Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 6 murders, July 2023 #14

[eishish]

IIRC, Gary Ridgway’s name came up during the investigation into the Green River Killer. Police reportedly spoke to several “girls” who said they felt he was “harmless” because they had previously done “business” with him and nothing bad happened.

Again, IIRC, Ridgway later admitting to having a “regular” relationship with prostitutes so that he would be viewed as being “safe” and they wouldn’t be afraid of getting in the car with him.

Wld seem so, but none have come forward...nikki nvr had interactions w him cept once. In light of current situ wld believe that many/any wld come forward. $, book deals, tv, you name it. The do not answer in phone said he was marked. The fact at least 6 were nvr seen again, alarming and must have been noticed. Am not disagreeing, just where are they? So odd

 

[snarast]

Wld seem so, but none have come forward...nikki nvr had interactions w him cept once. In light of current situ wld believe that many/any wld come forward. $, book deals, tv, you name it. The do not answer in phone said he was marked. The fact at least 6 were nvr seen again, alarming and must have been noticed. Am not disagreeing, just where are they? So odd

I’m guessing ppl who are in the business don’t really change their mind in a jiffy because someone has been charged (RH) by a new set of suits. ”The street don’t change but maybe their names” or smthn like that.

Plus it would seem when RH went over the line he was all in. But that must have been at most 1% - or more likely 0.1% of his ”temp workers”. Since a lot of johns are less than chivalrous, he probably didn’t stick out. Except as an ogre. I bet some of the girls who had to work with him did their best to forget…

Another answer to the question where all RH’s escorts went, other than to the morgue - maybe he was the last stop on some particularly vile trafficking circuit. Nobody gets out alive.

 

[eishish]

I’m guessing ppl who are in the business don’t really change their mind in a jiffy because someone has been charged (RH) by a new set of suits. ”The street don’t change but maybe their names” or smthn like that.

Plus it would seem when RH went over the line he was all in. But that must have been at most 1% - or more likely 0.1% of his ”temp workers”. Since a lot of johns are less than chivalrous, he probably didn’t stick out. Except as an ogre. I bet some of the girls who had to work with him did their best to forget…

Or maybe he was the last stop on some particularly vile trafficking circuit. Nobody gets out really am shocked that very

I’m guessing ppl who are in the business don’t really change their mind in a jiffy because someone has been charged (RH) by a new set of suits. ”The street don’t change but maybe their names” or smthn like that.

Plus it would seem when RH went over the line he was all in. But that must have been at most 1% - or more likely 0.1% of his ”temp workers”. Since a lot of johns are less than chivalrous, he probably didn’t stick out. Except as an ogre. I bet some of the girls who had to work with him did their best to forget…

Another answer to the question where all RH’s escorts went, other than to the morgue - maybe he was the last stop on some particularly vile trafficking circuit. Nobody gets out alive.

Am shocked all around by so few coming forward, anyone...but fear is probably very strong. So many different types involved. Going way back too.

 

[FromGermany1]

Totally agreed on this. But the same hand appeared to be at work for these three victims: Colleen McNamee, Sandra Costilla, and Rita Tangredi. The posing, the woodchips, the left shoe, etc. And all these victims were petite. That's got to be the same hand at work in all three murders. So JB was convicted with DNA of CM and RT murders. But RH is now charged with SC. To me, this means there has to be some kind of association/link between RH and JB. Either they actually know each other (ghastly to think about) OR jmo RH was basically stalking JB and framing him. Stalking and framing JB-- why JB? RH would still somehow have to be aware of JB's existence and activities that JB was undoubtedly trying to conceal. And it's not like RH could "know" they were one day going to bring in Bittrolff's brother for that DNA sample.

And am wondering if the woodchips/sawdust possibly came from the victims being "stored" or maybe hidden in a compost heap. But where??

