AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #18

[GrainneDhu]

right, the question was for the speculation that it was doubtful a stranger would have walked by the SC sleeping on the couch-- I wanted some input on where those posters might imagine SC sleeping on the couch, and where the a perp would not have walked by if there was a perp lol
sorry to be so confusing.
I am just confused today.

IMO if there was a stranger abduction, he could have come in Isa's window and carried her out the living room front door and out the front gate, if SC was on the DEN couch and the perp would not have walked by him..

I'm assuming that Isabel's bedroom is the middle room on the left hand side of the house.

If the perp came in from outside, I think it was through the garage which has been mentioned in the past as frequently open. In which case, the perp would walk through the bathroom, through the gap between the kitchen and breakfast nook, diagonally across the living room and into Isabel's room.

I had assumed that SC meant he was asleep on a sofa in the room in the middle labelled "Family Room" against the wall shared with Isa's bedroom. Then I looked at the room marked "Den" and realised that it also shares a wall with Isa's room and the sofa could be against that wall.

If the sofa was in the Family Room, then the perp walked past Sergio. Bold and scary but obviously not impossible because other perps have done the same thing. Since SC fell asleep with the TV on, the TV may have provided enough ambient noise to cover up stealthy movement.

If the sofa was in the Den, then the perp didn't even have to walk by SC. Just go across the living room into Isa's room. Again, since SC fell asleep with the TV on, the TV could have provided enough ambient noise to cover up quiet movements.

On a slight tangent: since the advent of DNA databases, it has been rather disturbing how many convicts for burglary have been discovered to be rapists. It seems pretty clear now that for some percentage of rapists, burglary is apparently a training exercise. At the very least, there is clearly an overlapping skill set.

 

[mck16]

I thought she said "breezeway", but not 100% sure.

There is a patch of land from the side of the neighbor's house to the Celis' wall. This might be four feet wide at the most. Although, this small piece of land would actually belong to the homeowner, maybe, people cut through that property to get to the alley-way.

I have a breezeway on both sides of my home, and at times, teens cut through to get over to the street behind me.

Breezeway is what the girl called it that reported the voices at 6 a.m. I believe. I was just remembering what Anita said in her post that she observed when she went out there. jmo

 

[liz b.]

I thought she said "breezeway", but not 100% sure.

There is a patch of land from the side of the neighbor's house to the Celis' wall. This might be four feet wide at the most. Although, this small piece of land would actually belong to the homeowner, maybe, people cut through that property to get to the alley-way.

I have a breezeway on both sides of my home, and at times, teens cut through to get over to the street behind me.

I remember her saying "breezeway " she also said that no one should really be there,because it is part of their property. But then she did say that when she first woke up, and heard the men's voices, she assumed it was just someone taking a walk ???

 

[winterrose]

Reposting the little I found on fundraising from earlier today. Usually vigils bring in money, last nights looked like a large amount of people.

Thank you so much, I've also seen other posts on the fb Find Isabel where places are giving discounts so it goes to donations.

 

[Patty G]

Based on what SC said about sleeping so close,on the other side of her bderoom wall, words to that effect, I *think* that would mean he was watching tv in the den, then fell asleep there ?

But, I guess RC could still have seen him in the morning...

I do remember reading a report that a colleague of RC said that she arrived at work "very early " that morning... I'm sure the colleague told LE exactly when he remembered seeing her ? From what I read,it sounded like he was saying she got there earlier than she usually would, but IDK, cannot find the link for it...MOO

But he stated living room.

I recall the colleague indicating RC arrived at work very early that morning. It is at the 1:51 marker. Video is dated 4/25/12

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/missing-tucson-girl-fbi-steps-involvement-isabel-celis-16208983

 

[mamamia54]

I'm assuming that Isabel's bedroom is the middle room on the left hand side of the house.

If the perp came in from outside, I think it was through the garage which has been mentioned in the past as frequently open. In which case, the perp would walk through the bathroom, through the gap between the kitchen and breakfast nook, diagonally across the living room and into Isabel's room.

I had assumed that SC meant he was asleep on a sofa in the room in the middle labelled "Family Room" against the wall shared with Isa's bedroom. Then I looked at the room marked "Den" and realised that it also shares a wall with Isa's room and the sofa could be against that wall.

If the sofa was in the Family Room, then the perp walked past Sergio. Bold and scary but obviously not impossible because other perps have done the same thing. Since SC fell asleep with the TV on, the TV may have provided enough ambient noise to cover up stealthy movement.

If the sofa was in the Den, then the perp didn't even have to walk by SC. Just go across the living room into Isa's room. Again, since SC fell asleep with the TV on, the TV could have provided enough ambient noise to cover up quiet movements.

On a slight tangent: since the advent of DNA databases, it has been rather disturbing how many convicts for burglary have been discovered to be rapists. It seems pretty clear now that for some percentage of rapists, burglary is apparently a training exercise. At the very least, there is clearly an overlapping skill set.

I agree with you on all points and possibilities, however the parents still haven't been cleared.

 

[GrainneDhu]

nope. we don't know who of the 5 went to bed at what time nor where. SC, BC, and LE have never answered that question. come to think of it, i'm not sure it was ever asked.

i believe at this point (subject to change) that BC left that night, judging from their statements on the 911.

Dispatcher: Okay. Is mom there also?
Sergio: Uh, she had just left for work, I just called her and I told her to get her butt home. (chuckles)

she had just left for work when?...when you found isa missing (at 6:30am?) or had just left for work when you spoke to her on the phone as she was leaving a relative's house?

