8/20 Ron takes plea, will testify in Haleighs trial

[pittsburghgirl]

I don't see how you can jump to that concusion. We don't know that Ron has not already given this information to some members of LE. LE has to determine that they want someone to testify to some particular information they have been told. LE may have asked Ron if certain things were said or done by somebody else that he might not otherwise have even thought they would be interest in.

I'm sure Ron's lawyer took advantage of anything that LE found of interest, to see if he could gain some benefit for his client. There is nothing to indicate that Ron withheld information from LE that he knew would be useful. IMO, if he thought he knew something that could bring the abductors to justice, he would have provided it. Regardless of other shortcomings he might have, he loves this child and wants justice on her behalf.

Let's take this excellent point one step further. No one knows what RC has told LE, from the beginning of the case. The plea bargain does NOT mean he hadn't given LE information; it means that (in the normal course of events in criminal matters) his attorney negotiated a plea instead of going to trial. Most criminal cases in the country are resolved in this way, for reasons that have been outlined on this forum before. In this case, LE used the plea bargain to lock up an agreement for RC to testify. Once the plea was resolved, he was likely able to give details about other criminal activities (e.g., owning illegal guns, dealing drugs, etc.) that could have put him in jail for a long time. That doesn't mean he didn't tell LE what he knows about Misty, her brothers, and the other people involved in this case. It means that he made the right choice not to put himself in a position where he might never see his son again outside of prison.

The sad, sad fact is that Haleigh was dead when she left the mobile home, long before Ron forced Misty to call 911. There's nothing RC or Crystal or anyone else could have said to LE that would have saved her. We all know the statistics are terrible for missing children after the first 48 hours. If a predator takes the child, he or she is usually dead within three hours.

If a person believes that RC was at work, that LE is bright enough to have verified that, then the argument that RC hasn't cooperated doesn't hold water. It appears, from the testimony of various Croslins and their relatives, that Misty and Tommy were responsible, either on their own or with someone else. It's their moment to point a finger at anyone else involved, and no one is pointing at Ron--who, after all, is now in JAIL awaiting PRISON and is no longer a threat to anyone (making the "they're afraid of RC" argument moot. They claim to be afraid of Joe O. and he's not in prison and they are pointing fingers at him. I can't think of one single reason for LE to make a deal with Ron if he hadn't been cooperative in the search for Haleigh )or if they thought in any way he was involved in her disappearance). And it is a huge and unfair leap to first assume he hasn't cooperated and then assume that he doesn't love his daughter and want her home.

 

[Whisperer]

It is not a huge and unfair leap to me since LE stated clearly that he nor misty were cooperating. LE had invited them BOTH to come in and talk. RC did not. This continued from March till August and after the assault on tommy. He came out of hiding (not by choice but was forced due to media). He decided that may be a good time to look for haleigh. He accomplished this by hiring Mark Nejame, thus taking the focus off of himself. He went with his attorney to discuss phone records (August 09) and his attorney made it clear that is all he was discussing.

As I believe ron cummings is a compulsive liar, I do not count on testimonyng to anything truthful that could possiblly incriminate. If by chance, he says anything that will make him appear less than stellar and leans to criminal activity, you can bet he has immunity.

 

[Emeralgem]

Let's take this excellent point one step further. No one knows what RC has told LE, from the beginning of the case. .

Snipped
BBM.. You are absolutely correct, but I suspect whatever it is he has told LE has ALL been a pack of lies in order to frame anyone and everyone he could in order to CHOA and keep the truth as to whatever happened from ever being revealed..Piece of work that boy is..JMHO

 

[dodie20]

Let's take this excellent point one step further. No one knows what RC has told LE, from the beginning of the case. The plea bargain does NOT mean he hadn't given LE information; it means that (in the normal course of events in criminal matters) his attorney negotiated a plea instead of going to trial. Most criminal cases in the country are resolved in this way, for reasons that have been outlined on this forum before. In this case, LE used the plea bargain to lock up an agreement for RC to testify. Once the plea was resolved, he was likely able to give details about other criminal activities (e.g., owning illegal guns, dealing drugs, etc.) that could have put him in jail for a long time. That doesn't mean he didn't tell LE what he knows about Misty, her brothers, and the other people involved in this case. It means that he made the right choice not to put himself in a position where he might never see his son again outside of prison.

