CA CA - Elizabeth Lisa Ramos, 14 months, and Jasmin Maria Ramos, 2 months, Bakersfield, August '89

[victoriarobinson642]

https://resources.mohave.gov/File/Sheriff/PressReleasesArchives/2023/02-14-23%20Special%20Release-%20SIU%20cold%20cases%20investigation.pdf

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In February 2022, our SIU team obtained the victim’s fingerprints from the investigative case file and submitted them to NamUs for examination by the FBI. The next day, SIU was notified that the prints were a match for Maria Ortiz out of Bakersfield, California. Follow-up was conducted with the Bakersfield Police Department, which led them to a possible associate of Maria Ortiz. Telephone contact was made with the associate, revealing that they had no knowledge of anyone named Maria Ortiz.

The associate did indicate that they had a cousin, identified as Marina Ramos, who had been missing since 1989. Additionally, Marina’s two daughters, ages 2 months and 14 months at the time, had also been missing since that time. SIU investigators contacted another family member of the victim, who agreed to give a DNA sample for familial comparison. In December 2022, SIU was notified that the victim and the relative matched DNA family lines, thus verifying her identity as Marina Ramos (DOB 4-19-1961).

Marina Ramos was last seen in August 1989 in Bakersfield, California, with her daughters Elizabeth Lisa Ramos (DOB 6-23-1988) and Jasmin Maria Ramos (DOB 6-15-1989). She was last known to be with a Hispanic male, known only as “Fernando”. The four were seen driving away in his black SUV, headed for Ontario, California, where “Fernando” lived.
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[MadMcGoo]

Thank you @victoriarobinson642 ! I was coming to see if a thread had been started for these two.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Composite
On December 12, 1989, an unidentified woman was found unclothed and stabbed to death on Old Temple Bar Road, around 50 miles south of Las Vegas, in Mohave County, Arizona. Police say Ramos was likely killed at the scene, and all attempts to identify her at the time were unsuccessful.

The body remained a Jane Doe until February 2022, when fingerprints taken from the victim were submitted to the FBI and resulted in a match to a woman named Maria Ortiz in Bakersfield. When police contacted a possible associate of Ortiz, that person said they had no knowledge of that name but did have a cousin named Marina Ramos. Ramos had been missing since 1989 alongside her two daughters, ages 2 months and 14 months at the time.

'Fernando' sought in Calif. woman's death, disappearance of kids

"The family would like to know what happened to those two little girls."

www.sfgate.com

 

[MadMcGoo]

Partial skeletal remains of a child between 18 months and 3 years, found buried in west Cajon Valley, east of Wrightwood. DNA submitted to California Department of Justice, Missing Persons DNA Program (refer to CODIS #BK-02-000199). FBI completed original DNA testing. Dental X-rays available on request. EYD is 1984-1994.

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

Pre-Adolescent female found in 1994 in Bombay Beach, CA. The PMI is 50 years though so probably not a match, but the location caught my attention.

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

 

[MarziPanda]

Marina was found in Arizona, not far from Las Vegas. So I searched Arizona and Nevada as well as California where they were supposedly from/heading. Nothing in Nevada that fits though. Came up with these two:

NamUs #UP67335. Infant (9 1/2 lunar months to .05 months) skeletal remains were found in the desert area in Mesa, Arizona. But they were found in 2000 and with a PMI of only 12 months. They've been off before but 11 years is a lot to be off. UID was wearing a "Babys Own Classique" onesie which was popular in the 80s and 90s. Not sure what '9 1/2 lunar months to .05 months' is supposed to mean. Uncertain sex and race.

NamUs #UP3530 Skeletal remains found on Malibu Beach, California. 1-2 years old, 1996. No PMI, but estimated year of death is 1996, so not a good match there. If they were skeletal, though, perhaps they were older remains than first thought. Female of uncertain race.

Of course, if Marina was taken from California to Arizona to be killed, it's possible her daughters could have been killed in any state. Hopefully they were spared and they are living happily somewhere as adults, waiting to be found.

 

[Goecke]

BBM, I assume '9 1/2 lunar months to 0.5 months' means 9.5 months inside the womb or half a month outside the womb.... So maybe they can't tell if the UID was a full-term stillbirth or had been born alive and had lived up to a few weeks after birth?

NamUs #UP67335. Infant (9 1/2 lunar months to .05 months) skeletal remains were found in the desert area in Mesa, Arizona. But they were found in 2000 and with a PMI of only 12 months. They've been off before but 11 years is a lot to be off. UID was wearing a "Babys Own Classique" onesie which was popular in the 80s and 90s. Not sure what '9 1/2 lunar months to .05 months' is supposed to mean. Uncertain sex and race.

 

[MarziPanda]

BBM, I assume '9 1/2 lunar months to 0.5 months' means 9.5 months inside the womb or half a month outside the womb.... So maybe they can't tell if the UID was a full-term stillbirth or had been born alive and had lived up to a few weeks after birth?

I figured it was probably something like that, but a very odd way of putting it. The baby was wearing a onesie so I would think they were born alive, but who knows. Jasmin was two months old so unlikely, but possible if they got the PMI and age wrong.

 

[Keith417]

I figured it was probably something like that, but a very odd way of putting it. The baby was wearing a onesie so I would think they were born alive, but who knows. Jasmin was two months old so unlikely, but possible if they got the PMI and age wrong.

Any pictures of the missing children?

 

[MarziPanda]

Any pictures of the missing children?

I haven't found any in the media articles I've found. Unfortunately I would guess that no photos exist. Perhaps a friend of their mum or a family member might have a picture tucked away in a drawer somewhere. I hope someone could at least provide a basic description. They would be Hispanic on their mother's side (at least I think their mother is Hispanic?) but their father could have been, for example, black - which would mean looking for two mixed race girls rather than two Hispanic girls. Even just 'yes they were Hispanic with black hair' would help.

 

[Lwieckowicz]

Following

 

[Caring1]

Elizabeth and Jasmin have been added to NamUs today.

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

 

[iamshadow21]

Elizabeth and Jasmin have been added to NamUs today.

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)

By bringing people, information, forensic science and technology together, NamUs helps resolve cases.

www.namus.gov

That's wonderful. Thanks for letting us know, @Caring1 .

 

[CastlesBurning]

UNSOLVED: The murder of Marina Ramos and the search for her two missing daughters

 

[victoriarobinson642]

I hope their relatives have uploaded DNA profiles to Ancestry and the like.