Bosma Murder Trial 04.05.16 - Day 30

[Lochlynsmom]

molly hayes

The Walther PPK is approx 6 in long. Lightweight. Hard to describe it size wise Plath says bc there are both smaller and bigger guns #Bosma


testing

 

[matou]

So. Dungey mentions Hitler in his cross. Very interesting. JMO

 

[mozzagirl]

Court now seeing a blurry photo of a gun taken from a Blackberry that was recovered from Smich's residence. That photo hasn't been made a numbered exhibit in the case, so I don't have it to show it to you.
by Adam Carter 10:30 AM

Dungey notes there is no magazine. "That would mean this is a non-functioning gun without a magazine, correct?" Dungey says. Plath says no, this could be fired with a cartridge in the chamber.
by Adam Carter 10:31 AM

This gun looks to be a similar shape as the Walther PPK, but it's blurry (and appears to be taken in low light with a low-megapixel camera) so the writing is blurry and can't be made out.
by Adam Carter 10:32 AM

 

[mozzagirl]

sure I am just doing Adam Carter's blog, ya I am just copy and pasting

 

[Lochlynsmom]

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes · 3m3 minutes ago

There is no magazine. Dungey says you can't read text or markings on this. She agrees it's too blurry. #Bosma

 

[SnooperDuper]

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 1h1 hour ago
I am back at the Tim #Bosma murder trial today. We start at 10 a.m. #HamOnt

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 53m53 minutes ago
molly hayes Retweeted Hamilton Spectator
Back in court this morning as the #Bosma trial continues. Here's where we left off yesterday:

Hamilton SpectatorVerified account ‏@TheSpec
#Bosma trial: Mechanic accused of lying for boss Dellen Millard - latest from @mollyhayes http://bit.ly/1S77PLK

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 28m28 minutes ago
#Bosma court is full. Crown's evidence is reaching a crescendo. About a dozen witnesses left. Full story 6pm @CHCHNews Tweets til then

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 22m22 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Reporting in #HamOnt as #Bosma trial continues @CBCToronto

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 21m21 minutes ago
Jury is coming in and forensic firearms scientist Jennifer Plath is back on the stand. #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 22m22 minutes ago
Jury is back. Jennifer Plath (gun expert from CFS) still on the stand for cross-examination. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 21m21 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Gun expert on stand today via @CBCHamilton http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/tim-bosma-trial-gun-expert-to-testify-tuesday-1.3521024 … #BosmaTrial

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 21m21 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Lawyer for Smich is up, cross examination of gun expert #BosmaTrial

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 20m20 minutes ago
Dungey up. Going through her resume, asks if she ever took a course specifically on the Walther PPK pistol. No she has not. #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 20m20 minutes ago
Asks if she's fired one. She has, during her training. Can't remember how long ago. But says she is familiar with it. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 20m20 minutes ago
#Bosma jury is back. Gun expert Jennifer Plath under cross by #Smich lawyer Thomas Dungey @CHCHNews

 

[Lochlynsmom]

@susanclairmont · 5m5 minutes ago

Now looking at blurry photo of gun lying on a dark blanket. Resembles a Walther PPK, but can't read writing on this image.

 

[SnooperDuper]

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 20m20 minutes ago
He asks if she's given a lecture on it. She says they don't give lectures on specific guns. #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 20m20 minutes ago
She has never testified in a homicide trial before involving a Walther PPK. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 20m20 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
This is Smich's lawyer Thomas Dungey. A veteran lawyer known to get fiery in the courtroom #BosmaTrial
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CfSNTDYWEAASEEz.jpg

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 19m19 minutes ago
She says again that by photo alone she can't say if it's a functioning firearm or a replica, air soft, blank etc. #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 20m20 minutes ago
Jury has entered the courtroom. Jennifer Plath, the forensic firearms expert is being cross examined by Mark Smich lawyer Thomas Dungey.

