AZ AZ - Bullhead City, WhtFem UP11087, 17-19, shallow grave vacant lot, purse, clothes, May'89

[iamshadow21]

I want to bring this match to attention. Note that I DID NOT MAKE THIS MATCH but a friend of mine did. They kindly let me post it here to get some more opinions. Could she be Faye Self?

	Faye Self MP1370	"Castleberry Kate" UP11087
Sex	Female	Female
Race	White/Caucasian	White/Caucasian
Age	26	17-19
Height	5'0"-5'2"	5'5"-5'9"
Weight	100-110lbs	Unknown
DOD/DLC	March 31, 1983	1979-1987
Hair Color	Naturally brown but was bleached blond.	Brown. Some was bleached
Eye Color	Gray	Unknown
Distinctive Features	Upper denture plate (from CP)	Partial denture plate (Unknown where?)
Circumstances	Last seen at a bar with a friend and two men.	Found in Bullhead City.
Distance	Coushatta-Bullhead	1,380 miles (20hr 14min)

Now time to explain the things that are off that can be explained. Location can't but I can try explaining Age and Height. I have seen the age be off by 10 years in similar cases (Anne Papalardo-Blake) and for height both Kate's and Faye's seem to be estimated. Faye's height is ranged which you normally don't see in MP cases. The fact that both had dental plates and possibly bleached hair stunned me. Let me know what you think though!

I think the age range is pretty far off, but we don't know how they judged it first time around. If Kate was estimated based on her wisdom teeth just erupting, then I think Faye might be far too old. The heights are pretty different, too, but I know there is some wiggle room when the remains are skeletal. I just don't know if there's up to nine inches of wiggle room. DOD/DLC is good, though, as is the hair.

 

[SimsGuy67]

I think the age range is pretty far off, but we don't know how they judged it first time around. If Kate was estimated based on her wisdom teeth just erupting, then I think Faye might be far too old. The heights are pretty different, too, but I know there is some wiggle room when the remains are skeletal. I just don't know if there's up to nine inches of wiggle room. DOD/DLC is good, though, as is the hair.

9 inches? The shortest Kate could be according to investigators is 5'5" which is only 3 inches. Wisdom teeth also erupt between 17 and 25 so they couldn't have fully based it on wisdom teeth.

 

[iamshadow21]

9 inches? The shortest Kate could be according to investigators is 5'5" which is only 3 inches. Wisdom teeth also erupt between 17 and 25 so they couldn't have fully based it on wisdom teeth.

The nine inches was between Kate's max height and Faye's min height, sorry. I should have been clearer.

 

[iamshadow21]

I want to bring this match to attention. Note that I DID NOT MAKE THIS MATCH but a friend of mine did. They kindly let me post it here to get some more opinions. Could she be Faye Self?

	Faye Self MP1370	"Castleberry Kate" UP11087
Sex	Female	Female
Race	White/Caucasian	White/Caucasian
Age	26	17-19
Height	5'0"-5'2"	5'5"-5'9"
Weight	100-110lbs	Unknown
DOD/DLC	March 31, 1983	1979-1987
Hair Color	Naturally brown but was bleached blond.	Brown. Some was bleached
Eye Color	Gray	Unknown
Distinctive Features	Upper denture plate (from CP)	Partial denture plate (Unknown where?)
Circumstances	Last seen at a bar with a friend and two men.	Found in Bullhead City.
Distance	Coushatta-Bullhead	1,380 miles (20hr 14min)

Now time to explain the things that are off that can be explained. Location can't but I can try explaining Age and Height. I have seen the age be off by 10 years in similar cases (Anne Papalardo-Blake) and for height both Kate's and Faye's seem to be estimated. Faye's height is ranged which you normally don't see in MP cases. The fact that both had dental plates and possibly bleached hair stunned me. Let me know what you think though!

I just went to the Charley Project page for Faye. I don't see the resemblance with the pic in the post you made with the blonde hair (though I understand why you chose it!) but I CAN see a resemblance with some of the other photos they have up there to the reconstruction of Kate. It's strange how different photos make people look vastly different, even though it's the same individual.

It says on Charley that Faye had at least one kid and had had a hysterectomy. Do we have any information on whether Kate potentially had been pregnant or had children?

 

[SimsGuy67]

I just went to the Charley Project page for Faye. I don't see the resemblance with the pic in the post you made with the blonde hair (though I understand why you chose it!) but I CAN see a resemblance with some of the other photos they have up there to the reconstruction of Kate. It's strange how different photos make people look vastly different, even though it's the same individual.

It says on Charley that Faye had at least one kid and had had a hysterectomy. Do we have any information on whether Kate potentially had been pregnant or had children?

Don't think so.... it doesn't say she could or couldn't have had children. Probably didn't look into it as she was estimated to be young.

 

[iamshadow21]

Don't think so.... it doesn't say she could or couldn't have had children. Probably didn't look into it as she was estimated to be young.

Shame. It'd be useful to know, just for ruling in/ruling out looking at misper reports. If they checked the bones for growth plates, breaks, etc, they would have checked for the pitting that shows up with pregnancy/birth if they had the pelvis. I think it's standard practice to check on presumed female remains over the age of puberty, because it can be so important in determining identity. I'm sure they probably noted it in the autopsy, it's just not publicly available for us to see.

 

[John/Jane Doe]

I want to bring this match to attention. Note that I DID NOT MAKE THIS MATCH but a friend of mine did. They kindly let me post it here to get some more opinions. Could she be Faye Self?

