4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #87

[di anna]

The Defense wants the 'records' paperwork, notes, etc. of FBI in relations to doing the Genetic Genealogy Investigation that narrowed down the DNA to a male Kohberger. The State has submitted a response in their Motions they do not have access to those and that the FBI does not typically document their process them or provide them for trial.

MOO

Yuck, this might get dirty.

 

[Chloegirl]

Botany?! Plants not people. I feel like Yosemite Sam, what in tarnation is going on here?!

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Does she understand more about genetics than the average bear, yes. Does she have an interest, yes. Is she a qualified expert? I'm not finding proof of that and could make a pretty decent argument not being a genetic genealogist against it. I'm sure she can help people with this website but if she's just referring you to 23andMe, etc. I guess I'm not folowng why I am paying her and where she's utilizing expertise. It all seems more anecdotal and an area of interest than an area of qualification. JMOO

 

[I'm Nobody]

So exactly what does this mean? Are they disputing the validity of the DNA found on the sheath?

I'm curious too. Wasn't the GGI used for the arrest? Are they trying to get the arrest thrown out???

JMO

 

[10ofRods]

I'm curious too. Wasn't the GGI used for the arrest? Are they trying to get the arrest thrown out???

JMO

I believe the arrest warrant set the DNA in a different category, just in case.

The way I imagine it happened is they sequenced the DNA from the sheath and sent it to the genetic genealogy site that allows LE to use their services. They found a match to a near relative who had the name Kohberger. And they already had records from Pullman and Moscow as to who had a registered white Elantra. They then collected DNA from Kohberger's dad, IIRC (someone correct me if I'm wrong and got a paternity match to the sheath sample).

This was mentioned as a separate item for the PA arrest warrant, IIRC, just in case. LE asked the Court to issue a PCA without using the DNA, it was provided as context at that time. After the arrest, BK's DNA matched with the knife sheath.

IMO.

 

[10ofRods]

Does she understand more about genetics than the average bear, yes. Does she have an interest, yes. Is she a qualified expert? I'm not finding proof of that and could make a pretty decent argument not being a genetic genealogist against it. I'm sure she can help people with this website but if she's just referring you to 23andMe, etc. I guess I'm not folowng why I am paying her and where she's utilizing expertise. It all seems more anecdotal and an area of interest than an area of qualification. JMOO

I agree. Almost anyone could have cited the 5-6 cases where some mistake was made (either in chain of custody or in terms of going against terms of service of the database company).

None of that happened in this case, that we know of. The "expert's" point seems to be that in a very small number of cases, mistakes have been made in the past (and most of what she tells about 23 and Ancestry is irrelevant to this case). It's like a little tutorial on genealogy after reading some websites.

IMO.

 

[SortaSleuthy]

I believe the arrest warrant set the DNA in a different category, just in case.

The way I imagine it happened is they sequenced the DNA from the sheath and sent it to the genetic genealogy site that allows LE to use their services. They found a match to a near relative who had the name Kohberger. And they already had records from Pullman and Moscow as to who had a registered white Elantra. They then collected DNA from Kohberger's dad, IIRC (someone correct me if I'm wrong and got a paternity match to the sheath sample).

This was mentioned as a separate item for the PA arrest warrant, IIRC, just in case. LE asked the Court to issue a PCA without using the DNA, it was provided as context at that time. After the arrest, BK's DNA matched with the knife sheath.

IMO.

Yup

 

[Chloegirl]

I agree. Almost anyone could have cited the 5-6 cases where some mistake was made (either in chain of custody or in terms of going against terms of service of the database company).

None of that happened in this case, that we know of. The "expert's" point seems to be that in a very small number of cases, mistakes have been made in the past (and most of what she tells about 23 and Ancestry is irrelevant to this case). It's like a little tutorial on genealogy after reading some websites.

IMO.

Does this make D look foolish, falling for such a newbie imposter expert? I just cannot settle on what this means for the case.

 

[Sundog]

But ID law requires Notice of Alibi, which technically the Defense did not provide in their response to the Motion. The State is entitled to discovery of who/how BK plans to prove he was elsewhere at the time of the murders. They won't have that if this Motion is ex parte'.

Or am I missing something (which is entirely possible)?

MOO

It is my understanding that with or without an ex parte hearing, the judge will have to make a decision on whether to accept the prosecution's motion to compel, or the defense's argument that the motion to compel would be harmful to the defendant's defense.

 

[Sundog]

Me either. It circumvents the intent of Idaho law (about notice of Alibi). There's a reason for the law and the State is supposed to receive notice (just as the Defense is supposed to receive all the GJ transcripts - which they have received).

Agree that this should normally be the case, but Idaho law gives judges discretion to rule otherwise without it being a circumvention of the law.

 

[schooling]

IMO the defense wants to know if law enforcement did one of the following two things...

1) Learned of Bryan Kohlberger. Used his name to take a genealogy shortcut and worked their way UP the tree to connect him to the DNA sample.

OR

2) They had a completely different suspect(s) in mind but when genealogy came back they abandoned those leads and took a shortcut to Kohlberger.

Both share the same implications. That LE just quit doing their job and got Kohlberger tunnel vision. Their investigation wasn't thorough...it was about setting BK up. Their citing of the 3 unidentified DNA samples are further examples of this.

I don't believe any of this obviously. The DNA will continue to be the DNA. IMO it's not going anywhere. But they are going to muddy things up as much as they can.