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 19m19 minutes ago
Limited in what she can determine from a photo of a gun, she says. Can't tell if it's real and functioning.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 19m19 minutes ago
Dungey suggests it could be just a toy gun. Exactly, she says. Can't say without examining. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 19m19 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Follow us for updates from inside #BosmaTrial @ColinButlerCBC + @AdamCarterCBC Plus there's Adam's liveblog http://www.scribblelive.com/Event/The_Tim_Bosma_trial_April_5 …

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 19m19 minutes ago
"Could be just a toy gun," says Dungey. Plath agrees.

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 19m19 minutes ago
He's asking her about the Walther PPK and her experience with them. #TimBosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 18m18 minutes ago
A photograph can be altered. Dungey suggests. "You just don't know."
"No I don't," Plath agrees. #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 18m18 minutes ago
Plath agrees she can't tell the difference between the real thing and a toy from a photograph without examining the actual weapon. #TimBosma

 

[SnooperDuper]

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 18m18 minutes ago
Referencing the final photo we saw yesterday (not yet an exhibit), he says text markings were too blurry to read. She agrees. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 18m18 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Dungey is zeroing in on gun seen in photos found on accused's phones and computers #BosmaTrial

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 17m17 minutes ago
Dungey is referring to the weapon in one of the the photos as "the Millard gun." #TimBosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 17m17 minutes ago
Seeing photo of gun and hand that jury has learned is Millard's because of thumbprint match. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 17m17 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Court is now looking at a photo of a gun, a Walter PPK #BosmaTrial

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 17m17 minutes ago
Dellen now asking about the "Millard gun" photo (his print was deemed a match to finger visible in photo by print expert). #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 16m16 minutes ago
Gun in that photo has similarities to Walther PPK - words and font on gun are the same.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 16m16 minutes ago
Dungey asks what they look at specifically to determine what type a gun is. They look at font, and also actual wording, she says #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 16m16 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
It's a tightshot, all we see is a hand holding a gun marked 'Walter PPK,' over what appears to be blue jeans #BosmaTrial

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 16m16 minutes ago
Dungey says the reason he calls it "the Millard gun" is because police matched Dellen's print to the photo. #BosmaTrial

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 16m16 minutes ago
Now seeing close up of the magazine. How do you know it's functional? D asks. She points to spring visible through circular cutout. #Bosma

Alex Pierson ‏@AlexpiersonAMP 15m15 minutes ago
Jennifer plath on stand for cross in #TimBosma. She is a forensic gun expert. w/o actual gun she can't say if pic is real. @AM900CHML

 

[SnooperDuper]

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 15m15 minutes ago
On the "two finger gun" (photo w/ face partially visible in bckgrnd) she says there are no text markings visible. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 15m15 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Now we are seeing two images, side by side. On the left is a diagram of a gun. On the right is another tightshot... #BosmaTrial

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 14m14 minutes ago
Dungey is now comparing the Millard gun photo to the two finger gun photo suggesting there are far more tell tale markings on the former.

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 14m14 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
... Photo on the right is a tight shot, two fingers holding a gun. One finger has a tiny freckle. Gun partially covers a face. #BosmaTrial

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 14m14 minutes ago
Plath agrees Millard photo is clearer but says both guns could be excluded as being real.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 14m14 minutes ago
Dungey suggests without the font, it's complete speculation as to what the image is about. #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 14m14 minutes ago
"Without the markings, without the font it's nothing but complete speculation as to what it's about," he says. #TimBosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 14m14 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Smich's Lawyer: You wouldn't know if it was a toy gun, a replica...it's pure speculation. #BosmaTrial

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 14m14 minutes ago
Dungey comparing gun photos. Says ones linked to #Millard show more writing. Gun linked to #Smich bc of mole on finger = no PPK 9mm etc

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 14m14 minutes ago
Plath says it can't be excluded as a Walther PPK. D asks how it's possible to even say that without the text markings--main factors #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 13m13 minutes ago
Plath says "it can't be excluded as a Walther PPK," but could possibly a type of pellet gun or other firearm. #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 14m14 minutes ago
Dungey says photo of gun that may be in Smich's hand doesn't have enough detail for her to know if it is a real Walther PPK.