Q – So who, who noticed her gone, your husband?
A2 – My husband, I went to work this morning at seven and um, I just, and I didn't even come and check on her, I should have come and checked on her.

come, meaning, back to the house, IMO. i'm not a statement analyzer but these two quotes really stand out for me.

this is all jmo...and like eileen, i'd like to know when the boys last saw her as well...

http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/story/18395708/celis-911-call-someone-broke-in-and-grabbed-her

BBM

My hearing is not great (I'm deaf in one ear). To me, when I listened to that tape, it sounded like RC said "I didn't even come and check on her, I should have gone and checked on her."

It sounded to me like she caught herself using not quite the correct English word and re-phrased it using the more correct "gone" rather than "come" and the correct tense (checked vs check).

But maybe I'm not hearing it correctly and she said "come" twice.

 

[panthera]

I can't see anywhere where there could be a public walkway beside the home except maybe thru the alley, which would run outside the parimeter of the walled in compound.

On the neighbor's side I am not seeing either where someone could walk from the street to the alley. What I can see though it appears there is a narrow area from the alley to where the neighbor's car is parked that someone could walk through. However, it may not be so if looking at it at ground level.

:waitasec:

MOO

 

[Patty G]

Keep in mind, that the Master Bedroom is behind the garage. So if the perp went through the garage, I would think he would have to open up the garage door, unless, there is a side door into the garage. Either way, the Master Bedroom is behind that garage, seperated by "maybe" a utility room, then bathroom, then Master Bedroom.

If RC stated the living room, then this is the room we should be working on to figure out how Isa got out of the house while RC is sleeping in the living room, not family room or den.

 

[white rabbit]

Why question that statement and not question that she said they took the window out of our house? It is plain to me she is speaking hysterically. I am not so sure her English is that good especially when excited. jmo

oh i DO question that statement. but that's something SC could have easily said to her, in his call urging her to get her arse home.

she could've re-stated what he had already told her regarding the window. what i cannot justify is that she said she'd looked everywhere when she had just arrived at the house.

her english is great. she could speak swahili as well for all we know.


(i agree with grainnedhu, i just can't keep up with the posts in case this has been responded to already lol)

 

[SmoothOperator]

WRT living room vs den vs family room.. while we have a specific statement we know for absolute certain was made bySergio as to what room he was in watching the game and fell asleep in.. as well as his stating that this room(living room) shared a wall with isa's bedroom.. the important detail needed that is unknown is that inlooking at the floor plans of the Celis home we haven't a clue what they call.. or label as the name of each of those rooms available and labeled on the floor plans.. the labeled rooms are not the Celis' that have each room labeled on these floor plans we are looking at.. therefore what the media has labeled as family room could in fact be labeled and called by the Celis family a den.. and so on and so forth same goes for all the different rooms and that what the media calls or labels them could be totally inaccurate.

 

[Patty G]

I video taped the interview when the neighbor was showing the wall, and talking to the reporter. It was either Nancy or Jane. Now is someone can recall the date, I will go and find the video and post it, so the area of land/grass between the two house is shown.

 

[GrainneDhu]

If I have no power in my house, I first go to my breaker box, if all is well, then I call the Power Company, and check with my neighbor to see if they have power. On my street, sometimes my side loses power, but across the street they still have power.

I would never go and check my electrical meter.

I would never go check the electrical meter either because I would not have the faintest clue if it was okay or broken or what. I'd be afraid that if I even touched it I might get the zap to end all zaps!

Just call me "the chicken homeowner."

 

[LaLaw2000]

I mean just that. They are focusing their investigation on SC (and probably somewhat on RC).

I think so also, Madeleine74, FWIW.

 

[Patty G]

WRT living room vs den vs family room.. while we have a specific statement we know for absolute certain was made bySergio as to what room he was in watching the game and fell asleep in.. as well as his stating that this room(living room) shared a wall with isa's bedroom.. the important detail needed that is unknown is that inlooking at the floor plans of the Celis home we haven't a clue what they call.. or label as the name of each of those rooms available and labeled on the floor plans.. the labeled rooms are not the Celis' that have each room labeled on these floor plans we are looking at.. therefore what the media has labeled as family room could in fact be labeled and called by the Celis family a den.. and so on and so forth same goes for all the different rooms and that what the media calls or labels them could be totally inaccurate.

Exactly, we have no clue.

I also feel that the room labeled Den on the generic floor plan, could be a bedroom (without closets) since there are three children. Not saying that the boys wouldn't share a room, but clearly they have enough rooms for the boys to have their own, all on that side of the house.

 

[gliving]

On the neighbor's side I am not seeing either where someone could walk from the street to the alley. What I can see though it appears there is a narrow area from the alley to where the neighbor's car is parked that someone could walk through. However, it may not be so if looking at it at ground level.

:waitasec:

MOO

http://www.hlntv.com/video/2012/04/26/missing-girls-neighbor-shows-nancy-home-isabel-celis

Here's a video of Alicia the neighbor showing the walkway between the houses.

ETA at 6:34 you can see the covered patio in the back of the home.

 

[FrayedKnot]

i asked that earlier....nobody had a response.... *shrug*

Yep. I asked about that several threads ago. Still wondering, lol.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ransom]

I video taped the interview when the neighbor was showing the wall, and talking to the reporter. It was either Nancy or Jane. Now is someone can recall the date, I will go and find the video and post it, so the area of land/grass between the two house is shown.

Nancy Grace speaks to a neighbor of missing Isabel Celis. - YouTube

 

[Lark2]

Cue the music, I feel another performance coming on...

 

[Patty G]

http://www.hlntv.com/video/2012/04/26/missing-girls-neighbor-shows-nancy-home-isabel-celis

Here's a video of Alicia the neighbor showing the walkway between the houses.

Thank you. Now everyone can see the breezeway between the neighbors home and the Celis' wall that leads to the alley-way.

Isa's bedroom window is very low to the ground.