The sad, sad fact is that Haleigh was dead when she left the mobile home, long before Ron forced Misty to call 911. There's nothing RC or Crystal or anyone else could have said to LE that would have saved her. We all know the statistics are terrible for missing children after the first 48 hours. If a predator takes the child, he or she is usually dead within three hours.

If a person believes that RC was at work, that LE is bright enough to have verified that, then the argument that RC hasn't cooperated doesn't hold water. It appears, from the testimony of various Croslins and their relatives, that Misty and Tommy were responsible, either on their own or with someone else. It's their moment to point a finger at anyone else involved, and no one is pointing at Ron--who, after all, is now in JAIL awaiting PRISON and is no longer a threat to anyone (making the "they're afraid of RC" argument moot. They claim to be afraid of Joe O. and he's not in prison and they are pointing fingers at him. I can't think of one single reason for LE to make a deal with Ron if he hadn't been cooperative in the search for Haleigh )or if they thought in any way he was involved in her disappearance). And it is a huge and unfair leap to first assume he hasn't cooperated and then assume that he doesn't love his daughter and want her home.

How do you know for a fact that Haleigh was dead, before she left the mobile home? Ron, TN, GGS, Crystal, & some others think she is still alive. Personally, I think she's dead, but don't necessarily think it happened in the mobile home. Also, I know Misty hasn't done much to help herself, but what testimony from what Croslins & other relatives, points to her being responsible? I know GMFlo said she heard that Misty hit Haleigh with a board, but I don't believe that theory is being investigated. She also said that she heard that Haleigh got into Ron's pills. & as far as the party OD letter...those could've been Ron's pills also. So, except for accusations from tv people, internet people, I haven't seen much finger pointing towards Misty. Ron even claims to believe her, or at the least, thinks she was coerced out of fear. TN called her a witch, but she also said that she was the best gf Ron ever had, so I don't give her opinions on Misty, much weight. & Ron didn't just take a plea, to save the county some court costs. He has agreed to testify in any Haleigh trials...& considering that he lawyered up with a criminal defense attorney, early on, & stopped cooperating with LE a long time ago, it's MOO, that what he has been telling them while being incarcerated, is important & NEW information. The rule for getting these minimum mandatories reduced, is that the accused has to give pertinent info that helps solve another case. & that IMO, is what Ron is doing. giving LE info that will help solve Haleigh's case. & folks questioning why he didn't give that info up a lot sooner, is a fair question.

 

[kamky]

It is not a huge and unfair leap to me since LE stated clearly that he nor misty were cooperating. LE had invited them BOTH to come in and talk. RC did not. This continued from March till August and after the assault on tommy. He came out of hiding (not by choice but was forced due to media). He decided that may be a good time to look for haleigh. He accomplished this by hiring Mark Nejame, thus taking the focus off of himself. He went with his attorney to discuss phone records (August 09) and his attorney made it clear that is all he was discussing.

As I believe ron cummings is a compulsive liar, I do not count on testimonyng to anything truthful that could possiblly incriminate. If by chance, he says anything that will make him appear less than stellar and leans to criminal activity, you can bet he has immunity.

I think - and, of course, none of us have any way of actually knowing, so these are all just opinions - that Ron had a hard time dealing with the pressure of being a parent of a missing child under scruntinty of LE. Due to immaturity, due to a rebellious personality, due to mistrust of LE, due to fear, who knows why. But LE has to come down hard on all possible suspects, including the parents - especially the parents, even though they may be in shock and grieving. A mature adult would have enough difficulty with this, much less an immature 25 year old. I'm not making excuses but giving reasons why I can see how Ron would have retreated from LE. After some time passed and adults he respected, such as his lawyer, persuaded him to talk to LE, then I think he opened up.

I don't know this young man and he may be some of what everybody keeps saying, but he has been accused of being so bad that he's become a legend! If it turns out that he is guilty of involvement in his childs disappearance and cover up, then he will have to pay the price to the fullest degree. Otherwise, he is someone who is missing a child that he loved.