MOO

 

[Megnut]

I predict another flurry of motions at the 11th hour, before the August 18th hearing. Distractions. Burying the prosecution and court in waperpork.

IE playbook.

<modsnip>

Jmo

 

[Boxer]

Yuck, this might get dirty.

MOO Its dirty already.
But DNA will hold up as much as they want to wish it away.

 

[Boxer]

IMO the defense wants to know if law enforcement did one of the following two things...

1) Learned of Bryan Kohlberger. Used his name to take a genealogy shortcut and worked their way UP the tree to connect him to the DNA sample.

OR

2) They had a completely different suspect(s) in mind but when genealogy came back they abandoned those leads and took a shortcut to Kohlberger.

Both share the same implications. That LE just quit doing their job and got Kohlberger tunnel vision. Their investigation wasn't thorough...it was about setting BK up. They're citing of the 3 unidentified DNA samples are further examples of this.

I don't believe any of this obviously. The DNA will continue to be the DNA. IMO it's not going anywhere. But they are going to muddy things up as much as they can.

MOO

The DNA comes back a family match for the crime scene and the police want to investigate that person.

The opportunity. Yes
Any witnesses. Yes (inclusionary)
Person's car (on security cameras)
Does the person have an alibi? No.

 

[schooling]

The DNA comes back a family match for the crime scene and the police want to investigate that person.

The opportunity. Yes
Any witnesses. Yes (inclusionary)
Person's car (on security cameras)
Does the person have an alibi? No.

Totally agree. I don't think it will fly. But it's likely the only way they can defend him.....as he's giving them nothing to work with. IMO and in my interpretation of some of their filings....they are a hop skip and a jump away from some of the wilder theories flying around out there.

Honestly...I'm wondering if he gave them something months ago. And they've been trying to find evidence to support it and can't. And therefore can't bring it to court.

The "inside baseball" (not the most appropriate term considering the gravity of the crime) books that will be written after the case is all said and done are going to be fascinating.

 

[I'm Nobody]

AFFIDAVIT 0F LEAH LARKIN​

Lawyer You Know @TragosLaw​

"Kohberger Backs Up DNA Request "​

More explanation for those who'd like more. JMO

 

[Balthazar]

[BBM]

I'm worried about that person. AT said her evidence will come via cross of state witnesses, some of which might involve protected material. The only protected material I am aware of are the officer training records that she fought so hard to obtain (and which like the prosecution, I don't think she should have been entitled to). I hope their strategy isn't "Let's try to destroy LE credibility on matters that have nothing to do with this investigation bc we have nothing else".

jmo

I'm thinking the protected material is more likely to be medical records.

 

[Megnut]

New brain scan study discovers possible biological basis of visual snow syndrome

Researchers from the Institute of Psychiatry, Psychology & Neuroscience (IoPPN) at King's College London have used a novel approach to show that the patterns of activity in two brain chemical systems—glutamate and serotonin—are different in people with visual snow syndrome compared to those...

medicalxpress.com

Including this article because it's topical.

 

[girlhasnoname]

The Defense has a snowballs chance in hell of getting this DNA tossed. Even without the IGG, they have a STR sample that belongs conclusively to BK left at the murder scene. The State wasn't even going to use the IGG information during trial, the FBI were just literally the 'middleman'. They already had BK in their sights based on other evidence.

BK (or anyone else) has no right to privacy when his DNA is left at a crime scene!

This 'Expert" the Defense has cited has a very hard nose reputation according to my research about her stance on IGG. Again, the Defense is just trying to negate the State's evidence by any means necessary. It doesn't make it true though.

I hope JJJ aka J Trips has his big boy pants on for this trial.

ALL MOO

 

[Slamalam]

This is going back a long ways… I have been following these threads, but only posting a couple of times because I can never keep up! From what I recall, they’ve said BK’s phone was “turned off or in airplane mode.” Does anyone know if, by now, investigators can tell which it was? For example, if in airplane mode, the phone still may have been searching for certain connections and “touched [the house’s] wifi” as SG claimed. I am wondering if there may have been anything else- wifi, Bluetooth?- that the phone may have connected to and they would have those details by now. Or maybe more importantly, if there is even a way to get those details, and are they stored in the phones records somehow? Hoping!

JMO

 

[10ofRods]

This is going back a long ways… I have been following these threads, but only posting a couple of times because I can never keep up! From what I recall, they’ve said BK’s phone was “turned off or in airplane mode.” Does anyone know if, by now, investigators can tell which it was? For example, if in airplane mode, the phone still may have been searching for certain connections and “touched [the house’s] wifi” as SG claimed. I am wondering if there may have been anything else- wifi, Bluetooth?- that the phone may have connected to and they would have those details by now. Or maybe more importantly, if there is even a way to get those details, and are they stored in the phones records somehow? Hoping!

JMO

Good questions. We don't know for sure, but I believe LE does know exactly what was happening with that phone by now.

If turned off, then no GPS for those two hours or so. If in airplane mode, then GPS continued. I'm something of a betting person, so I'm going with "BK turned the phone off entirely," but I can't figure out why the heck he had it on as he was leaving Pullman in the first place. I am personally on the fence about what, exactly, his intentions were on that particular evening. I believe he was generally an angry person and had homicidal ideation over the years. Just a hunch.

I can't wait to learn the answers to your questions, at any rate. I think there will be various attempts by that phone to "join networks," which will provide a whole new set of location points for BK.

IMO.