RH could have used JB as a supplier for wood, he needed for his hobby or his hobby (woodworking or murdering). Maybe, RH knew JB because of that, and they talked about things (big talker, that RH is) and their main theme was "killing on LI" and what to think of it.
If JB's 2 proven victims were petite young girls, then it maybe just a coincidence, that RH's victims also were petite girls. Schoolgirls (likely preferred by the killers) would have been missed and searched for by their parents and families, so weren't smart to have them kidnapped. SWs with the optics like a schoolgirl (?) were the better alternative for these killers - and there were mannny of them to choose from, it seems.
If the victims were "stored" somewhere, the killers had to drive with them to and from the store-place to put them to their final destination. First a victim nearly alive or just murdered, later the same victim, no longer in intact condition. Wasn't that too much of a risk to have them in their car?

 

[Baby baby Jane]

In all the articles I've read about KV none have said that she wasn't deceased for long when her partial remains were found on 4-20-96 on Fire Island.
These Include the April 1996 articles when her remains were found.
Do you have any links for that information?

There is a WS dedicated to her as 9098 Jane Doe. Maybe you find what you need there. When remains were found, in a plastic garbage bag they were able to describe skin, scars in detail, fresh pedicure & polish. At the time, reports were looking for missing persons “missing 2 weeks prior”

 

[dotr]

There is a WS dedicated to her as 9098 Jane Doe. Maybe you find what you need there. When remains were found, in a plastic garbage bag they were able to describe skin, scars in detail, fresh pedicure & polish. At the time, reports were looking for missing persons “missing 2 weeks prior”

Possible Victim: Fire Island Jane Doe, UP9098, found Davis Park Apr 1996 & Ocean Parkway Apr 2011 - Karen Vergata

Do they know or are they incompetent? Sadly, it could be either way with them.

www.websleuths.com

Long Island murder victim "Jane Doe No. 7" identified as Karen Vergata, 27 years after she went missing

Karen Vergata had been living in Manhattan before she disappeared around Feb. 14, 1996, officials said.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[CuriousCricket]

(snipped)
If the victims were "stored" somewhere, the killers had to drive with them to and from the store-place to put them to their final destination. First a victim nearly alive or just murdered, later the same victim, no longer in intact condition. Wasn't that too much of a risk to have them in their car?

How many times are you actually stopped by LE? Don't you think that once you've killed a time or two, maybe sweated bullets the first several times you've transported a victim, you become as comfortable with it as driving to the local store?

The few times I've been stopped: Driver's License checkpoint, speeding, temporary tag, LE has never had me pop the trunk. Once in the dark, they had a flashlight and saw my two dogs in the back. He could not see the temporary tag in the back window, then apologized for stopping me. Another, we had a packed station wagon returning from vacation and were stopped in the mountains because of an intense manhunt.

The percentage of trips in which I even came under any scrutiny is so miniscule that someone like RH seeming like a good citizen with his story ready and a locked cover on his truck was safe. From reports, people with tail lights out or some other preventable cause for stop should not be carrying drugs or running stop signs or giving anyone cause to stop and search. But the ordinary citizen? The odds of ever being stopped are almost non-existent.

I think the first few times would be nerve-racking, but after that? No, perhaps just part of the game.

 

[Ruminations]

Totally agreed on this. But the same hand appeared to be at work for these three victims: Colleen McNamee, Sandra Costilla, and Rita Tangredi. The posing, the woodchips, the left shoe, etc. And all these victims were petite. That's got to be the same hand at work in all three murders. So JB was convicted with DNA of CM and RT murders. But RH is now charged with SC. To me, this means there has to be some kind of association/link between RH and JB. Either they actually know each other (ghastly to think about) OR jmo RH was basically stalking JB and framing him. Stalking and framing JB-- why JB? RH would still somehow have to be aware of JB's existence and activities that JB was undoubtedly trying to conceal. And it's not like RH could "know" they were one day going to bring in Bittrolff's brother for that DNA sample.

And am wondering if the woodchips/sawdust possibly came from the victims being "stored" or maybe hidden in a compost heap. But where??

There is something to learn about the sawdust. Apparently, it was tiny specks of wood per LE. According to the defense, it was mishandled and not available to be tested to even confirm that it was actually wood. There were also two different LE suspects. (!) One of them had wood chips in his car that were disposed of accidentally to make room for new evidence. (!) One of them had his ex-wife call in that she thought he killed one of the victims that Bittrolff was accused of at the time-now convicted. One of them had his investigation file about his being a suspect in the murder disposed of prematurely. (!)

