2015.06.28 Timestamp Indicated per Probable Cause Doc

[Bobbywoo]

When considering what time TS's flight was I think it is important to remember that flights very rarely land exactly at the time of their scheduled landing. This summer my son's flight arrived twenty minutes early, and it was a three hour flight.

Or even if they are wheels down at the scheduled time if you are sitting near the back it could take 15-20 minutes to get off that plane....slow pokes ;p

 

[human]

I'm just now coming into the threads on this case, but I've read several articles about this case. The precise TOD is very puzzling. Could there have been a text that was sent at that time to someone (MS or someone else) to confirm that Dr. Sievers was dead? Maybe even a code word? For it to be so precise, there is definitely some type of irrefutable documentation.

JMO

Can you believe the killer's luck that she just happened to come home when they are there? What an uncanny coincidence. Not!

 

[1&2&3]

Could this time be the time she was on video at the airport paying for her parking?

IIRC there was mention of several street cams LE were going to check that TS should have passed on her drive from the airport to home. It could also have been one of these.

Actually, while it seems like there are few places TS may have been at this time, we are all back to a guessing game. In reality, there are a number of places she may have been as we see here from discussing it.

This time frame brings up the question as to who was arguing in the Sievers home around 5:00 in the morning? Could J.R and C.W.W. have been the ones heard arguing?

 

[human]

With all this theorizing on who used TS phone, etc., I gotta tell you - for all the conversations I have had with Mark over the past decade since the "Patriot Act" was put in place to legalize the recording of our phones, and making transcripts of every phone conversation, in my mind there is no way in hell any type of false conversation (meaning, speaking candidly of crimes, or somebody using another's phone and they try to get away with the deceit) would have happened.

Wayne having done work requiring DHS clearance, and with all we know about his knowledge of digital footprints, just would never, ever, be part of a plan of his/theirs.

how did he get clearance with a criminal record? And LE says that they left digital footprints. They were also seen on camera at Walmart.

No reason that they both could not have had burner phones.

 

[Dion]

I wonder if at 11:19 MS called CWW to say that TS was on her way home, therefore setting the crime in motion.

 

[creepingskills]

Or perhaps TS was talking on the Van's Bluetooth at 11:19. Saying prayers with the girls on the 15-20 minute drive. Pulls up to the house and say's to MS, "well I'm home now."

IIRC a verified insider said the call from TS was made at the airport, before she made it home.

 

[Batman's Mommy]

Can you believe the killer's luck that she just happened to come home when they are there? What an uncanny coincidence. Not!

I don't believe in coincidence.

 

[creepingskills]

With all this theorizing on who used TS phone, etc., I gotta tell you - for all the conversations I have had with Mark over the past decade since the "Patriot Act" was put in place to legalize the recording of our phones, and making transcripts of every phone conversation, in my mind there is no way in hell any type of false conversation (meaning, speaking candidly of crimes, or somebody using another's phone and they try to get away with the deceit) would have happened.

Wayne having done work requiring DHS clearance, and with all we know about his knowledge of digital footprints, just would never, ever, be part of a plan of his/theirs.

Even if you believe the government does transcribe/record every phone call, no one should be worried that this might be used in court. First of all, how does one obtain this evidence, is the prosecutor going to subpoena the recording from the NSA? Second, even if the prosecutor compels the NSA to turn over the recording, I can't think of one circumstance where a judge would not immediately throw out such evidence. If not, why would LE bother with seeking judicial approval for spying on defendants in an investigation ever?

I'm sure CWW knew exactly the type of data LE could obtain and use, he's probably talked about murder on the phone in the past decade, and so far has only been charged once. If he talked to MS about murder, not saying he has but if then just by being a party to the conversation, MS would also know its safe to talk about secret things on certain phones without fear of prosecution based on a secret recording.

 

[Suthrnqt]

<snipped>

Wayne having done work requiring DHS clearance, and with all we know about his knowledge of digital footprints, just would never, ever, be part of a plan of his/theirs.

RSBM

How in the he11 did CWW pass the security clearance to work for DHS with a criminal record?? Especially with drug charges in his jacket. That just doesn't happen, imo. Sorry, but I have to call BS on that tidbit of info.
:cow:

 

[Bobbywoo]

Even if you believe the government does transcribe/record every phone call, no one should be worried that this might be used in court. First of all, how does one obtain this evidence, is the prosecutor going to subpoena the recording from the NSA? Second, even if the prosecutor compels the NSA to turn over the recording, I can't think of one circumstance where a judge would not immediately throw out such evidence. If not, why would LE bother with seeking judicial approval for spying on defendants in an investigation ever?

I'm sure CWW knew exactly the type of data LE could obtain and use, he's probably talked about murder on the phone in the past decade, and so far has only been charged once. If he talked to MS about murder, not saying he has but if then just by being a party to the conversation, MS would also know its safe to talk about secret things on certain phones without fear of prosecution based on a secret recording.

And to add my 2 cents, maybe I'm naive but I don't think the government cares what us common folks are talking about. And if they did listen in they would be mighty bored. Unless CWW was dabbling in terrorism or organized crime...I'm sure the govt could care less when it comes to recording his phone conversations.

 

[Bobbywoo]

Could this time be the time she was on video at the airport paying for her parking?

