2011.06.13 Sidebar (Trial Day Seventeen)

[BigFatMommyDog]

OMGoodness I never even thought about that...If Caylee had drowned her hair and face would have been wet and the tape would not have adhered. That tape was put on while that baby was dry and alive!

ahem, I actually tried this out myself, and the duct tape didn't stick.

 

[gngr~snap]

I've been sleuthing flights arriving on todays schedule @ the airport....any of the potential witnesses that have been mentioned coming from the cities I listed in my previous post #552?

Atlanta is a good bet from anywhere! As a destination for a connecting flight. I doubt the state would pay for a direct flight. Too expensive!
MOO

 

[Woe.be.gone]

mock jurors beware ~

Collected at the remains site on December 20, 2008, was the following item by OCSF, their written page 3752 (our official docs. post 104 dtd. 2-18-09):

Q200 - Plastic hair clip (Cream colored, heart design) (J-60055 Item #1)

http://www.wftv.com/_blank/18740657/detail.html

----------------------------------------
Considering the small size of the heart shape that was observed, I've often wondered if it could have been cause by an indentation on the tape
that was made by the hair clip while still in Caylee's hair. :waitasec:

 

[Phoebeb]

I agree with you, but wouldn't it be cool if the SA had actual evidence of her purchasing the product, finding it in the home, receipts? Nothing, nada, zip.

The amount in the trunk is huge for me, but I'm sure the DT will bring this up "so she searched for chloroform, prove to me she purchased any ingredients, or made it". The air sampling collection was confusing to me, as one witness said it wasn't that abnormal, and another said it was extremely high. I was kinda tired that day - so forgive me if I'm not remembering correctly.

Like in the peterson case, they at least found the cement he used to toss his wife and son into the ocean (receipt too if I'm not mistaken).

Just my opinion - thanks.

Mel

I think the jury will find it "curious" that ICA did an internet search -84 times- on chloroform and then that same substance was in one way or another linked to the car trunk.
Even if they did not grasp all of the technical analysis by D Vass, there has to be some head scratching for the jury as to why it's on the computer AND at least one (very credible IMO) witness was shocked by those levels found in the trunk.

 

[cmsg2002]

BBM : I totally agree ! Especially after seeing the "signaling" gestures made by CA to what look like it was towards the DT ! :cow::cow::cow:

NOTHING -- "ABSOLUTELY" NOTHING would surprise me now from the A's ...

It is quite obvious that the A's are on BOTH SIDES OF THE FENCE ... :cow:

I must have missed this.....did this happen during trial testimony? what type of signals??

 

[Kat]

She was. She also qualified it by saying in HER jurisdiction, she can say that 100% of accidental drownings involving children are reported - 911 was called 100% of the time. Even if the body is stiff, she said that 911 was called.

Yup. I rewatched her testimony this weekend. She ( and her staff) went back and verified before making that statement. The statistics show that in her jurisdiction, in the case of accidental drownings of children that 911 had been called 100% of the time.

Even if the body was stiff, the call is made.

 

[Celt1997]

I think the duct tape situation is far too ambiguous, and I think the Huck ruling is comparing apples to oranges.

In this case we know the story featured a kidnapping story (whether it was true, or not). It is very possible, given the story ICA told, that the duct tape was nothing more than a way to make this look like a kidnapping. I think it folly to say 100% that there is no reason to place the duct tape post-mortem, when there is one reason (the kidnapping story) that is plain as day. Supporting that further would be the possibility of smaller hairs showing the wrists to be possibly bound, as well...again supporting a kidnap scenario.

The SA needs to decide, was it chloroform, or was it the tape? I'm hoping tomorrow is the final piece of the puzzle, but, right now, I just can't see how people can say the duct tape is issue is so black and white.

 

[countzero]

He did have DNA testing done correct?

No need, unless there is a Star in the East, Mark stated he did NOT have sex with ICA.

imo, ICA was stringing Mark along, just as she did the other guys. Kinda/sorta like hedging her bets or boys to be exact.

 

[MissJames]

I do believe that the duct tape was placed BEFORE death. I am just not sure that Casey didn't do it thinking that Caylee was already dead--mistakenly. I do agree, either way, that this is first degree murder. I am just trying to alleviate my naive mindset somehow, I guess --I still have trouble believing in was intentional...and this little theory could/would explain how it was an "accident" and then the duct tape was put there.

The point is,it's not reasonable to assume someone would do it after death ,which would include if they THINK the person is dead.

According to the Florida Supreme Court ,anyway. I just posted the ruling .

 

[JenniferTx]

I thought the only evidence of that fight was LA's statement to JG? The neighbor testified to hearing fights between CA and ICA were prior to Caylee's disapearance. We do know that on the stand CA stated that she had gone to BofA and was looking for ICA to discuss this with her in person.........

I am not sure why the SA hasn't pursued this argument between CA and ICA, but I imagine they have their reasons.

Yep, they are done for the day.

