2011.06.30 Sidebar Thread (Trial Day Thirty-Two)

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Looks like the bird flipper will be spending his 29th birthday in jail. Too bad so sad.
 
When I consider that CA lied on the stand in a MURDER trial, and may face no charges of perjury, it is a very hard pill for me to swallow. IMO, it sets a dangerous precedent that not only is it okay to disregard the sworn oath, but it is especially understandable if you have a child or family member who has killed another and is facing the death penalty.

Insert the circumstances in any other case you can think of, and I doubt there would be so many "gray areas" with regard to compassion for someone who obstructs justice and commits perjury.

Did she give police the wrong hairbrush? Did she allegedly clean out the car to the extent that she might have even used one of those Bissell "spot bot" machines? Did she release a statement via her attorney in an attempt to "soften" the blow or potential repercussions before she took the stand and flipped?

If it is proven that she lied, I cannot fathom her being gently reminded that she was simply wrong and having her testimony stricken.

If I commit a crime, I expect to be punished. If she commits a crime before the entire world, with no punishment, what does that say about our justice system?
 
Just caught YM on HLN, that clip from Universal...he should have cross-examined her if she had testified, I like the way he just keeps going and going...that would have been something to see.
 
cluciano63 said:
In reading some sites about "ineffective counsel" where it was granted ( a reversal and a new trial) one caught my eye as something that this defense might actually do...in closing, if the defense refers to the defendant not taking the stand due to the fact that they lie, or tend to lie...that would meet the standards for ineffective counsel-yikes, I could see JB saying something like this.

ETA: Double yikes...another standard showed that the defense attorney must be considered "a reasonably competent attorney"...
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In the attorneys thread there was a few questions regarding ineffective counsel. I don't remember exactly what the answer was except that the counsel would have to be much worse than it actually is, which is not saying much.
 
allycat1208 said:
I think maybe it was a comment by Jean Cesarez on Nancy Grace. I know it was a news person in the court room that can see the jurors. Whoever it was said the jury doesn't seem to like Ashton because he comes across as angry.
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Thank you!
 
allycat1208 said:
In the attorneys thread there was a few questions regarding ineffective counsel. I don't remember exactly what the answer was except that the counsel would have to be much worse than it actually is, which is not saying much.
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Not really sure how any defense could be worse across the board. I saw one case that was reversed some years back where this court-appointed lawyer did HIS best, was really sincere, but he just did not the experience and did a poor job. The guy got a new trial and eventually got out of prison.

On the other hand, I just read about a case where the defense lawyer often slept during the trial, and that was not considered "ineffective." So it sounds like it is almost a crap shoot...
 
I believe that the story of KH/RC should be a cautionary tale to anyone who is thinking about the glamour and excitement of getting involved with a married man:

In the end, you will end up where you started.... alone and irrelevant.
 
I indentify with this case because I too became a mother at 19, unwed. I was away at college, and was raped, and had to move back in with my mother at home and switch colleges to a liberal arts college nearby a year after my child was born. The first two years of my child's life were spent living with my mother. So I really did not want to believe at first that Casey was capable of this. I wanted to identify with her. I was judged a lot by people. I was hounded. It was all unfair. At first I was sympathetic toward Casey due to my personal experiences. Until I realized she was a murdering b%tch who never reported her daughter missing and lied to investigators. From day one my daughter has been my life. I've sacrificed everything for her. I'm successful. She's a 4.0 student and a member of Honor Society. She is now 13 and the happiest child I've ever seen. She plays travel soccer and tennis and has a boyfriend and swims everyday and has slumber parties every weekend. Why wasn't Caylee given this opportunity??? Why??? I'm pizzedddddd
 
dkatiemom said:
Insert the circumstances in any other case you can think of, and I doubt there would be so many "gray areas" with regard to compassion for someone who obstructs justice and commits perjury.

If I commit a crime, I expect to be punished. If she commits a crime before the entire world, with no punishment, what does that say about our justice system?
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Exactly. Cindy strikes me as a bully - she's used to folks backing down (except for her murderous daughter) - IMO she needs to be held accountable.
 
cluciano63 said:
Not really sure how any defense could be worse across the board. I saw one case that was reversed some years back where this court-appointed lawyer did HIS best, was really sincere, but he just did not the experience and did a poor job. The guy got a new trial and eventually got out of prison.

On the other hand, I just read about a case where the defense lawyer often slept during the trial, and that was not considered "ineffective." So it sounds like it is almost a crap shoot...
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lol regarding the attorney falling asleep during trial. The problem with the expertise of an attorney is that just because an attorney is talented at his job does not mean that the defendant will be judged fairly. In this case it probably is true that KC is being judged fairly. If KC had Ashton on her team I wonder how we would look at this trial. Unfortunately, many innocent convicted people have gone to prison because their attorneys were just not impressive.
 
noelle91176 said:
I'm sorry if this has been discussed, but what are your thoughts on the gesture that George makes upon leaving the stand upon looking at ICA.

http://www.wftv.com/video/28408667/index.html (around 14:00)

Local news here mentioned it and I think it's very telling.
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I think it was the exclamation point for the sentiment he made to Jose on his way to the stand, which makes me wonder if defense exhibit FU was always labeled as such...
 
allycat1208 said:
lol regarding the attorney falling asleep during trial. The problem with the expertise of an attorney is that just because an attorney is talented at his job does not mean that the defendant will be judged fairly. In this case it probably is true that KC is being judged fairly. If KC had Ashton on her team I wonder how we would look at this trial. Unfortunately, many innocent convicted defendants have gone to prison because their attorneys were just not impressive.
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If Ashton had been her Attorney, this would never have gone to trial - it would have been a fast and quiet plea agreement and poof - nothing more from ICA.
 
Has a photo from any stage of Casey's childhood ever surfaced? I would be very interested to see what she looked like at a young age.
 
logicalgirl said:
If Ashton had been her Attorney, this would never have gone to trial - it would have been a fast and quiet plea agreement and poof - nothing more from ICA.
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JB can't say he wasn't warned. CM said she should have taken a plea way before he signed on with them..
 
I'm listening to Ashton arguing about the smell of the cans. I'm just trying to get to the part of the trial today where GA's suicide note was brought up. Did I go past it?
 
momtective said:
Just had one of the worst scares of my life and had to run out real quick...son had a very important job training this morning, he was running late and left out in a hurry. Almost 2 hours after he was suppose to have been there, the company calls and reports to me that he never showed. This was so out of character for him so naturally I was terrified and took off down the road to look for him, thinking maybe he had been in a accident, called his cell every 10 seconds and it went straight to vm....I was freakin' terrified.
Finally he called me on my cell...he had already been to the company and the trainers were not expected to be in for at least an hour so he went to get a haircut!
Thanking God he is okay but me...I won't be worth a carp the rest of the day. :giggle: Legs still shaking....I'm glad there is a 2 hour lunch, it'll give me time to recover.
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And that, folks, is how you act when your child is missing...
 
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