 

[dodie20]

I think - and, of course, none of us have any way of actually knowing, so these are all just opinions - that Ron had a hard time dealing with the pressure of being a parent of a missing child under scruntinty of LE. Due to immaturity, due to a rebellious personality, due to mistrust of LE, due to fear, who knows why. But LE has to come down hard on all possible suspects, including the parents - especially the parents, even though they may be in shock and grieving. A mature adult would have enough difficulty with this, much less an immature 25 year old. I'm not making excuses but giving reasons why I can see how Ron would have retreated from LE. After some time passed and adults he respected, such as his lawyer, persuaded him to talk to LE, then I think he opened up.

I don't know this young man and he may be some of what everybody keeps saying, but he has been accused of being so bad that he's become a legend! If it turns out that he is guilty of involvement in his childs disappearance and cover up, then he will have to pay the price to the fullest degree. Otherwise, he is someone who is missing a child that he loved.

actually, in a perfect world, Ron would 'have to pay the price to the fullest degree', for a cover-up, but in this world, he has struck a deal. & in the big picture, that might not be the worst possible thing, because I'd much rather LE strike that deal with a cover upper, (& get some answers), than the murderer. except that he's Haleigh's dad...which makes it so disheartening. I think a lot of this case is going to come down to the call that Ron made to Tommy. when & why? Ron said that he did not ask Tommy to check on Misty. If he can back that up with a passed LDT, then LE's in business. I know Tommy has now backed away from that claim, but that doesn't mean LE is going to just toss it, because Tommy wants them to. Tommy had no problem throwing Misty under the bus, & lying on Ron, so he himself put himself at that trailer & lied about why. If he took that call from a landline, he's gonna be in even deeper, because I doubt very seriously that time fits in with his Joe story. But, this is just one thing that Ron can do, (LDT), & it should've been done a long time ago, & it's not worth a deal. So, I'm gonna be real interested to hear what else he has to say. & if it's not substantial, well...there are gonna be some ticked off observers. He was in the thick of that trafficking, stole a pill, took the pill, lied, made future deals, & by rights, shouldn't be shown leniency, & should be locked up longer than Hope, Donna, & Tommy.

 

[Whisperer]

I am sure that the State knows ron is a compulsive liar and that is why they put the "Truthful" part in the compromise. The problem occurs when they cannot prove he is lying. Everything he has said so far has been inconsistent. That is unlikely to change. That is why he is locked up with the rest and on the bail bond they gave him. They know he has information and they have caught him in lies (heck, so have we). The State made a deal with the devil as far as I'm concerned but, really, what were their options, they want Haleigh found. It appears there will be no trial w/o the remains or substantial evidence. They cannot put any of these critters on trial even with probable cause at this point because there isn't a truthful one among them. Since no testimony can be trusted, I think we see the problem....

 

[lonetraveler]

I am sure that the State knows ron is a compulsive liar and that is why they put the "Truthful" part in the compromise. The problem occurs when they cannot prove he is lying. Everything he has said so far has been inconsistent. That is unlikely to change. That is why he is locked up with the rest and on the bail bond they gave him. They know he has information and they have caught him in lies (heck, so have we). The State made a deal with the devil as far as I'm concerned but, really, what were their options, they want Haleigh found. It appears there will be no trial w/o the remains or substantial evidence. They cannot put any of these critters on trial even with probable cause at this point because there isn't a truthful one among them. Since no testimony can be trusted, I think we see the problem....

I guess LE got tired of trying to give Tommy and Misty a chance to make a deal to get to the truth and didn't get anywhere so Ron was the only one left to try and get information from. I feel, like you, that Ron will continue to lie and CHA and LE will get nowhere at all with any information that he gives up. I've wondered from the start of this "DEAL" how LE were going to prove that Ron's information was the truth.

 

[doobiedoo52]

JMO but I think the only reason LE called this a homicide is because of the big break they thought they got from Tommy. Obviously, they had no proof to show the families because they still believe she's alive. Since nothing came of the big search, I think they are back to square one and clueless. The way that plea bargain is worded, I think they are going to use Ron to nail a bunch of drug cases. I don't think it has anything to do with Haleigh. It almost seems like this whole thing is about drugs and not Haleigh anymore. If Ron's testimony ends up putting away a bunch of the drug suppliers for 15 and 25 years, LE feels it is worth the bargain they gave him. Poor Haleigh is still at the bottom of the priority ladder.

