CA - 13 victims, ages 2 to 29, shackled in home by parents, Perris, 15 Jan 2018 #8

[ohreally]

Oh my goodness. I had missed that [emoji15]

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My understanding is that when the family moved they left everything. I would think that would mean the fridge. The children would not be able to get in back of the fridge and peel the paint IMO.
I think it is possible that the home looks so horrid is because it was flooded at some point. It would explain the walls with peeling paint, the carpets on the lower floor condition, and the bathroom floor looking like it caved in.
It would not explain the feces on walls, broken windows or the picture painted on the wall. This could of been done by vandals, or it could be the condition the children were forced to live in. The peeling paint in back of the fridge puts a new perspective on all of the pictures from the house to me.
Just my thoughts.

 

[vlpate]

Maybe they used the chains to lock the refrigerator at night and to chain the kids in the kitchen during the day.

That wouldn't make sense though...they would then have easy access to the refrigerator. The chains don't look long enough to actually chain them with an appliance there, IMO

 

[December]

I just have to say this, I am sorry... I don't have any children, BUT...

I thought part of the point of having children was to take care of them? Which, at the most basic level, means FEEDING them.

For most people, obviously, they do more than that.

But, I have known parents being really happy to get something for their child. It doesn't have to be an expensive thing, just a thing their child needed for some reason at that moment.

But, if they didn't want to take care of the children, why not let the older ones get on with their lives? At least some of them would have moved out by now if they could have.

 

[ohreally]

I just have to say this, I am sorry... I don't have any children, BUT...

I thought part of the point of having children was to take care of them? Which, at the most basic level, means FEEDING them.

For most people, obviously, they do more than that.

But, I have known parents being really happy to get something for their child. It doesn't have to be an expensive thing, just a thing their child needed for some reason at that moment.

But, if they didn't want to take care of the children, why not let the older ones get on with their lives? At least some of them would have moved out by now if they could have.

I think they did not let the older ones go was because they knew or believed the older ones would turn them in to save thier siblings.

 

[Jondy09]

If we're focusing on the one-main-obsessive-interest aspect, the closest thing, DSM-wise, would be Asperger's/high-functioning autism. (Yeah I know Asperger's is no longer technically a diagnosis, but many HFA people continue to use the term for ease & clarity.) But what a lot of people don't realize, is that hyperfocus on one interest or category of interests can also be a huge part of ADHD, anxiety disorders & other developmental disorders .. and there's a point where a person may have just a light blend of all these things w/o technically meeting "diagnostic criteria" for one or more. Like, it may not be "bad" enough to constitute an "illness." Oftentimes we consider such people just a bit eccentric, a bit "odd." It may or may not be truly pathological.

I say if they are super into Disney, and they just happened to find a mate who is also into Disney, good for them. Who am I to judge!

Ultimately it comes down to whether a person's interest/obsession is interfering w/ their life & relationships. If it's not, we call it "just a hobby," or we say "that person is just a nerd." Like those people who are super into anime and go to ComiCon and dress up (I think it is called cosplay?) .. or people who do Renaissance faires, or the many many men in the US who are crazy into Star Wars. Are every single one of these people "on the spectrum"? I doubt it.

This is a sore subject for me personally so I'm sorry to go O/T, just wanted to throw that out there.

Yes, thank you for pointing out that restricted interests are part of many diagnoses. Therefore, obsessions are not a sure sign of ASD (and saving me a long post )!



On the subject of ASD, since I've seen speculation DT may have it, people with ASD do feel emotions! They feel love, compassion, empathy, sadness, guilt, and pain. The difference between someone with and without ASD is communicating those emotions to others may not come naturally to someone with ASD. Autism does not equal unfeeling or sadistic.

 

[KaaBoom]

The most common is anti tip brackets, but I've also seen chains attached as well to prevent it from tipping. It is also used on ovens.



https://partsdr.com/part/wb2x7909-a...IP0dsQ8ACJ25xklXDZzyKA55L1Kau-48aAsInEALw_wcB

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Those are for ranges / ovens, not refrigerators, to prevent tipping in case a child opens the oven door and stands on the door. Even that seems like a non-issue. It would have to be a very small lightweight range, and a very heavy child to tople one of those things over.

 

[December]

I think they did not let the older ones go was because they knew or believed the older ones would turn them in to save thier siblings.

Well, true.

 

[Errrr]

Thank you for posting that video, I hadn't seen it. It gave a pretty good chronology of the moves from Ft. Worth to Rio Vista to California.