 

[mozzagirl]

Dungey is suggesting this is not a Walther PPK, based on the middle line of three lines of writing on the barrel of the gun. He says that line extends further.
by Adam Carter 10:33 AM

Plath notes that in the RCMP reference manual image of the PPK has a middle line that doesn't extend as far. "The second line is slightly indented to the writing on the third line," Plath says about the reference shot. On the Blackberry photo it looks like it might extend father, but Plath notes the image isn't clear and is at a different angle, so she can't say.
by Adam Carter 10:37 AM

"I would not be comfortable in saying," she says.
by Adam Carter 10:37 AM

 

[SnooperDuper]

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 13m13 minutes ago
She says they also look at design and features to see if there is agreement between a known firearm and an image. #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 12m12 minutes ago
Plath says "I can't exclude it from being a Walther." Dungey questions how she can say that since she has so little to go on. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 13m13 minutes ago
Dungey is trying to get witness to say #Millard gun photos are more credibly real, #Smich 2-finger photo harder to ID. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 12m12 minutes ago
THIS. http://fb.me/7SlfgtPHE

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 11m11 minutes ago
You don't have a pulled out magazine as you do in the Millard gun, Dungey says. She agrees. Says she's looking at features that ARE visible.

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 11m11 minutes ago
"The key factors, you don't have," says Dungey. She says features that are visible have "no obvious differences." #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 11m11 minutes ago
Plath says, "based on just an image I can't say whether that's an air pistol or some other type of firearm."

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 10m10 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Dungey: You have no indication from the image it's a workable gun, correct? Expert: Correct #BosmaTrial

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 10m10 minutes ago
"There are no obvious differences to say it's not a Walther PPK." Jennifer Plath, on so-called 2-finger gun. #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 10m10 minutes ago
Dungey stresses again she has no markings, no font, no indication it's a workable firearm. She agrees. #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 10m10 minutes ago
Dungey says in this photo she has only one side of "what is supposedly a gun." She agrees. Says both sides would provide more info #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 10m10 minutes ago
No Walther insignia in the photo. Can't see the ejection port.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 23m23 minutes ago
Dungey is asking how hard it is to identify a gun from a photo. "It could be just a toy gun?" She can't be sure without weapon in hand

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 18m18 minutes ago
Dungey asking if the "Millard gun" appears to be more real than the one in other photo that may include Smich's fingers.

Ann Brocklehurst ‏@AnnB03 2h2 hours ago
Thomas Dungey cross-examination of Shane Schlatman shows courtroom still beats social media for good old fashioned shaming #TimBosma trial

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 28m28 minutes ago
Smich lawyer Thomas Dungey doing cross. Asking about Plath's knowledge of Walther PPK gun. She has fired one before. #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 13m13 minutes ago
For example, Dungey points out the ejection port is not visible on the gun in this photo (one w partial face visible). #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 12m12 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Smich's Lawyer: Walter PPK is known as the James Bond gun #BosmaTrial

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 12m12 minutes ago
"How can you say that?" Dungey thunders. "You don't have the key factors." Can't see writing or magazine in 2-finger gun

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 12m12 minutes ago
This is the James Bond gun, Dungey days. Plath says yes it is. It's also the gun Hitler used to kill himself, Dungey says. Again yes. #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 12m12 minutes ago
Plath agrees the Walther PPK is famous because it's the same gun James Bond carries and the same weapon Adolph Hitler used to kill himself.

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 12m12 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Smich's Lawyer: Walter PPK was the same gun Hitler used to kill himself #BosmaTrial

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 12m12 minutes ago
the Walther PPK is the 'James Bond' gun, correct? Dungey asks.
Yes, Plath says. #Bosma

Alex Pierson ‏@AlexpiersonAMP 11m11 minutes ago
Walther ppk is best known as the "james bond" . Also same gun Hitler killed himself with. @AM900CHML #TimBosma

 

[mozzagirl]

"In the MIllard PPK, you have far more evidence because it's functional," Dungey says. "You see all the aspects of it."
by Adam Carter 10:39 AM


