CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death hiking area, Aug 2021 #2

[dalsglen]

Just seen this awful story, the whole family found deceased on a trail with no injuries.

Speculation in the article that it could be carbon monoxide or toxic algae exposure. So sad whatever the case.

Missing couple, their baby and dog are found dead in remote California hiking area | Daily Mail Online

Thread #1

 

[Auntie Cipation]

Also, someone in a previous mentioned, why choose such a public place for a suicide? It wasn’t too public. No one crossed that path until LE did searching for them. Clearly not very used.

RSBM

I'm not of the opinion that this case involves suicide, but -- I do think it's been mentioned that this is *not* usually such a quiet or unused trail, except during extreme heat (and also since the fire 3 years ago which took much of the shade and view).

Although these folks have only lived in the area for a year, they presumably know the area enough to have chosen it as where they want to live.

One last food for thought: do you think LE was quick to “rule out” homicide because they didn’t believe there was a threat to the public and didn’t want to scare people into NOT hiking or getting outdoors?

I really don’t know what it is. I find the baby not near Mom to be puzzling, regardless of baby’s condition.

This is truly a sad situation, regardless

I don't actually think LE has officially "ruled out" homicide. I think they have said they are not treating it as a homicide because there is no evidence of such, and that they HAVE ruled out violent death such as from gunshot, stabbing, blunt force trauma etc.

The web page of the California Department of Water Resources should be an exhibit (circa 1994) in an Internet museum, but if you click this link and scroll down you can see the hourly temperature readings measured at a weather station at El Portal (EPW):

• 08/15/2021 06:00 73 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 07:00 77 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 08:00 85 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 09:00 92 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 10:00 99 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 11:00 103 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 12:00 107 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 13:00 108 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 14:00 109 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 15:00 107 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 16:00 105 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 17:00 101 DEG F

It was 73 degrees--not 53 degrees--at 6 am, but otherwise the above lines up with the data shared by the poster a few pages ago. The El Portal weather station sits about two miles (by the crow's flight) from the Hites Cove trail at Devil's Gulch. If the measurements at the station are accurate, the temperature was above 100 degrees for approximately eight hours during the morning and afternoon of the 15th.

I'm glad to know the El Portal station is so close. Oftentimes in the mountains the "nearest" station is actually in a very different climate zone.

We should also keep in mind the fact that official weather stations record the temperature *in the shade*. So them being in direct sun only adds to that.

MOO

 

[SophieRose]

This speaks volumes. Over 90 at 9AM and 103 by 11AM. BRUTAL! What I find astonishing is that they decided to continue the trek when temps hit 90+ with an infant and dog. Not being judgmental....I'm trying to understand.

Here are the temperatures at Jerseyville (similar to Mariposa), the community next to where they lived. Hot (high of 97), but not in the 100s. I think they weren't expecting the brutal conditions of the canyon.

Jerseydale California

 

[McSpy]

Snipped for focus.

High 90's may have been the ambient temperature, but this was a burn area, there was no shade, and heat reflects off a trail like that.

Compare with the Philip Kreychik case. Ultra distance runner out for his daily run. Dead. Found Deceased - CA - Philip Kreycik, 37, Pleasanton Ridge Regional Park, 10 Jul 2021 #2

After a lot of thought, I do think they may have perished from the heat. I found out in another article that he is British. Possibly he is not accustomed to the weather in the US. The US is generally much hotter during the summer months than the UK. The temps are especially brutal in California. They may have succumbed to the heat. Perhaps it overwhelmed them. They were caught off guard.

 

[mickey2942]

pathophysiology of heat-related illness and death :: www.forensicmed.co.uk

This is interesting, there really isn't any way to determine death by heat stroke by an autopsy.

 

[McSpy]

I’m wondering if this family and dog were killed/ poisoned, somewhere else, maybe at home? Then moved to this location. The bodies were placed in these positions. Made to appear like a hiking issue caused the death. It would explain how everyone died at the exact same time and in the neat positions… like frozen. The question is, who would benefit from the deaths…. Motive?

Didn’t the family tell others that they were going on this hike? If I recall correctly, others knew the family had made plans to go on a hike.

 

[woods]

John and Ellen married in 2019 and had moved to Mariposa County from San Francisco after the COVID-19 pandemic began in 2020, to enjoy the outdoors, after starting working from home on a permanent basis. They wished to raise Miju away from a major city and hoped to leave the frantic pace of the San Francisco Bay Area for the calm of nature.

The family were regular weekend hikers, taking Miji with them in a baby-carrier on their backs.