I don't know which victim a police ex-wife had believed her husband had killed, nor do I know if that has ever been released. I also don't know which cop suspect is which-who had wood chips in his car-who had his investigation file thrown out...

One thing I can "clear" LE of is planting DNA. They collected it decades before they identified it. So, while there is some reason to explore the possibility that Suffolk police made the facts fit Bittrolff, there also is the really suspicious fact that his DNA was, amongst the DNA of other men, found on the victims. And Bittrolff apparently answered an interrogation question about purchasing sex like a true AH. Something like, "I don't have to pay; I get sex when I want it." (Not sure if the average SCPD interviewer would be as judgmental as I am about that answer.) While I dont remember the exact AH words, they made him seem strangely evasive for the seriousness of the charges. I would suggest saying nothing at all without a lawyer, but if the question were answered, I would say this would be a bad time to lie about sex which is contact that clearly leaves a trace, even in the 90's.

But the LE "expert" on the DNA evidence was dicey. They testified that the DNA was left within 1/2 hour of the murder. The public defender did not bring in their own expert, but apparently if they had, they would have said the sex was within 24 hours or slightly more of the murder.

I would love to see the actual testimony at the trial. SC keeps evidence close to their chest. I think it's possible that the similarities among the three murders Bittrolff was accused of are a bit over-stated. I guess that Bittrolff's DNA was not on Sandra. She sounds horrifically overkilled. But she may not have been raped with a p***s.


MOO

 

[FromGermany1]

How many times are you actually stopped by LE? Don't you think that once you've killed a time or two, maybe sweated bullets the first several times you've transported a victim, you become as comfortable with it as driving to the local store?

The few times I've been stopped: Driver's License checkpoint, speeding, temporary tag, LE has never had me pop the trunk. Once in the dark, they had a flashlight and saw my two dogs in the back. He could not see the temporary tag in the back window, then apologized for stopping me. Another, we had a packed station wagon returning from vacation and were stopped in the mountains because of an intense manhunt.

The percentage of trips in which I even came under any scrutiny is so miniscule that someone like RH seeming like a good citizen with his story ready and a locked cover on his truck was safe. From reports, people with tail lights out or some other preventable cause for stop should not be carrying drugs or running stop signs or giving anyone cause to stop and search. But the ordinary citizen? The odds of ever being stopped are almost non-existent.

I think the first few times would be nerve-racking, but after that? No, perhaps just part of the game.

On other threads here on WS I always had the impression, it would be rather luck to not get stopped by police, so very risky to have a dead body in the car. My impression might be wrong. Idk, I'm living in another country.

 

[Ruminations]

Def w the carpenter, Woodworking of both it is interesting. The camp idea very interesting. Along w the duckboat. Burlap and the chips def tie into hunting, a chipper perhaps, sawdust from spent wood or some type of groundcover, animal bedding. So interesting as maybe a mo change up of chips from burlap as miss- leaders to le??? Who knows

If the wood- like substance had been preserved it could be confirmed to be fresh wood chips or lumber or pressure treated lumber or pressed wood and the species of tree(s) involved.

Bittrolff's attorney (whose job it is is to sow doubt) said he didn't even know that it was wood.

If it were from tree work, it would be green wood.

MOO

 

[iamshadow21]

On other threads here on WS I always had the impression, it would be rather luck to not get stopped by police, so very risky to have a dead body in the car. My impression might be wrong. Idk, I'm living in another country.

A remarkable amount of serial killers get caught by canny traffic/patrol cops. Not just in the US, either. Peter Sutcliffe was caught by them, too.

It's probably a combination of cop instinct, the driver acting shifty, and something just not being right. A smear of blood or 'burglar kit' or weapon in sight. The driver driving erratically or unsafely.

Some day I'm going to write a list of all the serial killers caught by traffic and patrol cops. There are some very infamous names who didn't get nabbed by rooms of profilers and task forces, they got caught by someone who pulled them over to write them a ticket.