	Faye Self MP1370	"Castleberry Kate" UP11087
Sex	Female	Female
Race	White/Caucasian	White/Caucasian
Age	26	17-19
Height	5'0"-5'2"	5'5"-5'9"
Weight	100-110lbs	Unknown
DOD/DLC	March 31, 1983	1979-1987
Hair Color	Naturally brown but was bleached blond.	Brown. Some was bleached
Eye Color	Gray	Unknown
Distinctive Features	Upper denture plate (from CP)	Partial denture plate (Unknown where?)
Circumstances	Last seen at a bar with a friend and two men.	Found in Bullhead City.
Distance	Coushatta-Bullhead	1,380 miles (20hr 14min)

Now time to explain the things that are off that can be explained. Location can't but I can try explaining Age and Height. I have seen the age be off by 10 years in similar cases (Anne Papalardo-Blake) and for height both Kate's and Faye's seem to be estimated. Faye's height is ranged which you normally don't see in MP cases. The fact that both had dental plates and possibly bleached hair stunned me. Let me know what you think though!

Here is Faye Self's thread:

LA - LA - Faye Self, 26, Armistead, 30 March 1983

25 years ago... ----------------------------- Faye Aline Self Missing since March 30, 1983 from Armistead, Red River Parish, Louisiana. Classification: Missing Vital Statistics Date Of Birth: October 18, 1956 Age at Time of Disappearance: 26 years old Height and Weight at Time of...

www.websleuths.com

 

[SimsGuy67]

Kerry Johnson is not Castleberry Kate. She was excluded via dentals as she had no dental plates. Here is a quoted email:
"Hello! The panel did recently review the PM submission for 150DFOR and 1329UFAZ. We are declining to pursue it any further due to dental inconsistencies. Anecdotal data for Kerry states no orthodontic treatment and minimal dental. The UP has a partial plate which would not be considered minimal, especially for a 17 year old. Would love to see this one solved for sure."

 

[John/Jane Doe]

I was looking and I found 2 possible matches for Castleberry Kate, I would like to know what you think:

Mary Jo Lee Long
3148DFCA - Mary Jo Lee Long

Julia Vita Salucka

736DFMO - Julia Vita Salucka

www.doenetwork.org

 

[iamshadow21]

I was looking and I found 2 possible matches for Castleberry Kate, I would like to know what you think:

Mary Jo Lee Long
3148DFCA - Mary Jo Lee Long

Julia Vita Salucka

736DFMO - Julia Vita Salucka

www.doenetwork.org

Visually, Mary looks good. Julia's bold makeup makes it harder to see the contours of her face. The hair, with Julia in the photo, is a good match. Both have dentals on record, so should be able to be compared. Neither mention a plate, and Julia, at least, obviously had dental care if she had a retainer, so you'd think a plate would be in her records. Both are in the age range. Close on the height, but the Doe is skeletal, so that's going to have a big degree of estimation, so that's fine. Last seen/PMI is good. Neither Doe is from Arizona, but we've seen people driven across state lines plenty of times before.

I don't think there's a problem with submitting them if you feel strongly, but my personal expectation (very much MOO) is that they'll be quickly ruled out on dentals. But then, if they are, we'll know.

 

[summergirl1]

I couldn't find any info about another body being found in the yard, identified or not.
Two bodies is definitely not a coincidence and could hold clues as who did this and who these people were.

 

[summergirl1]

It's interesting she had a purse, but no ID. Probably the killer removed it. It's too bad there isn't more info on her clothes and purse, as it would help like with dating how long her remains had been there.

 

[John/Jane Doe]

Have you ever considered Mary Colette Rawlinson as a possible match for Castleberry Kate?

1159DFCA - Mary Colette Rawlinson

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

CA - CA - Mary Colette Rawlinson, 19, San Diego, 30 Oct 1985

Case File 1159DFCA Mary Colette Rawlinson Missing since October 30, 1985 from San Diego, San Diego County, California. Classification: Missing Vital Statistics Date Of Birth: October 23, 1966 Age at Time of Disappearance: 19 years old Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance...

www.websleuths.com

 

[Tallulah. Lakkey]

I couldn't find any info about another body being found in the yard, identified or not.
Two bodies is definitely not a coincidence and could hold clues as who did this and who these people were.

The second body never made the paper but I assure you my yard was torn up. Most bodies found or missing people never make the news or the paper here. My favorite is when they cant avoid it, it is written off as spontaneous combustion or some other bs. Can't go and scare off the tourists.

 

[Bit of hope]

The second body never made the paper but I assure you my yard was torn up. Most bodies found or missing people never make the news or the paper here. My favorite is when they cant avoid it, it is written off as spontaneous combustion or some other bs. Can't go and scare off the tourists.

Your post makes me laugh about the spontaneous combustion. I think maybe BS-city is more appropriate.

 

[Susikatze]

Several years back she had insufficient DNA for profiling.
That sounds like Othram could do something about that.
@othram

 

[Tallulah. Lakkey]

Your post makes me laugh about the spontaneous combustion. I think maybe BS-city is more appropriate.

That exactly what most people say, not just locals either.

 

[theshadow45]

“Kate” has been unidentified for 34 years today.

 

[HmmMysterious]

I found a possible candidate, but this is mostly based on the possible route the missing person's Greyhound Bus took. That is if she even got on the bus. Her name is Gwendolyn Susie King.

<modsnip - not an approved source>

Comparison between King and Kate

• King stood 5'2"-5'4" vs Kate who's estimated height is 5'5"-5'7"
• King had red/auburn hair vs Kate had brown hair
• King was 16 when she vanished vs Kate was around 17-19 when she died
• King vanished in 1982 vs Kate is estimated to have died between 1979-1987

 

[HmmMysterious]

Here are the locations of the Greyhound Bus and where Kate was found. Not too far away from each other