Their friend, Mariposa real estate agent Sidney Radanovich, said, "(They) fell in love with the Mariposa area" and bought several homes there, a residence for themselves and rental investments.”

The bizarre deaths of the Gerrish family in Devil’s Gulch — StrangeOutdoors.com

 

[armchairagatha]

First, it's important to note that we don't know when the family started their hike. As others have noted, at least one LE source suggested that the family started the hike in the afternoon. But sometimes LE can be imprecise (and/or misunderstood or misquoted by the media) in circumstances like this, so I remain open to the possibility that the family started their hike early in the morning--which would make more sense.

To address your point, it's quite possible that the family decided not to continue their trek when temps hit 90+ around 9 a.m. They may have turned around at that point. But if they did start the hike early in the morning, they could have been hiking for 2 hours (much of which was downhill) by the time they realized that the temperature was reaching dangerous levels. Heat injury could have set in during their uphill trek back, as the temperature rapidly climbed to 107-109 degrees.

This actually makes the most sense. They left early before it got really hot but once they decided to turn back a couple hrs later, the return was uphill and took much longer. By that time, temps were in the 100s already.

 

[rahod1]

My sister, her ex and their dogs used to hike this area and specifically this trail often in the spring and fall. One time my brother in law took the dog in the middle of the hot summer up there for a hike while my sister was at work. He called her mid afternoon while driving back. She says he could barely get out a word. He and the dog barely made it back to the car due to heat exhaustion. It took both of them a few days to recover. This is a guy who builds tennis courts and other sports courts for a living. He is used to being outside in the heat. My sister doesn’t believe it is gases or algae bloom.

YES. This post is the most relevant that I've read so far!

 

[TailSpin]

Since there only appears to be one reference that they left in the afternoon I think that it could be mistaken. We know they were up early at 6:45am and that they spoke to someone in the morning before they left. I have not seen any witness state that they saw them leave in the afternoon. I'm thinking the LE source may have been inferring that they left in the afternoon.

I also think it is extremely unlikely that they were murdered. There was no evidence at the scene of another person or vehicle so you would have to believe that someone slipped poison in their water bladder while they were packing. The simplest explanation is that the heat caused distress for one or several family members and that they decided to rest as a group. It would have been very difficult for one of them to separate from the others.

I'm still hoping the phone has GPS info on their location over time so that we can recreate their journey. I think that would narrow down the possible scenarios considerably.

 

[rahod1]

Since there only appears to be one reference that they left in the afternoon I think that it could be mistaken. We know they were up early at 6:45am and that they spoke to someone in the morning before they left. I have not seen any witness state that they saw them leave in the afternoon. I'm thinking the LE source may have been inferring that they left in the afternoon.

I also think it is extremely unlikely that they were murdered. There was no evidence at the scene of another person or vehicle so you would have to believe that someone slipped poison in their water bladder while they were packing. The simplest explanation is that the heat caused distress for one or several family members and that they decided to rest as a group. It would have been very difficult for one of them to separate from the others.

I'm still hoping the phone has GPS info on their location over time so that we can recreate their journey. I think that would narrow down the possible scenarios considerably.

The time they departed really doesn't matter now. The fact they got caught in the heat after 10 am with a challenging return is all that really matters. Just my take.

 

[everybodhi]

The web page of the California Department of Water Resources should be an exhibit (circa 1994) in an Internet museum, but if you click this link and scroll down you can see the hourly temperature readings measured at a weather station at El Portal (EPW):

• 08/15/2021 06:00 73 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 07:00 77 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 08:00 85 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 09:00 92 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 10:00 99 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 11:00 103 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 12:00 107 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 13:00 108 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 14:00 109 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 15:00 107 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 16:00 105 DEG F
• 08/15/2021 17:00 101 DEG F

It was 73 degrees--not 53 degrees--at 6 am, but otherwise the above lines up with the data shared by the poster a few pages ago. The El Portal weather station sits about two miles (by the crow's flight) from the Hites Cove trail at Devil's Gulch. If the measurements at the station are accurate, the temperature was above 100 degrees for approximately eight hours during the morning and afternoon of the 15th.

El Portal sits by the river in a canyon full of green trees, it's lovely there.
It's quite different than the barren, burned out landscape of Hites Cove and Devil's Gulch.
There shouldn't be any doubt it was heat stroke hot there.

 

[bpeterson912]

The time they departed really doesn't matter now. The fact they got caught in the heat after 10 am with a challenging return is all that really matters. Just my take.