MOO

 

[Izzylizzy]

Possible Victim: Fire Island Jane Doe, UP9098, found Davis Park Apr 1996 & Ocean Parkway Apr 2011 - Karen Vergata

Do they know or are they incompetent? Sadly, it could be either way with them.

www.websleuths.com

Long Island murder victim "Jane Doe No. 7" identified as Karen Vergata, 27 years after she went missing

Karen Vergata had been living in Manhattan before she disappeared around Feb. 14, 1996, officials said.

www.cbsnews.com

Thanks so much for finding the thread/post as it answered the question about the "soft tissue" timeline after death which makes around Feb 14,1996 a possibility.
The plastic that was wrapped around her legs and the cold weather would have slowed down the decomposition process.


"Decomposition can be heavily influenced by an enormous number of variables referred to as taphonomic factors. These factors can speed up or slow down the decomposition process. For example, heat and insect activity will speed up the process, while cold temperatures or wrapping a body in plastic will slow it down. For buried human bodies, the acidity or alkalinity of the soil is also an important factor influencing bone preservation. Other factors such as whether the body was burned (cremated), or deposited in water will also have an impact."

What happens to human bodies after death?

This article provides a brief overview of the decomposition process of human bodies after death

www.futurelearn.com

 

[Megnut]

How many times are you actually stopped by LE? Don't you think that once you've killed a time or two, maybe sweated bullets the first several times you've transported a victim, you become as comfortable with it as driving to the local store?

The few times I've been stopped: Driver's License checkpoint, speeding, temporary tag, LE has never had me pop the trunk. Once in the dark, they had a flashlight and saw my two dogs in the back. He could not see the temporary tag in the back window, then apologized for stopping me. Another, we had a packed station wagon returning from vacation and were stopped in the mountains because of an intense manhunt.

The percentage of trips in which I even came under any scrutiny is so miniscule that someone like RH seeming like a good citizen with his story ready and a locked cover on his truck was safe. From reports, people with tail lights out or some other preventable cause for stop should not be carrying drugs or running stop signs or giving anyone cause to stop and search. But the ordinary citizen? The odds of ever being stopped are almost non-existent.

I think the first few times would be nerve-racking, but after that? No, perhaps just part of the game.

Worth mentioning, some people don't feel fear. I'd wager that, where the average person feels fear, certain people feel thrill. Fear of being pulled over, thrill. All part of the game.

It's hard to fathom but bloodlust is real. What normal person could even IMAGINE doing these things? Fear of getting caught. Empathy. These were real women, with real lives, and that didn't matter to him. Spoils of the hunt.

If we peel away his day job (a means to support his true vocation), peel away his family (props in order to move freely about the community), peel away every day things like paying bills, getting gas, eating (adulting), you're left with the REAL RH. A serial killer. Sadistic. Power bender. The long game.

If he "feared" being caught, it wasn't in the real sense of fear, it wasn't IMO a fear of being held accountable, it was a fear of being STOPPED. He didn't want to stop. As recorded in his discovered notes, he was improving his technique. So he could continue doing what he loved. Sick, sick, sick.

And we've only seen one such list. 350+ devices. How many lists were on paper, long destroyed? How many, in computers, long since over-written?

Those poor women were fish in a barrel to him.

JMO

 

[Izzylizzy]

There is a WS dedicated to her as 9098 Jane Doe. Maybe you find what you need there. When remains were found, in a plastic garbage bag they were able to describe skin, scars in detail, fresh pedicure & polish. At the time, reports were looking for missing persons “missing 2 weeks prior”

Thank you!

 

[Izzylizzy]

There is something to learn about the sawdust. Apparently, it was tiny specks of wood per LE. According to the defense, it was mishandled and not available to be tested to even confirm that it was actually wood. There were also two different LE suspects. (!) One of them had wood chips in his car that were disposed of accidentally to make room for new evidence. (!) One of them had his ex-wife call in that she thought he killed one of the victims that Bittrolff was accused of at the time-now convicted. One of them had his investigation file about his being a suspect in the murder disposed of prematurely. (!)

I don't know which victim a police ex-wife had believed her husband had killed, nor do I know if that has ever been released. I also don't know which cop suspect is which-who had wood chips in his car-who had his investigation file thrown out...