 

[Oakley]

mock jurors beware ~

Collected at the remains site on December 20, 2008, was the following item by OCSF, their written page 3752 (our official docs. post 104 dtd. 2-18-09):

Q200 - Plastic hair clip (Cream colored, heart design) (J-60055 Item #1)

http://www.wftv.com/_blank/18740657/detail.html

----------------------------------------
Considering the small size of the heart shape that was observed, I've often wondered if it could have been cause by an indentation on the tape
that was made by the hair clip while still in Caylee's hair. :waitasec:

BBM How then would you explain the adhesive backing that was found on the duct tape? Plastic hair clips don't have any adhesive :waitasec:

 

[joypath]

question?

wasn't there some sort of dead bug that was attracted by decomposition fluid found on paper towels in the trunk?

if true

I don't get that the banded hair matters much.

isn't the fluid traceable to Caylee? dna? No?

:twocents: Just addressing this point: To determine DNA, one must have nucleated cells of the individual present within the sample. DNA is a protein complex which can be denatured ("messed up", scrambled, broken down, destroyed) by a variety of acids or bases (chemicals within the world...like vinegar, bleach, lye, etc) and decompositional fluid of a decomposing human body is frequently void of celluar material AND is usually highly acidic in the beginning and may become less acidic as time and environment interacts with it.

Oh yeah, as Mr. Jose Baez has frequently stated (probably because this is the only scientific fact LKB or DCS "taught" him) DNA is NOT present in the red blood cells (erythrocytes) that are circulating in the healthy human.

Short answer....NO DNA present in the decompositional fluid.

 

[2door73chevy]

I wish someone would do a new thread with a poll on what WS thinks ICA will be convicted of DP, LWOP and etc. TIA

I know we have an old thread but now that we've seen most of the trial, I'd like to see what everyone thinks.

 

[Oakley]

Well gonna go get some lunch and then get some work done before tomorrow afternoon. Good night all!

 

[MissJames]

I think the duct tape situation is far too ambiguous, and I think the Huck ruling is comparing apples to oranges.

In this case we know the story featured a kidnapping story (whether it was true, or not). It is very possible, given the story ICA told, that the duct tape was nothing more than a way to make this look like a kidnapping. I think it folly to say 100% that there is no reason to place the duct tape post-mortem, when there is one reason (the kidnapping story) that is plain as day. Supporting that further would be the possibility of smaller hairs showing the wrists to be possibly bound, as well...again supporting a kidnap scenario.

The SA needs to decide, was it chloroform, or was it the tape? I'm hoping tomorrow is the final piece of the puzzle, but, right now, I just can't see how people can say the duct tape is issue is so black and white.

No,actually they don't . There are many convictions with decomposed bodies and even when NO BODY is found. They don't have to have show COD .
After Caylee was dead ,during those 31 days ,ICA was saying Caylee was having a great time with the nanny.They were at every fun spot in FL.
It wsn't until the 31st day she came up with the Nanny took her. The duct tape was already on Caylee at that point.

 

[beach]

Cities departed from and arriving Orlando from 11:30 am – 12:05 pm on 6/13/11 include: Milwaukee, Baltimore, Atlanta, Nassau, Akron-Canton, Dallas-Ft. Worth, Kansas City, Nashville, Birmingham, Chicago-MDW, Panama City FL, Boston, Montreal, St. Louis, Cleveland, Hartford.....

there were pending flights that are not included in the above list....ones that were listed "on time"

Where is Jesse Grund from now days?

I would be surprised if they didn't tie up some things with the Grunds. :dunno:

 

[Amil]

Many flights to FL come through Atlanta and from the West through Dallas -could it really be Mark H.? May show her intent to leave the state!!

 

[Leila]

During jury selection does anyone remember the PJ that was excused because they were on the witness list? Was it the Defense list or the Prosecution? Anyone recall?

The potential juror was on the witness list for the defense. She was a woman who got into an altercation with GA - one of the protestors who gathered in front of the Anthony house. She has since been dropped from the witness list.

 

[camcneishg]

I think the duct tape situation is far too ambiguous, and I think the Huck ruling is comparing apples to oranges.

In this case we know the story featured a kidnapping story (whether it was true, or not). It is very possible, given the story ICA told, that the duct tape was nothing more than a way to make this look like a kidnapping. I think it folly to say 100% that there is no reason to place the duct tape post-mortem, when there is one reason (the kidnapping story) that is plain as day. Supporting that further would be the possibility of smaller hairs showing the wrists to be possibly bound, as well...again supporting a kidnap scenario.

The SA needs to decide, was it chloroform, or was it the tape? I'm hoping tomorrow is the final piece of the puzzle, but, right now, I just can't see how people can say the duct tape is issue is so black and white.

If Caylee had drowned in the swimming pool, as DT suggests...she would be WET! Duct tape will not stick to WET....duct tape was put on Caylee while she was DRY....Duct tape was put on Caylee prior to the drowning therory....thus debunking that therory.....
MO

 

[kantoo]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...ny-trial-day-17-20110613,0,3330563,full.story

In addition, the defense filed a motion for the court to issue a certificate to compel out-of-state witnesses Vass, Wise and another Oak Ridge National Lab PhD., Madhavi Martin.

So the DT is bringing Vass back to testify......and i guess the others to testify to all the "super secrets" of the data base/protocol?