CA - 13 victims, ages 2 to 29, shackled in home by parents, Perris, 15 Jan 2018 #5

[Deleted member 158085]

Her interview today seems to be different in terms of amount/years of contact than her earlier interviews.

Regarding some of the time frames changing in stories - this does not bother me. I come from a dysfunctional family, I moved away, and I had limited contact with my father for about 5 years. I had regularly flown or driven home, though, over the last 20 years to be by my father's side through multiple health crises.

Now the one where I was told over the phone that he was permanently paralyzed and dying of cancer at one of the best hospitals in the nation, you would think I could remember the year that happened, especially considering all the snafus surrounding this trip. But earlier this year I realized that it was about 15 years ago, but I had been referring to it as 10 years ago. I am terrible about time. But I also know that all kinds of details get forgotten and mixed up when families are apart. When my siblings and I discuss past events, we do not agree, we routinely have moments where we go, OMG I forgot about that! And that's on reasonably recent events, and ones you would think are memorable.

Not only that, but sometimes it takes a while to realize that something that didn't stand out in your mind at the time was actually significantly linked to some greater situation.

I'm also not certain how much of what was going on should have registered with LT's siblings. We haven't talked about it, but it's DT's brother who actually went to Disneyland with the family. He's highly educated, president of a college, supposedly very Christian, married with two kids, and he spent actual time in the presence of these kids, yet apparently did nothing, and seems to be in hiding now, even taking a leave of absence from work.

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[Deleted member 158085]

Someone mentioned yesterday that the photo was taken in a Target store.

Does Target have carpet?

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[Margo/Mom]

From today show link:

Sister also said DT drove LT to AL to hook up with some man they met. Went back to same hotel room and bed some time later and slept together.

That may help explain vow renewals (if you believe her).

That's new to me. Is LT competing with her sister or just one-upping her rebellion? So many strange dynamics...

Among the family dynamics is that the two sisters who have interviewed have the look of being a second family. Big age gap between LT and them, and they are closer in age. Not necessarily strange. But still the kind of thing you see in a second marriage--and there is no suggestion that this is the case.

 

[December]

They only lived in the brick home from 1999 to 4/2004. That when purchased double wide. So maybe they had bad plumbing it appears so in photos current owner showed. Mr. Baldwin acknowledged that the home had had contents removed and took him months and a lot of money to be able to rent out.

I have extended family in Texas and depending where the brick home may have been on well water. Possible double wide hooked to city water if available. I am not giving pass just trying to be logical when possible. One article said they had couple sets of bunk beds in double wide.

Re one interview guy was speaking of heard one daughter was asking about how to get a dl and mentioned age "10 or 12"years old. Not knowing there were children who were adult by then. He is going by hearsay. Media exploiting this horrible situation makes me angry.

I am not talking about her neighbor at the house you're referring to. I am talking about someone who went to third grade with her.

 

[mom2tee]

Everybody keeps saying it's target, but Target doesn't have carpet, does it? At first I thought it was the front desk of a doctor's office, but then I thought I saw something on the wall that looked like something from a hairdresser. Still, it looks like the front desk somewhere to me, and not a concrete store.

<Emerges from shadows to offer expert Target advice>

In my humble professional Target shopper opinion, that is a Target. And I think those are chip reading card machines. My Target has carpet in the Customer Service area (which this appears to be).

 

[bestill]

:waitasec:
if the last time they were in Vegas was 2015, there is a picture of ALL 13 kids including the baby. So if the above pic that looks like she is pregnant in poss Oct 2013, there is a child unaccounted for...RIGHT?? My brain is blowing, so I may be completely wrong here.

This is what I'm thinking. She does look pregnant in that photo.

 

[Midge Montana]

I believe it was a Target, MOO.
You can see the 'weekly ad' hung in the window in front of her.
I looked up that warning sign and it seems like it has to be posted in any place that sells alcohol that is not to be consumed on the premises.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Not trying to dictate to anyone how to speculate or what about, but hearing people wonder over and over again if any of the daughters/sons were mother/father to the 2 yr old leaves me even more horrified by this story than I already am.

