking of where she went between 9am and 10.30am on January 13”.
Det Sgt Gardiner told the court Ms Mutten had told police where she went.
“There’s no evidence to show us where she went,” Ms Davenport asked.
The officer-in-charge responded: “No”.

Click to expand...
The defence’s plan is working on me!
 

Lawyers for alleged murderer Justin Stein claims mother of Charlise Mutten disappeared for more than an hour, jury hears​


“Under cross-examination of Detective Sergeant Bradley Gardiner, Ms Davenport asked whether Ms Mutten was tracked when she left with Mr Stein’s car the second time that morning.

She asked: “There’s no tracking of her phone after she left the property the second time?”


“No, that’s correct,” Det Sgt Gardiner said.

Ms Davenport confirmed: “There’s no tracking of where she went between 9am and 10.30am on January 13”.

Det Sgt Gardiner told the court Ms Mutten had told police where she went.

“There’s no evidence to show us where she went,” Ms Davenport asked.

The officer-in-charge responded: “No”.

Ms Davenport then asked if there was any evidence to show Mr Stein drove to the location where the firearms were found on a fire trail near the Mount Wilson property.

Again, Det Sgt Gardiner said there was no evidence.”

 
I'm somewhat confused by the evidence being given in court.

So, police arrest Stein and interview him for some time, during which it seems he pointed the finger at Mutten as being the shooter. Did the police then wheel in Mutten for questioning? If so, how did she explain the missing hour or so to their satisfaction?

Surely if she could not provide a confirmed alibi, then she would also be facing charges as an accomplice if not more.
 
JBowie said:
I'm somewhat confused by the evidence being given in court.

So, police arrest Stein and interview him for some time, during which it seems he pointed the finger at Mutten as being the shooter. Did the police then wheel in Mutten for questioning? If so, how did she explain the missing hour or so to their satisfaction?

Surely if she could not provide a confirmed alibi, then she would also be facing charges as an accomplice if not more.
Click to expand...
I have wondered if further charges (eg child neglect) will come after this trial??? Is KM being used as a witness for the prosecution in this case, and then when this trial is finalised the police may charge her???


JMO…..
 
JBowie said:
I'm somewhat confused by the evidence being given in court.

So, police arrest Stein and interview him for some time, during which it seems he pointed the finger at Mutten as being the shooter. Did the police then wheel in Mutten for questioning? If so, how did she explain the missing hour or so to their satisfaction?

Surely if she could not provide a confirmed alibi, then she would also be facing charges as an accomplice if not more.
Click to expand...

First interview, a real estate agent was responsible for Charlise's disappearance.

Second interview, Charlise didn't go to Mount Helen with him. And they left Charlise at the caravan park when he picked up her mother the next day to go back to Mount Helen.

Between then and now, he has decided that KM killed Charlise at Mount Helen.

www.abc.net.au

Alleged killer of 9yo girl changed story hours after first police interview, court told

A NSW Supreme Court jury is played the second police interview with Justin Stein that records a key difference from his first.
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au
 
JBowie said:
This is what I'm not quite following. So this new story blaming Mutten for the shooting has arisen in court, not during a police interview?
Click to expand...

That is the impression that I have. Because it is not mentioned in the first two police interviews.

The story was possibly created when he eventually saw the police brief with his lawyer and realised there is evidence that Charlise was killed at Mount Helen, and he was driving around for 5 hours (originating in Mount Helen) with an "effing kid" in a barrel in the back of his ute.

imo
 
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