One thing I can "clear" LE of is planting DNA. They collected it decades before they identified it. So, while there is some reason to explore the possibility that Suffolk police made the facts fit Bittrolff, there also is the really suspicious fact that his DNA was, amongst the DNA of other men, found on the victims. And Bittrolff apparently answered an interrogation question about purchasing sex like a true AH. Something like, "I don't have to pay; I get sex when I want it." (Not sure if the average SCPD interviewer would be as judgmental as I am about that answer.) While I dont remember the exact AH words, they made him seem strangely evasive for the seriousness of the charges. I would suggest saying nothing at all without a lawyer, but if the question were answered, I would say this would be a bad time to lie about sex which is contact that clearly leaves a trace, even in the 90's.

But the LE "expert" on the DNA evidence was dicey. They testified that the DNA was left within 1/2 hour of the murder. The public defender did not bring in their own expert, but apparently if they had, they would have said the sex was within 24 hours or slightly more of the murder.

I would love to see the actual testimony at the trial. SC keeps evidence close to their chest. I think it's possible that the similarities among the three murders Bittrolff was accused of are a bit over-stated. I guess that Bittrolff's DNA was not on Sandra. She sounds horrifically overkilled. But she may not have been raped with a p***s.


MOO

Before RH was charged with the murder of Sandra Castillo this was what JB's appeal was all about, info that was never given to the defense.
IIRC: The cop's wife's name,her husbands name and the wood chips cop's name were included.
Not sure if it was 2 cops or one cop,for the murder and wood chips.

"I don't know which victim a police ex-wife had believed her husband had killed, nor do I know if that has ever been released. I also don't know which cop suspect is which-who had wood chips in his car-who had his investigation file thrown out..."

 

[Ruminations]

How many times are you actually stopped by LE? Don't you think that once you've killed a time or two, maybe sweated bullets the first several times you've transported a victim, you become as comfortable with it as driving to the local store?

The few times I've been stopped: Driver's License checkpoint, speeding, temporary tag, LE has never had me pop the trunk. Once in the dark, they had a flashlight and saw my two dogs in the back. He could not see the temporary tag in the back window, then apologized for stopping me. Another, we had a packed station wagon returning from vacation and were stopped in the mountains because of an intense manhunt.

The percentage of trips in which I even came under any scrutiny is so miniscule that someone like RH seeming like a good citizen with his story ready and a locked cover on his truck was safe. From reports, people with tail lights out or some other preventable cause for stop should not be carrying drugs or running stop signs or giving anyone cause to stop and search. But the ordinary citizen? The odds of ever being stopped are almost non-existent.

I think the first few times would be nerve-racking, but after that? No, perhaps just part of the game.

Wow, I turn on all interior lights, open the rear windows partially if there is a dog or two in the back, and all the way if there are only humans or nobody. Of course lower the front windows entirely. Turn off the radio. Counsel any passengers to keep their hands in sight at all times, and tell them I'll do all talking. Tell police my dogs don't bite. Talk calmly. I'm in control, but terrified. I don't want them to interpret anything as my reaching for a gun or anyone else doing so.

I've probably been pulled over about 8 times- ticketed about 3? I'm not a baby anymore but I'm still really scared. I'm also perhaps not likely to go 55 on a clear dry straight highway, unless there are speed cameras, but I'm not reckless, either.

(BTW, speed cameras are not scary, and very effective on me. I came home to a photo album of my car in DC, paid a fine, and never sped there again. Locally, I get away with speeding 99.99999% of the time, and the terrifying possibility of getting pulled over is rarely a deterrent to my speeding along with the traffic. When I have gotten a ticket after the terror, I spend hundreds on a lawyer to avoid thousands in car insurance. My driving record is clean.)

MOO

 

[jessr927]

There is something to learn about the sawdust. Apparently, it was tiny specks of wood per LE. According to the defense, it was mishandled and not available to be tested to even confirm that it was actually wood. There were also two different LE suspects. (!) One of them had wood chips in his car that were disposed of accidentally to make room for new evidence. (!) One of them had his ex-wife call in that she thought he killed one of the victims that Bittrolff was accused of at the time-now convicted. One of them had his investigation file about his being a suspect in the murder disposed of prematurely. (!)

