CA - Actor Ron Ely's son stabs mother Valerie to death; Santa Barbara, Oct.16, 2019

[10ofRods]

Ron Ely, 81, famous for playing TV Tarzan in the 70's, dialed 911 to report a domestic disturbance. Police arrived to find that his son, Cameron, 30, had stabbed Valerie Lundeen Ely, 62, multiple times. After threatening police, police shot Cameron to death.

Son of Ron Ely, ‘Tarzan’ Actor, Kills Mother Before Police Shoot Him Dead, Officials Say

The couple and their son lived in Santa Barbara's most upscale area, Hope Ranch.

There are pictures of the couple here:

Wife Of 'Tarzan' Actor Ron Ely Stabbed To Death By Son At Santa Barbara Home

No word on Mr. Ely's status or health. The couple had recently put their multi-million dollar home up for sale and even more recently reduced the price by $200,000.

 

[1&2&3]

Wonder why the police had to shoot to kill? IMO that is what LE is trained to do. Why not shoot to injure him and make him immobile?

It will be interesting to see how the son was threatening the police. However, stabbing a person 64 times is major rage and overkill.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

I didn’t read that she had been stabbed 64 times.....yikes!
It sounds like the son had some problems, he went from being a Harvard quarterback to a security guard position thru a period of time apparently. The back story will be interesting.
So sorry for Ron & family for their loss. I watched him years ago as Tarzan in black & white television on one of our three available channels. My how things have changed.

ETA thanks for the thread 10!

 

[al66pine]

LE Training, Shoot to Neutralize, Not Shoot to Kill

...shoot to kill? IMO that is what LE is trained to do. Why not shoot to injure him and make him immobile?...

@1&2&3 sbm
Public misunderstanding
" ...believe that shooting an armed and dangerous subject in the hand or the leg is not only feasible, but preferable to shooting center mass...and this persistent perception...“training by Hollywood.”
"Fictional cops with superhuman capabilities enable more dramatic endings to police procedurals. Scenes in which a gun is shot from the hand of a menacing bad guy simply do not reflect real-life human abilities."
Timing
“...Hands and arms can be the fastest-moving body parts. For example, an average suspect can move his hand and forearm across his body to a 90-degree angle in 12/100 of a second. He can move his hand from his hip to shoulder height in 18/100 of a second.”
“...The average officer pulling the trigger as fast as he can on a GLOCK — one of the fastest-cycling semi-autos — requires 1/4 second to discharge each round. There is no way an officer can react, track, shoot and reliably hit a threatening suspect’s forearm or a weapon in a suspect’s hand in the time spans involved.”
“...If an officer manages to take a suspect’s legs out non-fatally, that still leaves the offender’s hands free to shoot. His ability to threaten lives hasn’t necessarily been stopped.”
Reality
"... cops are not trained to “kill” — they are trained to stop a threat of death or great bodily harm to themselves or another person. That means putting rounds in center mass until that threat is on the ground and neutralized."
"....an assailant who is on the ground may continue to present a threat — shot doesn’t equal dead. A downed gunman can still squeeze off rounds. A man with a knife can still stab at officers approaching to handcuff him.

my bbm & sbm ^ Force Science Institute Executive Director, Dr. Bill Lewinski, (Force Science Institute | Research, Training, and Consultation) quoted in How to explain to the public why cops don't shoot to wound pub date Dec 2, 2016

 

[al66pine]

...
Wife Of 'Tarzan' Actor Ron Ely Stabbed To Death By Son At Santa Barbara Home
No word on Mr. Ely's status or health. The couple had recently put their multi-million dollar home up for sale and even more recently reduced the price by $200,000.

@10ofRods
This ^ cbslocal-LA or kcal9 article was updated. "No report of injury" to Ron Ely.

{{{ETA: Earlier article, Oct 1, 11;58 pm, referred to elderly woman "found fatally shot.' Early reporting, apparently mistaken???
Santa Barbara Deputies Fatally Shoot Suspect In Homicide At Home Owned By 'Tarzan' Actor Ron Ely}}}

 

[al66pine]

....It will be interesting to see how the son was threatening the police. However, stabbing a person 64 times is major rage and overkill.