IIRC there was mention of several street cams LE were going to check that TS should have passed on her drive from the airport to home. It could also have been one of these.

Actually, while it seems like there are few places TS may have been at this time, we are all back to a guessing game. In reality, there are a number of places she may have been as we see here from discussing it.

This time frame brings up the question as to who was arguing in the Sievers home around 5:00 in the morning? Could J.R and C.W.W. have been the ones heard arguing?

I don't think there was arguing at 5:00 in the morning at the Siever's. I think the winess was mistaken and if they heard something it has absolutely nothing to do with the Siever's murder.

 

[gngr~snap]

Is it possible a photo was taken @ 11:19 of the "job" being completed?
My other thought is that the coroner took a body temp @11:19 that indicated death had occurred 12 hours earlier.
I don't recall when the cooling stops I'll go check.

 

[gngr~snap]

http://coronertalk.com/28

If the body is not out in the heat, the body loses about
(-) 1.5 degrees per hour
*in an air conditioned room*

(-)1.5 degrees / hour x 12 hours = 18 degrees
98.6 – 18= 80.6
(So very close to the temp of the home?)

Rigor mortis complete?

"8-12 hours: …….Rigor mortis established throughout the body, extending to arms and legs"

*"But what if someone witnessed the fatal blow or gunshot or what if the event was recorded on a timed surveillance camera, wouldn’t that accurately mark the time of death? The answer is a qualified yes."

Moo

 

[TruthStar]

I am wondering if someone was already in the van waiting for her?

 

[CeaElle]

Establishing timelines - There is a traffic cam at the Imperial/East Terry intersection, TS most certainly drove home from RSW via I75 or Treeline/Corkscrew/Imperial, IMO the LCSO knows to the minute when she turned onto E. Terry, she would than only travel 6 short blocks to Jarvis Rd. In addition, if her cell were on, regardless if she was on it, wouldn't it be "pinging" towers along the way, further establishing her exact timeline? JMO

TOD – If TS had her cell out while driving, perhaps to charge it after a day of travel, it is possible that it was in her hand or pocket rather than her purse when she exited her vehicle. If a struggle occurred as soon as she exited the van or entered the house, and the cell was damaged, it would power off and stop transmitting signals (I think). OTOH, if she dropped her bags and keys right beside the van or inside the door, it would indicate she was attacked immediately, and TOD based on medical information and crime scene data. JMO

The WOW - Using the theory that the cell was not damaged and assuming the TOD is accurate, MS has stated that TS called him at 11:30 (which LE can easily verify), the medical examiner listed TOD as 11:19, did CWW call MS from TS' cell phone to let him know the job was done? Is this the first obvious discrepancy in MS’ story? Is it an intentional act by LE to put pressure on the people “in the envelope” JMO
​

 

[Todalu]

I understand your frustration. I came across a blog where there was a large list of domain names that MS had been buying. All of them had
the words 'painfree' in the name. Cannot find it anywhere!

 

[Dmacky]

Is it my eyes?? I don't see the words "time of death" on page 2 at the top.

It isn't time of death. It's time of the crime of murder.

Yes - - so this thread should not be titled TOD (Time of Death) per Probable Cause Doc.
Many confusing posts because of those posters who believe the TOD is June 28, 2015 at 23:19 PM.

I finally get what you all are saying. :idea: and I agree...
Although I will say it's still an very odd precise time for anything. There has to be SOMETHING that LE has... to know the very detailed accurate time.
Remember that SMS has said many times that have been able to basically follow virtually their every move.

I'm going with Walmart. What ever they purchased at Walmart was used in this murder and checked out at 11:19pm. LE then virtually followed them going to Teresa Sievers house.
I rest my case :gavel:

 

[human]

I finally get what you all are saying. :idea: and I agree...
Although I will say it's still an very odd precise time for anything. There has to be SOMETHING that LE has... to know the very detailed accurate time.
Remember that SMS has said many times that have been able to basically follow virtually their every move.

I'm going with Walmart. What ever they purchased at Walmart was used in this murder and checked out at 11:19pm. LE then virtually followed them going to Teresa Sievers house.
I rest my case :gavel:

No way! cww is a techno genius! Works for Homeland Security! Or was he checking out their security system for possible improvements?

 

[Dmacky]

I finally get what you all are saying. :idea: and I agree...
Although I will say it's still an very odd precise time for anything. There has to be SOMETHING that LE has... to know the very detailed accurate time.
Remember that SMS has said many times that have been able to basically follow virtually their every move.

I'm going with Walmart. What ever they purchased at Walmart was used in this murder and checked out at 11:19pm. LE then virtually followed them from Walmart going to Teresa Sievers house.
I rest my case :gavel:

I hadn't read this morning past what SeeSea explained about 11:19 NOT being TOD. I am just now catching up and seeing that Walmart has already been mentioned by a couple of posters, and we think alike. I still believe it was THERE that LE used as the beginning of the crime.

 

[human]

I hadn't read this morning past what SeeSea explained about 11:19 NOT being TOD. I am just now catching up and seeing that Walmart has already been mentioned by a couple of posters, and we think alike. I still believe it was THERE that LE used as the beginning of the crime.

How did they get into the house? She let them in cuz she knew CWW?