The Fort Worth house was clean and neat at the 1:45 mark. (I presume it was the Ft. Worth house...anyway).

Something must have happened before they moved out of the Fort Worth house, since it was left so dirty. I know that houses look dirtier when you move out and move the furniture and expose the clean carpet which makes the traffic area look really dirty, but that was way beyond that. Real dirty, dirty carpet and walls and doors. Yuck.

It does sound like they tried to home school, if there were desks lined up like a school at some point in Rio Vista. I wonder if they used the brick house for school when they moved to the mobile home, or what?

Maybe they let the animals live in there? Pigs will root up flooring at once when given the opportunity which would explain the bathroom.

 

[December]

Those are for ranges / ovens, not refrigerators, to prevent tipping in case a child opens the oven door and stands on the door. Even that seems like a non-issue. It would have to be a very small lightweight range, and a very heavy child to top one of those things over.

Is children standing on open oven doors a thing that happens? (Mind is boggled.) As in frequently? (Readies fainting couch) What?

 

[vlpate]

I'm sure we'd know if Prader-Willi was a factor. I'm certain it's not. Good point tho. I too am really into speculating about what the heck the defense will pull outta their butts for this case!

Parents may lock up food or hide food if someone in the household has bulimia or binge eating disorder/compulsive overeating.

(Respectfully snipped for emphasis)

Parents with autistic children sometimes lock their fridge - search "refrigerator locks" on Amazon and read the comments, many attest to this. Problem is, regardless of what malady they might use as a defense, no visits to an MD would cast a bit of doubt, unless, of course the visits and diagnosis were when the first four were younger.

 

[Gae]

My understanding is that when the family moved they left everything. I would think that would mean the fridge. The children would not be able to get in back of the fridge and peel the paint IMO.
I think it is possible that the home looks so horrid is because it was flooded at some point. It would explain the walls with peeling paint, the carpets on the lower floor condition, and the bathroom floor looking like it caved in.
It would not explain the feces on walls, broken windows or the picture painted on the wall. This could of been done by vandals, or it could be the condition the children were forced to live in. The peeling paint in back of the fridge puts a new perspective on all of the pictures from the house to me.
Just my thoughts.

BBM
I'm not trying to minimize anything, but I experienced a devastating flood in 1986. We had to row in a boat to our home to see it. People who haven't lived through such a flood, usually don't have any idea of the filth involved. It's not fresh, crystal clear water pouring into the home. It's backed up septic tanks from your home and your neighbor's, raw sewage, pond scum, etc. Brown sludge/slime coated everything. Dead animals were in my yard, dead fish, snakes, trash washed onto my property from area dumpsters. The photo of that bathtub looks just like my tub did after the flood from the nasty flood water and backed up septic system. Like I said, I'm not minimizing any poor housekeeping habits of LT and DT, but if that house flooded, the defense will definitely bring up the flooding as a defense.

 

[December]

As the Minnesota experiment proved, some people* will pursue food if deprived of calories. However, a really easy way to prevent this from developing is to feed appropriate calories. *"Some people" does not necessarily mean anyone in the Turpin household did this in reality. I am just saying if the defense claims it, then the answer is the parents caused it to happen. Jmo

 

[Deleted member 158085]

I have never seen that here in Australia

I've never seen it in America.

Even if that was the case, those chains seem longer than what you would need to chain it to the wall. If that's what these were for, wouldn't they be shorter?

I don't know how this works because I've never seen it before or even heard about it.

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[KaaBoom]

Is children standing on open oven doors a thing that happens? (Mind is boggled.) As in frequently? (Readies fainting couch) What?

As I said I think it's a non-issue. A range weighs about 150 - 250 pounds. So the child would have to be well over 100 pounds to tip it. Even then I would expect the door would break before it would tip over. I could see it might be useful in a house with an older, mentally challenged, heavy weight child. Anyone else would be wasting their money on it. IMHO.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

When I Google "chaining fridge to the wall" I find straps that go into the studs in the wall, not chains.

http://totallyunprepared.com/secure-your-refrigerator-for-an-earthquake/

https://www.amazon.com/Safety-1st-Furniture-Straps-Count/dp/B000056W7R

I don't think chaining is common.

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[Spice]

Another family that were charged after chaining the refrigerator shut:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ains-refrigerator-kept-kids-locked-rooms.html

Where are people getting this idea from?! It's nuts.