There is no solid reason to think that really happened, or that LT would have been incapable of having the baby herself. Many women have a later-in-life baby after a period of not having any, no matter how many they have had, or how often. Why not LT?

There is no charge of rape. Lewd acts means touch. Those survivors were doing all they could to just stay alive - who really, honestly believes that any one of the daughters could have made it through pregnancy and delivery on next to NO body fat? In an emaciated condition?

Who honestly believes LT would have allowed one of her daughters to be pregnant, when that was clearly LT's favorite pastime? I think she would have more likely killed a pregnant daughter, rather than give up HER role in the family. I don't believe she would have accepted a baby from one of her older daughters, either. She hated them too much. We have seen photos of LT pregnant. IMO, she is clearly the mother of the youngest.

Without further proof that there is solid reason to believe that one of the children either mothered or fathered that baby, please let it go. Please. These kids do not need that.

I agree. In the Sherin Mathews case we were told by the mods not to take the thread there in terms of potential molestation without any proof (and there ended up being none). Now here, we have the lewd acts thing, but I wish we would not speculate beyond that. Taking DNA could be for a variety of reasons, but until LE says anything, I think we should not speculate on actual incest, especially pointing out the survivor # someone may suspect. Even without names, know who it is people are referring to.

I don't want to revictimize them if they someday read this thread.

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[verbonica]

LT pregnant here, but not sure what the year is. Any guesses? I put a heart on the faces on those

I think are minors.

It's also possible that they went to Vegas more times than just the wedding renewals that we know about. This photo could be late 2014, and she was pregnant with the born-in-early 2015 baby?

 

[Pug09]

It's also possible that they went to Vegas more times than just the wedding renewals that we know about. This photo could be late 2014, and she was pregnant with the born-in-early 2015 baby?

Very good point

 

[kimlynn]

If true about the swinger allegations, I think it lends credence to the BPD theory for LT. We've seen she lost gobs of weight at some point and opened a Facebook profile in her maiden name. Despite her "stable" marriage, she seems to have reinvented herself multiple times.

First at 16 as a new bride to her smart, older, handsome husband. Then at 20 with a baby. Later a homesteading homemaker in TX then a ritzy housewife in CA.

She probably adored that baby at first and maybe couldn't imagine another. Maybe she even dreamt of escape at that point. Especially once baby #1 got tedious (terrible 2s and 3s and all). But then controlling & narcissistic husband makes demands on sex and she feels trapped by #2. Only to find that pregnancy & baby is exciting the 2nd time too. And after exerting his control, he's doting on her again. She tires more quickly of #2 and with pregnancy #3, #1 & #2 are neglected more and more. He's losing control and starts insisting on better "discipline" & budgeting. She discovers quiverfull thinking which allows her to keep having kids and be ok with both the fundamentalist patriarchy and Disney. They get the farm, but she doesn't magically become a good homemaker. More babies, more neglect and continued abuse of older kids. He's losing control and requires more discipline. Somewhere the budgeting goes out the window. Right around the 10 year gap in kids. Did the novelty finally wear off? Did DT put his foot down, no more kids?

Another reinvention. A move to CA. Weight loss. Maybe she cheated on him and to keep control she manipulates him to believe they'd benefit from an open marriage. Only after he goes through with it he has to exert control by recreating this scene to right the wrong. Do we know if the alleged Alabama trip is during the 2011-2015 timeframe?

I do see many self destructive behaviors from LT, even if she wasn't a "cutter". I bet she did split and rage and then apologize and put the kids on a pedestal. Oh, honey, I'm so sorry, I bought you this toy while I was out, too bad I'm crazy as $#@& and have decided you've now done something to not deserve it again.

I do see volatility in her relationships, even though she's remained married (hoarding, moving, bankruptcy). I see magical thinking (Disney, Elvis, the staged pics, running away from trashed houses). I see emotional disregulation. And I see him putting up and/or going along until he has reached his own delusional or psychotic breaking point. Where a more normal person would end the relationship, he exerts abusive control.

I'm not an expert. I should probably step away from this for awhile. All my opinion.

