Found Deceased Australia - Karen Ristevski, 47, Melbourne, Vic, 29 June 2016 - #16 *Arrest*

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sosocurious said:
I was surprised that Sarah was not asked about her father's, mother's and her relationship with her half brother whilst she was on the stand.
That question must have been asked when initial statements were being given by her and Borce, surely.
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RSBM

As far as the committal hearing went, relationships with Ant were not likely pertinent or required at the time. There is enough other evidence.
I think they likely want Ant as a witness to give evidence of Karen saying she was going to leave Borce, and perhaps the rocky side of Borce and Karen's relationship.
But if he is going to be a hostile witness, I am not sure how much good Ant will do for the prosecution.

I don't think anyone will try to pin anything on Ant, either. The police likely know what he was doing and where he was around the time of Karen's murder.
But that evil stranger .... who knows what the evil stranger was doing around the time of Karen's murder.
 
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Trooper said:
'It has also been reported, the missing mother's husband told family members his wife was abducted by a stranger, murdered and “discarded like a piece of rubbish".

sorry, I cant find who to attribute this to.. but thanks for it, I have been collapsed with disbelieving laughter since I read it . The Freudian Slip could not be better demonstrated.

And having said this to the broken hearted family members, Borce and then Sarah proceed to reject police help in finding the person who did it..

Borce's stupidity is of a very special kind, it's not unique, but it is, in it's particular way, quite interesting, from a petri dish point of view.

He , himself is totally unaware, but I think Sarah, and perhaps Vlasko are cognizant of Borce's particular idiocy, and their actions and words may be slanted in that way to try and protect Borce from himself . I am prepared to grant them this leeway. No more than that, though. Ant , on the other hand , wants the world to know how cray cray his dad is.
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It is quoted from the yahoo link above. Sorry, I am not very good at quoting!

It might be a Freudian Slip, or he's looking back at himself as in multiple personalities!
 
SouthAussie said:
RSBM

As far as the committal hearing went, relationships with Ant were not likely pertinent or required at the time. There is enough other evidence.
I think they likely want Ant as a witness to give evidence of Karen saying she was going to leave Borce, and perhaps the rocky side of Borce and Karen's relationship.
But if he is going to be a hostile witness, I am not sure how much good Ant will do for the prosecution.

I don't think anyone will try to pin anything on Ant, either. The police likely know what he was doing and where he was around the time of Karen's murder.
But that evil stranger .... who knows what the evil stranger was doing around the time of Karen's murder.
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Yes you are right it would not have been relevant at committal.


I expect Vasko will be on the list at trial.

Ms Ristevski’s brother-in-law Vasko offered up the most bizarre theories after she vanished.

He glibly told reporters that tensions between Borce, Anthony and Karen, and her embarrassment over her alleged inappropriate relationship with her stepson had prompted her to stage her own disappearance.

He also repeated Anthony’s claims that the marriage was in trouble and that she planned to leave Borce once their daughter Sarah turned 21.

“I reckon she’s run away, ” He told the Herald Sun just weeks after Ms Ristevski vanished.

“That’s my feeling, what with all the rumours going on about Anthony (Rickard).

“She’s been going overseas to America and Hong Kong each month for the past 10 years on business, and I’m told it’s fairly easy to get a false passport.

“I did put the rumours (about Mr Rickard) to Borce, but he said Karen’s not here to answer them. I don’t think she will come back, I reckon she’s gone for good.”

The many odd behaviours of Karen Ristevski’s family

The rumour that ant posted to facebook (re he and Karen) may end up not seeing the light of day at trial.
Seems if ant takes the stand shisha or illegal version, may well be raised though ...imo
 
sosocurious said:
Yes you are right it would not have been relevant at committal.


I expect Vasko will be on the list at trial.

Ms Ristevski’s brother-in-law Vasko offered up the most bizarre theories after she vanished.

He glibly told reporters that tensions between Borce, Anthony and Karen, and her embarrassment over her alleged inappropriate relationship with her stepson had prompted her to stage her own disappearance.

