2/22/09 Neighbor heard yelling @ 2:25AM with link.

[krkrjx]

#3-is there a source for this? We have links to 2:25 and 3:00 but I don't see a reference to 2:15ish. I'm not saying it didn't happen, I just can't recall it.

#4-In the video report Peliman posted the reporter says the neighbor told her the loud voices came from in or around the 202 Green Lane home.

#8-The one and only police report the public has seen (I wonder to this day how that slipped out!) states the officer arrived at 202 Green Lane at 3:40 and TN arrived shortly after that.

http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/news/state/missing_haleigh_police_report_021609

Did J. Greenwood say if the 2:13 call was to the non-emergency line or 911?
I will have to dig it up and listen again, I can't recall. I am not sure how the non-emergency calls are handled by LE.

I have been skeptical about the 2:13 call but after I read #3 I can now see how it is possible it is related to this case. I was skeptical because I didn't realize there was a scream heard around 2:15.

Thanks twall!

As for exact times, when someone is awakened or otherwise disturbed when not expecting a commotion they sometimes do not know the exact time things happened. I had read one report about Misty being outside crying talking on the phone at around 2:30 AM, and another said 3:00. Both reports were attributed to the same neighbor; I used 3:00 AM because that is the one we currently have a link for. But it really would be nice to get an accurate time on that incident.

As for the woman scream, I saw one reference to shortly after 2 AM, another for around 2:15 AM and another that said around 2:25 AM. I have not located anything regarding the scream yet; a lot of these things that were available once seem to not be now for some reason.

Regarding the neighbor on the other side of the MH, she said she was not home that night (was out of town for a several-day stretch).

Since this case hinges on a reasonably accurate timeline, it would be nice if we could verify some of these things and determine which time is the most accurate for each event. But, I believe this is the exact problem LE has had from the beginning...trying to figure out who was where, when...and what was going on at crucial times.

It seems there was some commotion at the MH starting perhaps as early as 1:30 AM and continuing through the neighbor hearing Misty out in the yard at either 2:30 or 3:00 AM.

Sorry to add to further confusion but I still have to wonder if Misty was there at all prior to around 2-ish the morning of Feb. 10. A lot of what was reported being heard by neighbors goes along with her not being there til then...the problem with it is if it is true why has she not admitted to not being there that night? I fully understand why she didn't admit to it back then, but why not now given her current situation??

 

[krkrjx]

If we can get some accurate times for events of the night, or even accurate detailed descriptions of those events, we might then try to work back toward earlier in the evening and even earlier in the day of February 9.

I would like to see the phone records, if there are any.

I would like to see RC's check-ins and check-outs for that entire work shift the evening/night/early morning verified by a reliable source...such as an actual document or time sheet or time clock punch card.

I would like to know what odd things were seen or heard in other areas that evening/night/early morning. Magnolia Lane area, Shell Harbor area.

I do not believe the Shell Harbor story one bit but that is not saying something might not have gone down there...a party, perhaps. Or even the Mondex area could have been a party place.

People in that town saw and heard things, of that I have no doubt. Some may be afraid to come forward, some may distrust LE enough to never speak with them unless forced to, some may have pertinent info they do not even know is pertinent. But I believe there is valuable information to be had for the asking in the Hermits Cove area of Satsuma, and maybe well beyond. This child did not just vanish into thin air. Someone knows. Someone other than our players.

 

[lonetraveler]

OK...it seems we have somewhat of a sequence of events prior to LE arriving in response to Misty's 911 call to report Haleigh missing:

1. Between 1:30-2:00 AM a loud vehicle was in the area per a neighbor.

2. At 2:13 AM a call was placed to LE (non-emergency?); it has not been ascertained whether this call had anything to do with goings-on surrounding Haleigh's disappearance and it is unknown who placed the call.

3. Approx. 2:15 AM someone in the area heard a woman scream. (This actually could have been a few minutes earlier and could have precipitated the 2:13 call to LE.)

4. Approx. 2:25 AM loud voices were heard by a neighbor. IIRC, neighbor did not say if they knew where the voices came from.