 

[dodie20]

JMO but I think the only reason LE called this a homicide is because of the big break they thought they got from Tommy. Obviously, they had no proof to show the families because they still believe she's alive. Since nothing came of the big search, I think they are back to square one and clueless. The way that plea bargain is worded, I think they are going to use Ron to nail a bunch of drug cases. I don't think it has anything to do with Haleigh. It almost seems like this whole thing is about drugs and not Haleigh anymore. If Ron's testimony ends up putting away a bunch of the drug suppliers for 15 and 25 years, LE feels it is worth the bargain they gave him. Poor Haleigh is still at the bottom of the priority ladder.

any one of them could've given up those same names. Tommy, according to Werter even offered to go undercover, so you know he was ready to start tattling. & common sense says, go with the one with the fewest charges. I'm sorry, but I don't see this being about drugs. The drugs were used to get to these people, so they could get to the bottom of the Haleigh case. I firmly believe that. (right now, but could change my mind tomorrow). This LE knows that they're being watched, & they know that people aren't gonna forget Haleigh. & I do believe that they will not want to be famous for letting a bunch of uneducated druggies, (& that was putting it nicely), outsmart them. So even if it's soley for the selfish reason, of not wanting this group of (unusual) people, to get the best of them, it's MOO that the Haleigh case is their top priority.

 

[Nonni Brenda]

actually, in a perfect world, Ron would 'have to pay the price to the fullest degree', for a cover-up, but in this world, he has struck a deal. & in the big picture, that might not be the worst possible thing, because I'd much rather LE strike that deal with a cover upper, (& get some answers), than the murderer. except that he's Haleigh's dad...which makes it so disheartening. I think a lot of this case is going to come down to the call that Ron made to Tommy. when & why? Ron said that he did not ask Tommy to check on Misty. If he can back that up with a passed LDT, then LE's in business. I know Tommy has now backed away from that claim, but that doesn't mean LE is going to just toss it, because Tommy wants them to. Tommy had no problem throwing Misty under the bus, & lying on Ron, so he himself put himself at that trailer & lied about why. If he took that call from a landline, he's gonna be in even deeper, because I doubt very seriously that time fits in with his Joe story. But, this is just one thing that Ron can do, (LDT), & it should've been done a long time ago, & it's not worth a deal. So, I'm gonna be real interested to hear what else he has to say. & if it's not substantial, well...there are gonna be some ticked off observers. He was in the thick of that trafficking, stole a pill, took the pill, lied, made future deals, & by rights, shouldn't be shown leniency, & should be locked up longer than Hope, Donna, & Tommy.

Sure wish we had access to the phone records.:banghead:
One question: since RC has made a plea deal to testify (and tell the truth), can they require him, as part of the deal, to take a LDT, not just to swear under oath?:waitasec:

 

[dodie20]

Sure wish we had access to the phone records.:banghead:
One question: since RC has made a plea deal to testify (and tell the truth), can they require him, as part of the deal, to take a LDT, not just to swear under oath?:waitasec:

I hope so, but you'd think Ron, himself, would insist on one.

 

[blazeofglory]

how in the world can someone be working and made 90+calls and visualize he was working no way imo...because he was trying to keep up with misty i dont think so there either.why cant some people see this.there could have been someone making the calls for him i think he left work or wasnt at work.and another thing the overkill i was at work means nothing.we dont no when it happened could have happened before work..and now hes covering for himself and letting others take the wrap..i dont think mc no,s i really dont believe she was there..i dont think tc no,s because he was fried.but lies trying to help himself and misty.with the scripted stories.they all had along time to put things together or someone put it together for them.why would gmf say the things she did and not be afraid of jo? whay would tc not be afraid for his family before jo was locked up.he can still get to them all.how crazy is that.the same way its crazy rc didnt go after tc or jo and he wouldnt ask his gf what happened thats not making since.if it was my child id be screaming out the le you better get them before i do but that didnt happen.dcf didnt go after his son with reports of his children sleeping in the car.what?theres so much to this story but i think its really simple.le just hasnt got there yet for some reason and thats another story in itself..they need to start looking else where that i believe with all in me.i wish tc could have finished that yeah but statement to gmf.but whats so sad is even tcs attorney believes him.he says you have to look on the outside of this ok then look outside look at everyone in her family. thats where the outside is imo.and until they do no one will ever be convicted.