He also repeated Anthony’s claims that the marriage was in trouble and that she planned to leave Borce once their daughter Sarah turned 21.

“I reckon she’s run away, ” He told the Herald Sun just weeks after Ms Ristevski vanished.

“That’s my feeling, what with all the rumours going on about Anthony (Rickard).

“She’s been going overseas to America and Hong Kong each month for the past 10 years on business, and I’m told it’s fairly easy to get a false passport.

“I did put the rumours (about Mr Rickard) to Borce, but he said Karen’s not here to answer them. I don’t think she will come back, I reckon she’s gone for good.”

The many odd behaviours of Karen Ristevski’s family

The rumour that ant posted to facebook (re he and Karen) may end up not seeing the light of day at trial.
Seems if ant takes the stand shisha or illegal version, may well be raised though ...imo
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Unfortunately, in these types of trials, trashing of the victim and the victim's reputation is generally par for the course. And then it is splashed all over MSM.

As if it somehow makes the victim more murderable, diminshes the alleged actions of the 'poor defendant'. But it is done, I believe, to assist the defence - who are going for manslaughter as a second choice (after a first choice of not guilty, of course).

As far as I am concerned, it only helps to perpetuate the domestic violence that occurs in this country.
 
sosocurious said:
Does anyone think ant will not even be called as a witness at the trial?
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He is so unreliable!!.. he has to be shot full of downers to appear, then shot full of uppers to testify!...

I just cant see it, myself. Certainly, he threw out the challenge from day one, Dad did it. But if his claim can't be backed by empirical evidence, convincing evidence, not just Ant's feelings and hopes, then the prosecution may find they are better off without him.

Would the defence call him.?... well . stranger things have happened in trials... they may call him as a demonstration of the hard yakka Borce has had to put up with in regard to family over the years....
 
Trooper said:
He is so unreliable!!.. he has to be shot full of downers to appear, then shot full of uppers to testify!...

I just cant see it, myself. Certainly, he threw out the challenge from day one, Dad did it. But if his claim can't be backed by empirical evidence, convincing evidence, not just Ant's feelings and hopes, then the prosecution may find they are better off without him.

Would the defence call him.?... well . stranger things have happened in trials... they may call him as a demonstration of the hard yakka Borce has had to put up with in regard to family over the years....
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I have been pondering that myself.
Why Sarah didn't slip in an argument or two being related to the self confessed ice addict half brother. Instead of just the Arnott's snacks and Karen being upset about kids licking windows at the store and the fortnightly discontent over finances?
 
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sosocurious said:
I have been pondering that myself.
Why Sarah didn't slip in an argument or two being related to the self confessed ice addict half brother. Instead of just the Arnott's snacks and kids licking windows at the store and finances?
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because,, surely, SoSo…. surely , surely, there must have been f.r.i.c.t.i.o.n , of a particularly virulent nature once Ant started his claims of Karen and he being lovers, and them both moving on together when Sarah turned 21..

It simply flies in the face of all reason to pretend that kind of claim in a family doesn't result in , at the very least, a smack across someone's chops, if only once..

You don't keep sipping your Rakija and inhaling your shisha when that one lands into the conversation pool.
 
Trooper said:
He's playing out an old vendetta, Karen's murder is the culmination of it, maybe....
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It would be interesting to know, how did AR exactly plan to reveal the "family secret" and with whom: only with his father or with Karen and his father or with Karen, father and half sister? Did he expect a full apology (from whom for what?) or did he expect the blessing of his father to an official liaison between him and Karen? - In any case, AR urgently wanted to clear something very important to himself (whether important for anybody else, would be very secondary).
I think, AR had recognized in 2016, that his life was no longer bearable and he had to bring order in it, if he didn't want to end by drug overdose. IF AR indeed ever got once a firm promise to be together with Karen after Sarah's 21st birthday, then the letter re the family secret was due just then.
The Rs just at the same time had barely manageable problems even without an entreaty for clearing a family secret (money, the million $ home, debts, heritage, founding new companies, closing existing companies, etc.). Because his father showed no sign of having financial problems to the outside world, AR will not have learned of it in detail. Maybe he wouldn't have cared about the inappropriate time of his letter. After Karen's death he thought differently. - Of course all IMO and MOO.
 