5. Approx. 3:00 AM, a neighbor heard Misty out in the yard crying and talking on the phone.

6. At 3:24 AM Ron arrived home.

7. At 3: 27 AM Misty placed the 911 call to report Haleigh missing.

8. Approx. 3:30 AM, TN arrived at the MH in response to a call from Ron. (This is the time TN said she arrived; it is unclear if this is an accurate time. If it is accurate, TN arrived prior to LE.)

Please add anything I missed, or fix anything I have listed incorrectly.

Great summary! Chelsea and Timmy claim to have heard for the very first time about Haleigh at around 4:00 am. It would be interesting to find out if calls were made prior to this time.

 

[lonetraveler]

If we can get some accurate times for events of the night, or even accurate detailed descriptions of those events, we might then try to work back toward earlier in the evening and even earlier in the day of February 9.

I would like to see the phone records, if there are any.

I would like to see RC's check-ins and check-outs for that entire work shift the evening/night/early morning verified by a reliable source...such as an actual document or time sheet or time clock punch card.

I would like to know what odd things were seen or heard in other areas that evening/night/early morning. Magnolia Lane area, Shell Harbor area.

I do not believe the Shell Harbor story one bit but that is not saying something might not have gone down there...a party, perhaps. Or even the Mondex area could have been a party place.

People in that town saw and heard things, of that I have no doubt. Some may be afraid to come forward, some may distrust LE enough to never speak with them unless forced to, some may have pertinent info they do not even know is pertinent. But I believe there is valuable information to be had for the asking in the Hermits Cove area of Satsuma. This child did not just vanish into thin air. Someone knows. Someone other than our players.

Has there been a time established for the sighting of a red truck near the rail tracks? Also, I don't know where to find it, but Annette Sykes made a comment that she received a call from Ron in the pre-dawn hours but did not answer it, then later she said that when she received the second call, she answered it. Does anyone know where this information can be found?

 

[lonetraveler]

You know, I have noticed that a lot of things are disappearing from the web. Esp the CBS47? videos that had most of the interviews early on. Even the links to their articles have disappeared. I found that very odd last fall and now wonder if maybe LE asked them to take the videos/articles off their site.
I to thought there was two people that heard noises that night, but was never able to retrieve the video report from CBS47 news?

I can back you up on that thought. What use to be easily found is now nowhere to be found.

 

[B4igo2it]

heard noises

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDUDIsp9xQM

 

[Emeralgem]

If we can get some accurate times for events of the night, or even accurate detailed descriptions of those events, we might then try to work back toward earlier in the evening and even earlier in the day of February 9.

I would like to see the phone records, if there are any.

I would like to see RC's check-ins and check-outs for that entire work shift the evening/night/early morning verified by a reliable source...such as an actual document or time sheet or time clock punch card.

I would like to know what odd things were seen or heard in other areas that evening/night/early morning. Magnolia Lane area, Shell Harbor area.

I do not believe the Shell Harbor story one bit but that is not saying something might not have gone down there...a party, perhaps. Or even the Mondex area could have been a party place.

People in that town saw and heard things, of that I have no doubt. Some may be afraid to come forward, some may distrust LE enough to never speak with them unless forced to, some may have pertinent info they do not even know is pertinent. But I believe there is valuable information to be had for the asking in the Hermits Cove area of Satsuma, and maybe well beyond. This child did not just vanish into thin air. Someone knows. Someone other than our players.

I can't discount the Shell Harbor area since a witness did claim Haleigh got in that van and the driver drove off in the opposite direction of the MH...He stated it was Misty, however there has been some speculation the person driving at that time could have been Chelsey..
And since it has also been stated Ron C went looking for that van I can't discount he didn't meet up with the van and the location could have been on Magnolia or in the Shell Harbor area...JMHO..

Like you, I think all of us would love to see the phone records, time cards from PDM but thus far we have received nothing from LE... JMHO

 

[dodie20]

Thanks twall!

As for exact times, when someone is awakened or otherwise disturbed when not expecting a commotion they sometimes do not know the exact time things happened. I had read one report about Misty being outside crying talking on the phone at around 2:30 AM, and another said 3:00. Both reports were attributed to the same neighbor; I used 3:00 AM because that is the one we currently have a link for. But it really would be nice to get an accurate time on that incident.

As for the woman scream, I saw one reference to shortly after 2 AM, another for around 2:15 AM and another that said around 2:25 AM. I have not located anything regarding the scream yet; a lot of these things that were available once seem to not be now for some reason.