Millard is looking Smich up and down just after Dungey said that.
by Adam Carter 10:39 AM

 

[Lochlynsmom]

Looks like SnooperDuper has this under control :happydance:

 

[brightii]

:cupcake::cupcake::cupcake::cupcake: Cupcakes for the WS tweet team! :tyou:

All MOO. lol

 

[SnooperDuper]

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 12m12 minutes ago
Dungey has Plath agree PPK is "flashy James Bond gun, right? ...Same gun Hitler killed himself with." #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 12m12 minutes ago
Dungey: it's also the gun Hitler used to kill himself. Again Plath says she believes so yes. #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 12m12 minutes ago
Plath giving weight of gun in metric. Dungey: "What's that in terms of a pound?" Courtroom chuckles. #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 11m11 minutes ago
Dungey says Walther PPK used by James Bond.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 11m11 minutes ago
The Walther PPK is approx 6 in long. Lightweight. Hard to describe it size wise Plath says bc there are both smaller and bigger guns #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 9m9 minutes ago
Now seeing that latest photo of a gun. It is blurry and dark. Gun is lying on its side on what looks like a blanket or soft surface. #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 9m9 minutes ago
Now looking at blurry photo of gun lying on a dark blanket. Resembles a Walther PPK, but can't read writing on this image.

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 9m9 minutes ago
Plath doesn't agree with Dungey's suggestion that a gun without a magazine wouldn't be a functioning firearm or more likely to be a replica

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 9m9 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Now looking at third photo of a gun. #BosmaTrial

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 8m8 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Photo is blurry. Too blurry to read what's written on the gun #BosmaTrial

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 9m9 minutes ago
There is no magazine. Dungey says you can't read text or markings on this. She agrees it's too blurry. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 8m8 minutes ago
Looking at latest gun photo, blurry. Similar to PPK but etchings unreadable. #Bosma

 

[Ontario Mom]

"In the MIllard PPK, you have far more evidence because it's functional," Dungey says. "You see all the aspects of it."
by Adam Carter 10:39 AM


Millard is looking Smich up and down just after Dungey said that.
by Adam Carter 10:39 AM

His courtroom conduct is getting really old. As in, carbon-dated, fossil old. :gaah:

 

[Typhoo1961]

So. Dungey mentions Hitler in his cross. Very interesting. JMO

Well if anyone needs to be compared to Hitler, it's DM.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 7m7 minutes ago
Dungey suggests it's not a Walther PPK because writing doesn't line up with photo on known Walther PPK. Plath says may be camera angle.

Alex Pierson ‏@AlexpiersonAMP 7m7 minutes ago
Dungey; "I'm going to suggest this gun isn't a Walther PPK. The middle line doesn't match." Jury sees image from smichs ipad @AM900CHML

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 5m5 minutes ago
We're listening to a lot of back and forth about the printing in the guns. At issue is a space of about half a character in size.

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 5m5 minutes ago
Plath now having a hard time comparing a blurry gun photo with a picture of a Walther PPK from the RCMP identification guide. #TimBosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 4m4 minutes ago
"To me they're on par," says Plath, to the frustration of Dungey who suggests there is a difference.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 3m3 minutes ago
Dungey trying to get Plath to say text lines on this latest photo appear different (in terms of indentation) than database photo of PPK.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 3m3 minutes ago
She says she cannot say. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 3m3 minutes ago Newmarket, Ontario
Millard gives Smich a long stare down, as Smich's lawyer discusses two guns seen in photos #BosmaTrial

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 2m2 minutes ago
Dungey now pressing home that there are far more indicators in the Millard gun photo than the blurry Blackberry gun photos. #TimBosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 2m2 minutes ago
Going back to Millard gun photo. Plath asked if writing is identical with known Walther PPK. Plath says they are in agreement.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 1m1 minute ago
Dungey asks if there was anything about comparing photographs in her training. She says no, they typically compare physical objects. #Bosma

Shannon Martin ‏@ShannonMartinTV 1m1 minute ago Newmarket, Ontario
Gun Expert: Typically we examine physical objects #BosmaTrial