Witnesses spotted car like Karen Ristevski's near where her body was found, court hears

"I didn't really think it would be a local because it's so infrequent that I ever meet a car there … and it's really clean and it should have mud on it if it was coming out of a local road.
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Could BR have taken the car to be washed at Ant's place after disposing of Karen's body? Someone (sorry, not sure who) posted the forensics team did find clumps of mud underside of the vehicle, this leads me to think BR didn't use an automatic car wash.
-----
Other damning evidence by a witness from court in the same article -

A former employee at Ms Ristevski's fashion business, Diana Nastoska, testified that she had been concerned when Ms Ristevski failed to turn up at work on the day she disappeared because she was "always punctual" and that Mr Ristevski had sounded surprised when she rang to tell him.

"He assumed that she was there already so he wasn't sure what was going on," Ms Nastoska said.
Click to expand...

BR claims Karen left in a huff to 'clear her head' with $850 cash in her purse and clutch bag, no shoes and no vehicle so how did she manage to turn up to work? Why even attempt at feigning surprise, why didn't he just say a problem had cropped up and he'd get back to Ms Nastoska? BR was playing for time and he's obviously a consummate liar.

Ms Nostoska believed this was a 'happy family'. Imo, BR and Karen had perfected the appearance of the happy family. Karen remarked BR was a 'caring supportive' husband. This may have once been true... or not, but would staff know the goings on in their employer's private life and when cracks finally did appear, like Karen complaining about BR, it was already too late?
Witnesses spotted Mercedes near where Karen Ristevski's body was found, court hears
 
SouthAussie said:
Unfortunately, in these types of trials, trashing of the victim and the victim's reputation is generally par for the course. And then it is splashed all over MSM.

As if it somehow makes the victim more murderable, diminshes the alleged actions of the 'poor defendant'. But it is done, I believe, to assist the defence - who are going for manslaughter as a second choice (after a first choice of not guilty, of course).

As far as I am concerned, it only helps to perpetuate the domestic violence that occurs in this country.
Click to expand...
That is a very intelligent insight SA. Domestic violence is absolutely perpetuated in these circumstances, including when family members jump on board to try and justify what happened. If family members aren't charged with perjury IF THEY KNEW WHAT HAPPENED and choose to lie, they will "exist" with a very heavy conscience for the rest if their lives IMO. Eventually when the penny drops for them, it will be too late to clear their conscience.
 
sosocurious said:
Does anyone think ant will not even be called as a witness at the trial?
Click to expand...
SoSo IMO I believe he was either found medically unfit to give evidence OR he was in a position where there was a high risk of incriminating himself regarding drug use.

I am also wondering if Karen may have said to Ant in his younger years that if she decided to leave BR she would take him and SR with her. Usually when someone plans on leaving a marriage it will be verbalised during arguments more often than not, if so household members would be aware of this. IMO
 
they'll get you said:
I think BR is a flight risk and if he couldn't raise the funds for bail then I doubt he'd be able to now.
I'm remaining hopeful on that.
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I'm with TGY. Besides maybe having one of Vlasko's 'false passports, so easy to get' stashed away somewhere, he may be a dual citizen with a Macedonian passport.

Plus, he is looking at, should he be found guilty ( which is a lot more that 50/50 , it's more 80/20 ) a sentence of , on average for wife murderers in Victoria , 28 long weary years, with parole set at no earlier than 24 .

Enough to make any man run,, even to Skopje.. .

No bail.. I'll be so cross.
 
Wasn't it Patricia Gray who said "discarded like a piece of rubbish"

"The paper said Borce’s theory was revealed as another family member, Patricia Gray, said she believed the 47-year-old woman had been murdered and “discarded like a piece of rubbish.”


Article from August 2016
Missing mum's husband told family evil stranger abducted his wife
 
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