Regarding the neighbor on the other side of the MH, she said she was not home that night (was out of town for a several-day stretch).

Since this case hinges on a reasonably accurate timeline, it would be nice if we could verify some of these things and determine which time is the most accurate for each event. But, I believe this is the exact problem LE has had from the beginning...trying to figure out who was where, when...and what was going on at crucial times.

It seems there was some commotion at the MH starting perhaps as early as 1:30 AM and continuing through the neighbor hearing Misty out in the yard at either 2:30 or 3:00 AM.

Sorry to add to further confusion but I still have to wonder if Misty was there at all prior to around 2-ish the morning of Feb. 10. A lot of what was reported being heard by neighbors goes along with her not being there til then...the problem with it is if it is true why has she not admitted to not being there that night? I fully understand why she didn't admit to it back then, but why not now given her current situation??

you're right. It seems that this part of the timeline, points to Misty not being home. But why not admit it? but now she IS instead, backing up the Joe stories...which don't fit this timeline. Where are the neighbors who heard Haleigh's screams, Joe's yelling, the slamming doors? Misty's version of events went from being asleep, to witnessing Joe take Haleigh. There's not much difference between being asleep & gone, (in some people's eyes), so I could understand the initial lie, but not all of this. She's either telling a truth, or repeating what Tommy has told her. Maybe he told her that's what happened while she was gone, but he needs her to back him up, so she went along with it. I would think Jr could at least verify hiding under the covers with Misty. Legally speaking, there's just no need for all of these lies, unless Tommy & Misty are the equal perps...& I honestly can't see that. & the only way I can see Ron responsible, is if neither Misty nor Tommy knows what happened, assumed the other was responsible, & have been covering for each other. But why blame Joe & the gun theft?

 

[seeking truth]

OK...it seems we have somewhat of a sequence of events prior to LE arriving in response to Misty's 911 call to report Haleigh missing:

1. Between 1:30-2:00 AM a loud vehicle was in the area per a neighbor.

2. At 2:13 AM a call was placed to LE (non-emergency?); it has not been ascertained whether this call had anything to do with goings-on surrounding Haleigh's disappearance and it is unknown who placed the call.

3. Approx. 2:15 AM someone in the area heard a woman scream. (This actually could have been a few minutes earlier and could have precipitated the 2:13 call to LE.)

4. Approx. 2:25 AM loud voices were heard by a neighbor. IIRC, neighbor did not say if they knew where the voices came from.

5. Approx. 3:00 AM, a neighbor heard Misty out in the yard crying and talking on the phone.

6. At 3:24 AM Ron arrived home.

7. At 3: 27 AM Misty placed the 911 call to report Haleigh missing.

8. Approx. 3:30 AM, TN arrived at the MH in response to a call from Ron. (This is the time TN said she arrived; it is unclear if this is an accurate time. If it is accurate, TN arrived prior to LE.)

Please add anything I missed, or fix anything I have listed incorrectly.

Thanks for this, krkrjx.

Has anyone, such as LE, confirmed that Ron arrived home shortly before the 911 call?

I mean, other than Ron and his band of supporters.

We also have no idea if this was the first time he came home that night and/or early am. For that matter, we don't know when he actually left for work that afternoon, or evening, of February 9, 2010.

I hope that investigators know the answers.

 

[Emeralgem]

Thanks for this, krkrjx.

Has anyone, such as LE, confirmed that Ron arrived home shortly before the 911 call?

I mean, other than Ron and his band of supporters.

We also have no idea if this was the first time he came home that night and/or early am. For that matter, we don't know when he actually left for work that afternoon, or evening, of February 9, 2010.

I hope that investigators know the answers.