 

[4Jacy]

How do you know for a fact that Haleigh was dead, before she left the mobile home? Ron, TN, GGS, Crystal, & some others think she is still alive. Personally, I think she's dead, but don't necessarily think it happened in the mobile home. Also, I know Misty hasn't done much to help herself, but what testimony from what Croslins & other relatives, points to her being responsible? I know GMFlo said she heard that Misty hit Haleigh with a board, but I don't believe that theory is being investigated. She also said that she heard that Haleigh got into Ron's pills. & as far as the party OD letter...those could've been Ron's pills also. So, except for accusations from tv people, internet people, I haven't seen much finger pointing towards Misty. Ron even claims to believe her, or at the least, thinks she was coerced out of fear. TN called her a witch, but she also said that she was the best gf Ron ever had, so I don't give her opinions on Misty, much weight. & Ron didn't just take a plea, to save the county some court costs. He has agreed to testify in any Haleigh trials...& considering that he lawyered up with a criminal defense attorney, early on, & stopped cooperating with LE a long time ago, it's MOO, that what he has been telling them while being incarcerated, is important & NEW information. The rule for getting these minimum mandatories reduced, is that the accused has to give pertinent info that helps solve another case. & that IMO, is what Ron is doing. giving LE info that will help solve Haleigh's case. & folks questioning why he didn't give that info up a lot sooner, is a fair question.

Oh Dodie20, how could Ron possibly know anything. He was at werk. inocchio:

 

[justus4all]

How do you know for a fact that Haleigh was dead, before she left the mobile home? Ron, TN, GGS, Crystal, & some others think she is still alive. Personally, I think she's dead, but don't necessarily think it happened in the mobile home. Also, I know Misty hasn't done much to help herself, but what testimony from what Croslins & other relatives, points to her being responsible? I know GMFlo said she heard that Misty hit Haleigh with a board, but I don't believe that theory is being investigated. She also said that she heard that Haleigh got into Ron's pills. & as far as the party OD letter...those could've been Ron's pills also. So, except for accusations from tv people, internet people, I haven't seen much finger pointing towards Misty. Ron even claims to believe her, or at the least, thinks she was coerced out of fear. TN called her a witch, but she also said that she was the best gf Ron ever had, so I don't give her opinions on Misty, much weight. & Ron didn't just take a plea, to save the county some court costs. He has agreed to testify in any Haleigh trials...& considering that he lawyered up with a criminal defense attorney, early on, & stopped cooperating with LE a long time ago, it's MOO, that what he has been telling them while being incarcerated, is important & NEW information. The rule for getting these minimum mandatories reduced, is that the accused has to give pertinent info that helps solve another case. & that IMO, is what Ron is doing. giving LE info that will help solve Haleigh's case. & folks questioning why he didn't give that info up a lot sooner, is a fair question.

BBM....IMO...If they think that Haleigh is STILL ALIVE...Why aren't they STILL..holding vigils/media coverage pleading for her return/INCREASED Reward money/hiring P.I. to look for her/search parties out looking/activity in finding her ....Since these players have been arrested and in jail, TN and her relatives have been silent and inactive towards the recovery efforts of Haleigh...They can say they believe she is STILL ALIVE..but their actions say otherwise...they all refer to her...in the PAST TENSE..PLUE...the statement Ron made as he fell to his knees.......I would give my life to have my child's life BACK again.. all too telling...
KWIM??...all in my own opinion..

 

[Kimster]

BBM....IMO...If they think that Haleigh is STILL ALIVE...Why aren't they STILL..holding vigils/media coverage pleading for her return/INCREASED Reward money/hiring P.I. to look for her/search parties out looking/activity in finding her ....Since these players have been arrested and in jail, TN and her relatives have been silent and inactive towards the recovery efforts of Haleigh...They can say they believe she is STILL ALIVE..but their actions say otherwise...they all refer to her...in the PAST TENSE..PLUE...the statement Ron made as he fell to his knees.......I would give my life to have my child's life BACK again.. all too telling...
KWIM??...all in my own opinion..