I think the time of departure matters because if the family really did start the hike in the afternoon, then it becomes harder to explain their decision-making that day. It's one thing to start a hike at 7 a.m. (when the temperature is in the 70s) and then to get stuck in severe heat. But it's something else to start a hike--with a kid and dog in tow--when the temperature is already 107 to 109 degrees. That would be a strange thing to do.

For what it's worth, I'm very skeptical of the account that the family departed in the afternoon. As far as I can tell, the source for this is the August 20 article in the SF Chronicle stating that "authorities believe the family left for their hike Sunday afternoon." This was just a characterization; there was no direct quote from a law-enforcement source. Perhaps the author of the Chronicle article accurately relayed what LE told him, but I wouldn't be surprised if a LE source said something like "we know the family was out there on the trail on Sunday afternoon when the temperatures were above 107 degrees"--which the author of the article then misinterpreted as meaning that the family started their hike on Sunday afternoon.

If someone is aware of a direct quote from LE stating that the family started their hike on Sunday afternoon, please share it. In the absence of such a statement, I'm inclined to believe that the family started the hike early Sunday morning.

 

[Countem]

According to the following article from The Times, “The temperature in the area was above 100F (38C), but it is believed they started their walk in the early morning when it would have been cooler.”

Phone could hold key to how family and dog died on California hike | The Times

Several articles, including the following article, refer to their hike as a “daylong” hike, meaning that they were likely planning to be out for several hours rather than just a couple hours in the morning.

More questions than answers after autopsy of family found dead

 

[Officer Dibble]

Here's an episode on Naked and Afraid where a cast member suffered from heat stroke.

The fact that, once in the hospital and being treated he said "it just came out of nowhere" is very relatable potentially to this case.

 

[Officer Dibble]

According to the following article from The Times, “The temperature in the area was above 100F (38C), but it is believed they started their walk in the early morning when it would have been cooler.”

Phone could hold key to how family and dog died on California hike | The Times

Several articles, including the following article, refer to their hike as a “daylong” hike, meaning that they were likely planning to be out for several hours rather than just a couple hours in the morning.

More questions than answers after autopsy of family found dead

They could have lost the car keys and gone back to look for them by staying together.

 

[Countem]

They could have lost the car keys and gone back to look for them by staying together.

I am just saying that the timeframes currently mentioned in the articles imply that the family left in the morning and expected to be gone for an extended period of time that day (i.e., day hike as opposed to a morning hike).

I am not aware of any article mentioning that vehicle keys were missing from the bodies. The family was found near the end of the trail loop heading back towards their vehicle. Even if they did lose their keys (either permanently or temporarily), it is more likely that one of the adults would have waited with the baby and the dog while the other adult backtracked to speed up the process of retrieving the keys.

MOO.

 

[MntnHiker]

One of the first things that struck me is how untraveled this trail must be right now. They were found right ON the trail and not all that far from the trailhead (1.5 miles). If anyone else hiked that trail after their death, they would have found them, and logically, reported this to the authorities. So that means no one the rest of Sunday, all of Monday, or Tuesday until they were found were on that trail. Wow. I'm used to really busy hiking trails where they likely would have encountered someone even as trouble set in.

I do think this was heat stroke. The baby may have succumbed first, the parents racing to try and get back to the car, but both were overcome as well. I can't see any other explanation for this. It is so sad.

 

[GatorFL]

One of the first things that struck me is how untraveled this trail must be right now. They were found right ON the trail and not all that far from the trailhead (1.5 miles). If anyone else hiked that trail after their death, they would have found them, and logically, reported this to the authorities. So that means no one the rest of Sunday, all of Monday, or Tuesday until they were found were on that trail. Wow. I'm used to really busy hiking trails where they likely would have encountered someone even as trouble set in.

I do think this was heat stroke. The baby may have succumbed first, the parents racing to try and get back to the car, but both were overcome as well. I can't see any other explanation for this. It is so sad.

If you're a serious hiker you've probably been on some lightly used trails. Some trails are also seasonal meaning in the off season they are much more lightly traveled than in season. Here in South Florida, we're in the off season because of temps and rain. My next scheduled hike is in a couple of weeks.

It is possible to hike in 100+ degree temps. You need lots of water, a head covering, cool rags and lots of breaks.

 

[mickey2942]

@MntnHiker I have not been to this park or trail, but I know that in Southern Utah, there are a lot of great places to go hiking, but only tourists visit those places in the summer. Everyone local waits until after October, when it is cool enough to actually enjoy the hike.