IIRC.. Shoemaker stated he arrived early that afternoon,he made it to work in about 19 minutes....
But I suspect he arrived and was seen by someone sometime between 7:00 pm and 8:00 pm since GGMS stated she arrived at the MH sometime between 7:00 and 8:00 pm and saw an alive Haleigh eating dinner on a cold screened in porch..No doubt in my mind her claiming to see Haleigh was to provide and alibi for her grandson...JMHO

 

[dodie20]

IIRC.. Shoemaker stated he arrived early that afternoon,he made it to work in about 19 minutes....
But I suspect he arrived and was seen by someone sometime between 7:00 pm and 8:00 pm since GGMS stated she arrived at the MH sometime between 7:00 and 8:00 pm and saw an alive Haleigh eating dinner on a cold screened in porch..No doubt in my mind her claiming to see Haleigh was to provide and alibi for her grandson...JMHO

I think so too. If the rumor was going around that Ron sometimes, took his kids to work, she may have felt the need to squash that. in other words, put Ron at work, & the kids at the house. I also remember Misty, (through the road rage guy, I think), saying that she would never leave the kids alone, so I'm wondering how that rumor got started. Did the neighbos really say it, (is there a link?), or did the Cumming's start it to make Misty look like the bad one? I don't have a problem seeing Misty doing that, but would like some verification. But my thinking doesn't make much sense. Either Misty was home with the kids, or she was gone with the kids, or she left somebody else in charge. or what if Ron took the kids to work, that night? left when Misty got home, dropped the kids off...would that mean anything to the case?

 

[B4igo2it]

U may want to add the surveilance (spelling?) video from convenience store time to timeline (bought peanuts & Cigarettes)

 

[kant]

I dont know if the neighbor would necessarily know all the comings and goings to the residence or would have reason to even notice or recall, but I do think a neighbor would hear a scream and recall a scream and even glance at the clock at the time of a scream. It's human nature and almost a reflex, imo.

But as far as neighbors noticing, recalling things.. IDK about Sykes. That bit about Sykes stopping by is such a raging crock imo. OK, granted, Misty is not Einstein, but I do think she is capable of recalling (and had no reason to lie at that point imo) who, in its entirety, was in the freakin home on the day of or the day after Haleigh, "went missing." She clearly stated it was only the AC guy, her brother, and his kids. Again, she's not a genius, but even she - substance addled as she may or may not have been - could likely accurately recall a short list of 3 adults (if you included Sykes) and a couple of kids as having been visitors to the residence on Mon the 9th - IF SYKES WERE ACTUALLY A VISITOR - especially since she was asked on the 10th - not days, weeks, months later. And if Great grandma is lying about being there (which imo is a huge thing about which to lie)... why? and for whom?

Yeah..... that.

moo

 

[Nonni Brenda]

Hey Twall, at first I was skeptical too. But considering other things that were going on that time in the morning near Green Ln, you can't help but to think that Lt. Greenwood was correct when he mentioned the first call coming in at 2:13am. I don't know if I remember hearing about screams at 2:15am but with the screams being heard around 2:25, is only 10-15 mins from the time the call was placed. IMO, there is definitely something going on around 2am.

I know Whisp mentioned looking at that video again of Lt. Greenwood, and I agree. At first I thought that maybe Lt. Greenwood was incorrect about the time.....but what if he wasn't? Lt. Greenwood also mentioned that TN was the one there that evening....at first I assumed he was wrong because GMSykes came out and said that SHE was the one there with laundry. TN only said that she sent a family member over there. But what if he's telling the truth about that as well? For me, I discredited that information ONLY because we had GMSykes saying that she was there. So it seems I have been believing the Cummings over LE:waitasec: I hadn't realized that before. At times I felt that GMSykes was lying about being there at all.....maybe she was lying. Or maybe GMSykes was there with TN and not the "aunt". Maybe that's the part that's a LIE-WHO GMSykes was with that evening. At times I felt that maybe Teresa was at the mh with those kids......maybe she was. IMHO, if Lt. Greenwood was telling the truth about TN being there that evening, that would explain alot to me regarding her behavior. It would explain the babysitting call between TN and Misty, how TN showed up so fast to the mh, why TN felt the need to try and control the whole situation, why TN stood behind Misty the way she did, plus a lot more.

My point is, if Lt. Greenwood was telling the truth about the 2:13am call, then we need to take a closer look at everything else he said in that interview. JMO though

S1, you are making some really good points. New theory: TN was babysitting. Haleigh got into drugs or some other accident that was caused by something illegal of Ron's. This is when the Cummins began to set up the Croslins, RC calling Tommy; then when MC came home from her partying, discovered Haleigh gone, she started freaking out, screaming, calling RC. This accident could have happened around 7pm, and the coverup began by GGMS saying she was there (not TN). Meanwhile the croslins had done the necessary cleanup already. I don't know but....