Hmmm. This is a great topic! Reminds me of an article I was reading yesterday in the Leah Freeman case. I'll open a thread about it later this afternoon unless you'd like to do it. :wink:

 

[Emeralgem]

BBM....IMO...If they think that Haleigh is STILL ALIVE...Why aren't they STILL..holding vigils/media coverage pleading for her return/INCREASED Reward money/hiring P.I. to look for her/search parties out looking/activity in finding her ....Since these players have been arrested and in jail, TN and her relatives have been silent and inactive towards the recovery efforts of Haleigh...They can say they believe she is STILL ALIVE..but their actions say otherwise[/U]...they all refer to her...in the PAST TENSE..PLUE...the statement Ron made as he fell to his knees.......I would give my life to have my child's life BACK again.. all too telling...
KWIM??...all in my own opinion..

IMHO..Their actions were strange long before Ronald got arrested..
This video does not depict a grieving grandmother who is scared out of her mind that her granddaughter is missing..JMHO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca251Iv_sFk&p=499361620C14C61E&playnext=1&index=40

This one gets me everytime I watch it... She has talked to enough of the detectives to feel comfortable with where she stands and people need to quit making her son out to be the bad guy and they need to get out there and find Haleigh..IF you noticed she didn't say she and her family were searching for Haleigh.....

 

[Kimster]

Hmmm. This is a great topic! Reminds me of an article I was reading yesterday in the Leah Freeman case. I'll open a thread about it later this afternoon unless you'd like to do it. :wink:

At the risk of going OT on y'all, here's the new thread: How can the local community help find Haleigh now? - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[suspicious1]

any one of them could've given up those same names. Tommy, according to Werter even offered to go undercover, so you know he was ready to start tattling. & common sense says, go with the one with the fewest charges. I'm sorry, but I don't see this being about drugs. The drugs were used to get to these people, so they could get to the bottom of the Haleigh case. I firmly believe that. (right now, but could change my mind tomorrow). This LE knows that they're being watched, & they know that people aren't gonna forget Haleigh. & I do believe that they will not want to be famous for letting a bunch of uneducated druggies, (& that was putting it nicely), outsmart them. So even if it's soley for the selfish reason, of not wanting this group of (unusual) people, to get the best of them, it's MOO that the Haleigh case is their top priority.

ITA! Dodie. I firmly believe that this is not about the drugs, too. This has never been about the drugs. I think that LE was having a hard time getting these people to talk about what happened to Haleigh, so they needed another way. IMO, they knew or had gained knowledge during their investigation that these players were involved in dealing drugs. Maybe LE found out that whatever happened to Haleigh involved drugs....they came up with a plan to go undercover in order to put the squeeze on these people. When Tommy stated that LE was after Ron and Misty, I wholeheartedly believe that. I think that Misty and Ron were the targets and the others were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. IDK about Tommy though. But considering the fact that Ron and Misty received extremely high bonds tell me that they were, indeed, the main targets. IMO, they were the main targets because of whatever happened surrounding Haleigh going missing. Even at some point, Ron's lawyer said that the Haleigh case was making it harder for them to deal. So IMO, LE was still pressuring Ron about what happened to his daughter. But the fact that Ron got that deal tells me that he told them something that was worthy of a deal. JMO of course

 

[suspicious1]

BBM....IMO...If they think that Haleigh is STILL ALIVE...Why aren't they STILL..holding vigils/media coverage pleading for her return/INCREASED Reward money/hiring P.I. to look for her/search parties out looking/activity in finding her ....Since these players have been arrested and in jail, TN and her relatives have been silent and inactive towards the recovery efforts of Haleigh...They can say they believe she is STILL ALIVE..but their actions say otherwise...they all refer to her...in the PAST TENSE..PLUE...the statement Ron made as he fell to his knees.......I would give my life to have my child's life BACK again.. all too telling...
KWIM??...all in my own opinion..

Justus4all, I totally agree with you. They haven't put together any searches for Haleigh or anything. We're not seeing anyone begging for Haleigh's safe return and there's reason why. IMO, the Cummings really don't believe that Haleigh is still alive, they know different...but they can't give that up or say that in front of the cameras, KWIM? But their actions tell us that.

IMO, we will not see any more searches or pleas for Haleigh because it may take money to do that.....what I'm getting at is, I don't think the Cummings is going to spend any money to do that because they know where Haleigh is and what happened to her, so it would be like wasting money trying to put up that front for the cameras. So all that is left is to claim that Haleigh is still alive.

JMO of course