@1&2&3 Re this case, like you, I am curious to see more about son's threat to LE.

"Authorities say the suspect “posed a threat”, leading to deputies fatally shooting the actor’s son. No deputies were injured." per cbslocal or kcal article, Oct 16.

"They searched the property and found him outside the home, where, they said, he “posed a threat.” In response, four deputies shot at him, fatally wounding him, according to the sheriff’s office. The deputies, who were not injured during the confrontation, “will be placed on paid administrative leave” as part of standard procedure, officials said."" per NYT article, Oct 16.

 

[Catmommy]

Four deputies fired. I think all four perceived a reasonable threat.

 

[Betty P]

Read about this yesterday, such a tragic situation. They seemed like a close, healthy family

Tarzan Actor Left Acting to Raise His Kids, Including Harvard Grad Son Who Killed Mom

At first I though perhaps the son was mentally ill. That's often the reason during those rare murders of a mother by a son.
The age fits for mental illness, especially as he seemed to drop out of life after his college years. But when he tried to blame his father for the murder, you have to wonder. Or it's possible he is mentally ill and hallucinated that his father did that. IDK.

I feel badly for Ron and his daughters left to put their lives back together. He sounds as if he's in frail health.

From the link above, some quotes from a 2012 interview with Ron Ely

In the Comic-Con interview, Ron said he was happy that all three of his adult children were back living at home, with Cameron taking two rooms upstairs.

“It’s great in the morning. We see each other. We see each other in the evening, we see each other when they come and go. We’re always in touch,” he said.

Cameron graduated from Harvard University in 2012 with a Bachelor of Arts in Psychology, a university spokesperson told PEOPLE. In 2007, he was a quarterback on the school’s football team and was listed on the team’s roster as a freshman quarterback from Phillips Exeter Academy. He is not listed on the rosters of football teams in subsequent years.

 

[SoCalDavidS]

Very sad. He lost his wife and son in a matter of minutes. He's 81, and it must be extremely difficult to recover from something like this at that age. I hope he is able to make it through and this doesn't make him lose the will to live.

 

[al66pine]

Suspect, A Threat to Deputies?
Assembling these three early MSM articles for ease of discussion later, when more detail emerges.
Interesting that only the first article- the earliest I've seen - refers to deputies' attempt to gain verbal control of subject. Then same source, cbslocal / kcal, did not include that in next day's story Hmm?

"Deputies searched the home and secured a perimeter and advised neighbors to remain indoors as the search continued. Deputies later found the suspect on the home's property and said they attempted to gain verbal control of the suspect, but the suspect presented a threat to them. In a statement, the sheriff's department said several deputies fired their service weapons at the suspect, killing him." bbm
^ Oct. 15, 12:58pm Santa Barbara Deputies Fatally Shoot Suspect In Homicide At Home Owned By 'Tarzan' Actor Ron Ely

"Authorities say the suspect “posed a threat”, leading to deputies fatally shooting the actor’s son. No deputies were injured." bbm
^ Oct. 16 Wife Of 'Tarzan' Actor Ron Ely Stabbed To Death By Son At Santa Barbara Home

"They searched the property and found him outside the home, where, they said, he “posed a threat.” In response, four deputies shot at him, fatally wounding him, according to the sheriff’s office. The deputies, who were not injured during the confrontation, “will be placed on paid administrative leave” as part of standard procedure, officials said." bbm
^ Oct. 16 Son of Ron Ely, ‘Tarzan’ Actor, Kills Mother Before Police Shoot Him Dead, Officials Say

 

[kay74]

Why couldn't they have tazered him instead of killing him?! I mean wow the guy did the crime with a knife, could he have had a gun too and pointed it at them? I don't understand this at all. I wonder if this son was on antidepressants? They have caused many people to commit violent acts and suicide. They make a balanced mind, unbalanced.