 

[krkrjx]

(snipped)

Again, she's not a genius, but even she - substance addled as she may or may not have been - could likely accurately recall a short list of 3 adults (if you included Sykes) and a couple of kids as having been visitors to the residence on Mon the 9th - IF SYKES WERE ACTUALLY A VISITOR - especially since she was asked on the 10th - not days, weeks, months later. And if Great grandma is lying about being there (which imo is a huge thing about which to lie)... why? and for whom?

Yeah..... that.

moo

I do not think Sykes was there that evening. I do not believe the kids were on the porch eating, at that hour in February. And possibly without shirts on!

I think too much info was given about that visit. Had Sykes simply said she stopped by to check on the kids, or stopped by with laundry, and left it at that...maybe I would buy it. But Sykes supplied unnecessary detail, and not believable details at that, IMO. Plus, the mention comes too late, IMO. If it were true, why not say it right away instead of waiting nine days to mention it?

And I agree that Misty would not have left out that Sykes had stopped by. She never mentioned it until after Sykes had made the claim.

Also, I have been giving some more thought to the woman screaming. Maybe it wasn't a scream of terror but a shrieky, excited or angry voice. Maybe it was heard by two people, and one described it as a woman screaming, but we don't know the context so maybe they reported not a woman screaming in terror, but a woman screaming at someone. Another neighbor could have heard it also but described it not as a scream but as a loud voice.

JMO.

 

[lonetraveler]

I do not think Sykes was there that evening. I do not believe the kids were on the porch eating, at that hour in February. And possibly without shirts on!

I think too much info was given about that visit. Had Sykes simply said she stopped by to check on the kids, or stopped by with laundry, and left it at that...maybe I would buy it. But Sykes supplied unnecessary detail, and not believable details at that, IMO. Plus, the mention comes too late, IMO. If it were true, why not say it right away instead of waiting nine days to mention it?

And I agree that Misty would not have left out that Sykes had stopped by. She never mentioned it until after Sykes had made the claim.

Also, I have been giving some more thought to the woman screaming. Maybe it wasn't a scream of terror but a shrieky, excited or angry voice. Maybe it was heard by two people, and one described it as a woman screaming, but we don't know the context so maybe they reported not a woman screaming in terror, but a woman screaming at someone. Another neighbor could have heard it also but described it not as a scream but as a loud voice.

JMO.

I grew up in a very rural area in the south and if any of my family or neighbors said that they heard a woman screaming, it would mean just that, screaming in pain, screaming in terror but screaming...........now, if my family and/or neighbors heard a woman very loud as in angry, it would be stated that the woman was yelling at someone, not screaming. Am I making any sense here? I'm just trying to say that people yell when they are shouting at someone in anger and they scream when they are horrified, terrorized or very scared.............KWIM?

 

[lonetraveler]

I dont know if the neighbor would necessarily know all the comings and goings to the residence or would have reason to even notice or recall, but I do think a neighbor would hear a scream and recall a scream and even glance at the clock at the time of a scream. It's human nature and almost a reflex, imo.

But as far as neighbors noticing, recalling things.. IDK about Sykes. That bit about Sykes stopping by is such a raging crock imo. OK, granted, Misty is not Einstein, but I do think she is capable of recalling (and had no reason to lie at that point imo) who, in its entirety, was in the freakin home on the day of or the day after Haleigh, "went missing." She clearly stated it was only the AC guy, her brother, and his kids. Again, she's not a genius, but even she - substance addled as she may or may not have been - could likely accurately recall a short list of 3 adults (if you included Sykes) and a couple of kids as having been visitors to the residence on Mon the 9th - IF SYKES WERE ACTUALLY A VISITOR - especially since she was asked on the 10th - not days, weeks, months later. And if Great grandma is lying about being there (which imo is a huge thing about which to lie)... why? and for whom?