You would be surprised how many people attempt to "control" children with food. I have seen Foster Parents put padlocks on refrigerators, "He/She eats SO MUCH", meanwhile they are receiving money to care for the child and every dollar is supposed to go directly to food, clothe, and shelter, the child. Caseworkers in child welfare are trained to look for that, that is how common that can be. And these are foster parents, the people charged with caring for children who have been neglected and abused.

I find it very telling about someones view of the world and view of children. Anecdotally, I noticed that this kind of food restriction tended to come from people with "old school" beliefs.

Personally,it made me not trust the foster parent, and I always advocated for their home to be closed. They know that there will be unannounced and home visits where the refrigerator and cabinets are checked for appropriate food and where their care for the child is monitored. Yet, some of these foster parents found nothing wrong with it? It's beyond inappropriate and a very big RED flag.

(Not to denigrate Foster Parents, some of them are absolute GEMS and put up with a lot from the bio parents and the system, selflessly. But when they are bad, they are bad)
:moo:

 

[Gae]

As the Minnesota experiment proved, some people* will pursue food if deprived of calories. However, a really easy way to prevent this from developing is to feed appropriate calories. *"Some people" does not necessarily mean anyone in the Turpin household did this in reality. I am just saying if the defense claims it, then the answer is the parents caused it to happen. Jmo

I agree. When my son was a teen, he had a bowel resection surgery. He was not allowed to eat until his bowel healed enough to kick in and start working again - which took several days. The first two days after surgery, he was so hungry, and wanted to eat, but after that, he started losing his appetite until it was gone. At that point, he could watch tv with ads showing delicious meals, but he said watching didn't make him hungry all. I wonder if something similar happened to the Turpin kids? Parents restricted calories/food so much, that some of them lost their appetites?? I realize my son's situation was different, but like you say, DT and LT caused this to happen in the first place.

 

[December]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_enrichment

This is an article about enriched/deprived environment and the effects on cognitive development.

It does talk about experiments with rats at first, but it does address different situations with children. (Eta, humans in general)

It also helps explain some of the statements doctors have made in regard to this case.

 

[vlpate]

BBM
I'm not trying to minimize anything, but I experienced a devastating flood in 1986. We had to row in a boat to our home to see it. People who haven't lived through such a flood, usually don't have any idea of the filth involved. It's not fresh, crystal clear water pouring into the home. It's backed up septic tanks from your home and your neighbor's, raw sewage, pond scum, etc. Brown sludge/slime coated everything. Dead animals were in my yard, dead fish, snakes, trash washed onto my property from area dumpsters. The photo of that bathtub looks just like my tub did after the flood from the nasty flood water and backed up septic system. Like I said, I'm not minimizing any poor housekeeping habits of LT and DT, but if that house flooded, the defense will definitely bring up the flooding as a defense.

Rio Vista is on a flood plain...the minute I saw the full set of pics I researched weather events in the hill country around that time and there were a few...but living on a flood plain it doesn't take a torrential rain to flood. There were also obvious roof leaks - the photos taken by the bank show a large blue tarp over the kitchen/dining area of the house - it looks fairly new, so water could have been running into those rooms for years. As you probably also know, most everything in a flooded house has to be thrown away, which would explain the full dumpsters. The streets in some areas of Houston after Harvey were lined with dumpsters full of furniture and debris for weeks.

I hate the disclaimers everyone feels compelled to make when discussing this, but I will anyway - there is no doubt at least three children were chained when police discovered the "house of horrors" - and the fact that the entire family, save for the parents, were painfully thin, makes abuse and torture an obvious conclusion. Also, as someone brought up earlier, the older children still lived at home - this is as bizarre as the rest of it to me. Someone was unwilling to relinquish control over their possessions.

 

[Spice]

I agree. When my son was a teen, he had a bowel resection surgery. He was not allowed to eat until his bowel healed enough to kick in and start working again - which took several days. The first two days after surgery, he was so hungry, and wanted to eat, but after that, he started losing his appetite until it was gone. At that point, he could watch tv with ads showing delicious meals, but he said watching didn't make him hungry all. I wonder if something similar happened to the Turpin kids? Parents restricted calories/food so much, that some of them lost their appetites?? I realize my son's situation was different, but like you say, DT and LT caused this to happen in the first place.

BBM

When the police rescued them the children communicated that they were "starving", and LE fed them immediately. I don't think they lost their appetite.