I don't know which victim a police ex-wife had believed her husband had killed, nor do I know if that has ever been released. I also don't know which cop suspect is which-who had wood chips in his car-who had his investigation file thrown out...

One thing I can "clear" LE of is planting DNA. They collected it decades before they identified it. So, while there is some reason to explore the possibility that Suffolk police made the facts fit Bittrolff, there also is the really suspicious fact that his DNA was, amongst the DNA of other men, found on the victims. And Bittrolff apparently answered an interrogation question about purchasing sex like a true AH. Something like, "I don't have to pay; I get sex when I want it." (Not sure if the average SCPD interviewer would be as judgmental as I am about that answer.) While I dont remember the exact AH words, they made him seem strangely evasive for the seriousness of the charges. I would suggest saying nothing at all without a lawyer, but if the question were answered, I would say this would be a bad time to lie about sex which is contact that clearly leaves a trace, even in the 90's.

But the LE "expert" on the DNA evidence was dicey. They testified that the DNA was left within 1/2 hour of the murder. The public defender did not bring in their own expert, but apparently if they had, they would have said the sex was within 24 hours or slightly more of the murder.

I would love to see the actual testimony at the trial. SC keeps evidence close to their chest. I think it's possible that the similarities among the three murders Bittrolff was accused of are a bit over-stated. I guess that Bittrolff's DNA was not on Sandra. She sounds horrifically overkilled. But she may not have been raped with a p***s.


MOO

Officer, later Sgt, Mike Murphy had the wood chips in his police car that then disappeared. Officer Teddy Hart had the wife who suspected he was involved in the murder of either Rita or Colleen.

 

[jessr927]

Includes info on the wood chips re: Murphy

Trial begins for Manorville man accused in cold case killings - Riverhead News Review

John Bittrolff was arrested in 2014 and charged with two counts of second-degree murder in connection with the deaths of Rita Tangredi and Colleen McNamee.

riverheadnewsreview.timesreview.com

 

[jessr927]

Unfortunately I'm not a Newsday subscriber but part of the info on Teddy Hart can be seen here:

Two-time killer John Bittrolff, of Manorville, seeking new trial, court papers show

John Bittrolff is alleging prosecutors withheld an Internal Affairs Bureau file he argues would have aided his defense.

www.newsday.com

 

[snooptroop88]

On Karen Vergata's remains, I believe that's February and the cold water preserved the remains. Did RH actually go up to Fire Island or did the remains drift there? That's what I'm wondering. There was a fierce, fierce blizzard in NY that year, but it was in January. But Fire Island is supposed to be unbearably cold during the winter months. When the waters freeze over, they can't even operate the ferries. All these people that live there on Fire Island year-round stock up on supplies like "Life Below Zero." But I looked up NY weather for Feb and it doesn't at all look especially bad for that week in Feb 1996. (But it's usually worse on Fire Island, which is so open to the elements.) Mobility on the island for those who'd drive in is very, very limited. Still, I believe this is open and as far as I can see, accessible by vehicle:

Otis Pike Fire Island High Dune Wilderness​

Fire Island Wilderness - Fire Island National Seashore (U.S. National Park Service)

www.nps.gov

Wilderness Visitor Center - Fire Island National Seashore (U.S. National Park Service)

Wilderness Visitor Center

www.nps.gov

Fire Island: Otis Pike Wilderness

Fire Island: Otis Pike Wilderness is an out-and-back trail that provides a good opportunity to view wildlife located near Mastic Beach, New York.

www.theoutbound.com

Who'd be out there in February other than an SK?? Maybe a few adventurers. Depending on how he concealed remains, would anyone even catch on?

This trail for the Otis Pike Wilderness is very near to Mastic Beach, where John Bittrolff grew up. He went to William Floyd High School, Mastic Beach. I'm really, really starting to think it perhaps wasn't just RH. Not sure on anything at this point, but finding this pretty interesting.

Manorville Man Arrested for ’90s Murders Suspected in 3rd Cold Case

John Bittrolff was charged with the murders of Rita Tangredi-Beinlich and Colleen McNamee.

www.longislandpress.com