 

[al66pine]

LE Self Defense?

Why couldn't they have tazered him instead of killing him?! I mean wow the guy did the crime with a knife, could he have had a gun too and pointed it at them? I don't understand this at all....

@kay74 bbm sbm
1) Yes, suspect might have had a gun in hand, maybe aimed at officer(s). If so, appears to be a situation permitting officer(s) to use firearm(s) in self defense.
2) Seems using Taser(s) could have been a better idea, if this jurisdiction issues Tasers to its officers.
But conditions at the scene may have called for use of deadly force (firearm) rather than 'less lethal force' e.g. Taser.
3) After finding woman's body w such extensive bleeding that officers initially thought she was shot,* LE would have reason to believe perp was armed w gun and had used it. LE searched inside house then outside** and found him. Officers tried verbal commands, but suspect presented threat to them.***
Without specific information about which weapon(s) suspect had, what he was saying, what he was doing, where he was in relation to officers, etc., can anyone determine the appropriate level of force for LE's self defense?
jmo
----------------------------------
* ^ Woman "found fatally shot" per earliest MSM, later reported as 64 stab wounds <--- imo, translates as - there was so much blood, LE initially thought she was shot, not stabbed.
First/earliest article, Oct 1, 11;58 pm.
Santa Barbara Deputies Fatally Shoot Suspect In Homicide At Home Owned By 'Tarzan' Actor Ron Ely
** On arriving and finding body, officers cannot assume that there is only one perp. Other perp(s) could be inside house or outside.
***"Deputies later found the suspect on the home's property and said they attempted to gain verbal control of the suspect, but the suspect presented a threat to them." from ^ link. Another MSM article said "posed a threat."

 

[doublestop]

Why couldn't they have tazered him instead of killing him?! I mean wow the guy did the crime with a knife, could he have had a gun too and pointed it at them? I don't understand this at all. I wonder if this son was on antidepressants? They have caused many people to commit violent acts and suicide. They make a balanced mind, unbalanced.

And in many more cases, they save lives by keeping people from killing themselves.

 

[kay74]

Well if he didn't have a gun and for some reason they can't taser him, then shoot him in the leg.

 

[kay74]

Since the father can't talk, I wonder if he has dementia or had a stroke? Also, I wonder if his son got a brain concussion while playing football at Harvard? I suppose the daughters might explain this.

 

[al66pine]

dbm

 

[al66pine]

Well if he didn't have a gun and for some reason they can't taser him, then shoot him in the leg.

@kay74 bbm I'm trying to understand this post. Is it saying -
1) if poster were LE officer,
.....A) She would try to shoot suspect in leg?
.....B) She would shoot suspect in leg?

2) Under California law and LE dept policy,
.....A) She thinks LE officers should try to shoot suspect in leg?
.....B) She thinks LE officers should shoot suspect in leg?

3) Even though it may not be California law and dept LE policy, it should work this way:
.....A) She thinks LE officers should try to shoot suspect in leg?
.....B) She thinks LE officers should shoot suspect in leg?

4) Other?

 

[10ofRods]

In Santa Barbara, police have tasers. They are known to use them in the case of threats by obviously mentally ill people (and some of those mentally ill people have died anyway, as tasers are not 100% safe).

I'm guessing that the scene was chaotic and no one knew what weapons, exactly, the son had. The son called the police himself, IIRC. He tried to say his dad had stabbed his mom. I have no idea why the police ended up thinking he was the perp - but maybe he was just acting so aggressive and crazy, they shot. And it's true, they're all trained to shoot to kill these days.

There are some officers who choose a different approach, but in this case, all four chose to shoot (really common especially among younger beat cops).

 

[jjenny]

Well if he didn't have a gun and for some reason they can't taser him, then shoot him in the leg.

Police are trained to shoot into body mass because that's a bigger target than a leg. Furthermore, a leg shot can just as easily be lethal if they hit an artery.

 

[al66pine]

dbm