Sister gave a time frame of 2008 to 2010 for the Alabama trip. She said LT was 40 or around 40.

 

[arkansasmimi]

I agree. I think they left Texas because he was either laid off from his job in Fort Worth or was transferred to California. They were dependent on that good government contractor paycheck.

A layoff would explain the foreclosure and bankruptcy. He had a new job in California at the time they filed for BK, but they were so far in arrears and default on their debts that they needed to file BK to get a fresh start.

And they kept all three veh in the Ch 7 so driving from Texas to CA, curious if towed? Since they had such a huge amount of credit card balances, it interesting reading the Ch 7 open minded, they may not have taken a whole lot with them . Bought more in CA. That was a lot to move across the country. Plus 3 vehicles.

 

[Yellow Rose]

Target stores DO have some carpet

 

[CatLady84]

Personally, I'm taking everything the other family members are saying with a grain of salt. I just hope the children (including the adults) are starting to understand that there are good, kind people in the world. I imagine that when you're raised by monsters, it's easy to assume that everyone is a monster.

 

[Hope4More]

I agree. I think they left Texas because he was either laid off from his job in Fort Worth or was transferred to California. They were dependent on that good government contractor paycheck.

A layoff would explain the foreclosure and bankruptcy. He had a new job in California at the time they filed for BK, but they were so far in arrears and default on their debts that they needed to file BK to get a fresh start.

Their August 2011 Chapter 7 bankruptcy was the 2nd. Their first was filed in Texas in 1992.

In Texas he first worked for General Dynamics, then for Lockheed Martin. His job with Northrup Grumman (in California) began in January 2011.

From your knowledge about what was happening within the defense contractor industry, do those dates suggest anything of possible relevance?

(BTW, in their 2011 bankruptcy filing he listed IIRC $80-90k in 401k savings from Lockheed, and just under $7k from NG (after 8 months of employment). Are those amounts surprising to you, given their expenses & their, hmm, lack of financial discipline?

 

[Hope4More]

And they kept all three veh in the Ch 7 so driving from Texas to CA, curious if towed? Since they had such a huge amount of credit card balances, it interesting reading the Ch 7 open minded, they may not have taken a whole lot with them . Bought more in CA. That was a lot to move across the country. Plus 3 vehicles.

Do you have a link for the 2011 bankruptcy papers handy? I combed through & posted about them, but doing all this on a phone precludes (for me, anyway), the storing & posting of links .

 

[Deleted member 158085]

<Emerges from shadows to offer expert Target advice>

In my humble professional Target shopper opinion, that is a Target. And I think those are chip reading card machines. My Target has carpet in the Customer Service area (which this appears to be).

Admittedly, I spend very little time shopping. I actually avoid it at all costs. I defer to you.

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[Margo/Mom]

Google retro plaid dresses. Plenty similar ones available cheaply online, just not through etsy.

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Now I'm going to have clothing ads popping up on everything!

 

[rsd1200]

So, why would a controlling man not mind her having sex with someone else? Doesn't quite seem to fit the pattern I have in my head...

Was he was maybe shooting blanks?? Or so they thought at the time?

(Eta: reminded of that old Heart song..."so I drove up alongside, and I offered him a ride, he accepted with a smile...and we drove for a while....

In the song, her man couldn't give her a baby: "But what he couldn't give me, oooohhh, was the one little thing that you can....")

OT completely, but a bit of levity for those who may need some (nsfw language in places).

All I Want To Do {Breaking Down The Silliest Song of The 80s)
https://www.salon.com/2013/12/29/al...e_to_you_breaking_down_the_80s_silliest_song/

 

[human]

It could be and should be. Home visits by trained clinicians and mandated reporters would not be that expensive or difficult to accomplish. At least if we want to avoid another Turpin situation and others like it. If parents want to homeschool, that is their prerogative, but is should be regulated as it is used nefariously by some to perpetuate abuse and neglect.

I hope the horrific chronic abuse of these children that went on for decades taught us something about the lack of legislation and regulation and some states. If parents are not doing anything nefarious while homeschooling they shouldn't object to oversight.

Children are NOT possessions. We expect dogs and cats to be treated better than children