Yeah..... that.

moo

Hi Kant! My take on the AC man is that Misty was at Tommy's house which is near Ron's house. The AC man probably could not find anyone home so he called the phone number that he had and got Misty on the phone and got her to go over to the Mh so that he could service the AC. Tommy walked over with Misty along with his children and they just stayed around, smoked a joint and chatted while the AC man was there. Ron called Misty while the man was there and Misty told him that she was at the Mh because the AC man wanted to service the AC and she handed the phone over to the AC man to prove to Ron why she was at the Mh. I honestly believe that the neighbors saw Tommy's children playing that early evening. I think Tommy and Misty left and went back to Tommy's house after the AC man left. I don't think that Misty babysat Haleigh and Jr. I think Teresa either had them that evening or Ron had them in his vehicle at work until Teresa came and got them later. I think Misty was summoned to the MH early the morning of the 10th and when she arrived she found out about Haleigh at that time and it is her screaming that the neighbor heard. I think she was told that Haleigh had died, I don't think that she discovered a dead Haleigh. Misty is so calm on the 911 call it is as if she is in shock or heavily medicated.

 

[justus4all]

Hi Kant! My take on the AC man is that Misty was at Tommy's house which is near Ron's house. The AC man probably could not find anyone home so he called the phone number that he had and got Misty on the phone and got her to go over to the Mh so that he could service the AC. Tommy walked over with Misty along with his children and they just stayed around, smoked a joint and chatted while the AC man was there. Ron called Misty while the man was there and Misty told him that she was at the Mh because the AC man wanted to service the AC and she handed the phone over to the AC man to prove to Ron why she was at the Mh. I honestly believe that the neighbors saw Tommy's children playing that early evening. I think Tommy and Misty left and went back to Tommy's house after the AC man left. I don't think that Misty babysat Haleigh and Jr. I think Teresa either had them that evening or Ron had them in his vehicle at work until Teresa came and got them later. I think Misty was summoned to the MH early the morning of the 10th and when she arrived she found out about Haleigh at that time and it is her screaming that the neighbor heard. I think she was told that Haleigh had died, I don't think that she discovered a dead Haleigh. Misty is so calm on the 911 call it is as if she is in shock or heavily medicated.

bolded by me....Yes....very possible.....One question, if this has been answered, I apologize,

How did Misty get IN.....IF Ron locked the MH when he left for work..
Or......Was the A/C man only servicing the unit....on the OUTSIDE...and Misty did not have to enter the MH...Her and Tommy never went inside...??Did Misty have a key???....Did Misty and Tommy go INSIDE Ron's???

 

[Nonni Brenda]

Good point!

Since it appears nothing is going to happen until Ron and Misty are sentenced, I hope LE are reading here to pick up on things they may have initially missed. Tommy and Joe wouldn't have known either - were those two left at the home while Misty was out doing something and when she returned, found whatever, went outside crying and called the people her phone records show.

IMO, if we had those phone records of Misty, RC, TN, Tommy, we could have already had this case solved. But... why does LE not have it solved after a yr and a half? I really don't get it!

 

[Nonni Brenda]

Hi Kant! My take on the AC man is that Misty was at Tommy's house which is near Ron's house. The AC man probably could not find anyone home so he called the phone number that he had and got Misty on the phone and got her to go over to the Mh so that he could service the AC. Tommy walked over with Misty along with his children and they just stayed around, smoked a joint and chatted while the AC man was there. Ron called Misty while the man was there and Misty told him that she was at the Mh because the AC man wanted to service the AC and she handed the phone over to the AC man to prove to Ron why she was at the Mh. I honestly believe that the neighbors saw Tommy's children playing that early evening. I think Tommy and Misty left and went back to Tommy's house after the AC man left. I don't think that Misty babysat Haleigh and Jr. I think Teresa either had them that evening or Ron had them in his vehicle at work until Teresa came and got them later. I think Misty was summoned to the MH early the morning of the 10th and when she arrived she found out about Haleigh at that time and it is her screaming that the neighbor heard. I think she was told that Haleigh had died, I don't think that she discovered a dead Haleigh. Misty is so calm on the 911 call it is as if she is in shock or heavily medicated.

Good theory LT. One question, if Haleigh and Jr were with Theresa, then who summoned Misty home, and who told Misty that Heleigh was dead? Are you saying that TN was with Haleigh when she died? I think Misty was sacred, not of someone, but that she would say the wrong thing. If Theresa was there when Haleigh died, that would mean she isn't covering for RC, but for herself. that could be why she denies being at the trailer earlier, and pretended to just get there around 330am:waitasec:
:waitasec: