Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #12

[otto]

I'm not entirely sure but I believe that DG's sister is the mother to AL's (son) children, which would make DG their uncle.

I'm aware of many people who run in the same business circles that have had legal issues, conflict, falling's out and they seem to come full circle and hook-up again. Given that Airdrie and surrounding area (excluding Calgary) is a relatively small town atmosphere, I don't think it would be such a strange thing that they do business together again. I'm not sure how you have determined that there's "no reason" for "AL and DG to do business together...DG has worked as an employee in one of DG's businesses in the past (I will have to try and find the article I had read that in). The patent dispute may not be as big a problem as we have been thinking it is. IMO, I think there's a good chance that they have crossed business paths again, it would be difficult for them not to. What I have seen in both the construction business and the oil & gas industry (from working in them) is that, business is business and everyone is out to make a buck...JMO, when it comes to money, and if one can be of use to the other, there could very well be a smoothing-over of differences. There is no evidence that anyone has mentation that AL and DG definitely did not have contact for the last 7 years. IMO, I like to keep an open mind in order to rake through all possible scenarios here. . I will try and find supporting evidence that AL's(son) children are with PG.

Alvin's son Allen stated that there has been no contact between the accused and the two intended murder victims for the last seven years. I posted the link a few days ago.

I didn't know that the sister of the accused had children ... no need to find a link ... it doesn't seem relevant.

 

[otto]

Don't self employed people have to pay taxes on a quarterly basis?

From the comments about bankruptcy, it sounds like a realtor would go bankrupt in a booming housing market if there was a failure to pay quarterly taxes, mismanagement of money, and the objective was to avoid paying debt. If the only problem was a failure to secure clients, then there shouldn't be any insurmountable costs - especially in a dual income household.

 

[musicaljoke]

Don't self employed people have to pay taxes on a quarterly basis? .

Not necessarily. It depends on the previous year's income earned. A self-employed person might pay monthly, quarterly, annually, or not at all.

 

[otto]

Not necessarily. It depends on the previous year's income earned. A self-employed person might pay monthly, quarterly, annually, or not at all.

If nothing was earned, then there would be no debt and no reason for bankruptcy.

 

[otto]

This...is a great new line of thought. Like it a lot.

Houses in Consort are cheap - less than $100k, so four acres is probably worth very little.
I still don't really understand what four acres in the middle of nowhere has to do with anything. Is the land owned by one of the victims or the accused, or is it a piece of land that may be associated with someone with the same last name as the victims or the accused?

 

[Tinkerbel1]

When members started posting again on AKF and Panama stuff, I decided to Google other jurisdiction for those entities and after a long sluff of sleuthing I weedled down to yet another company. And once again a company that goes no where with any info whatsoever. One would think after 15 or so companies, the odds that one might have either a website or a semblance of something looking like a company, but it's never the case.

I also wonder how much money was shuffled from one party to the next and how big that sum is in Panama or The Caymans and if one of the partner's in the shuffle was looking to get out of the partnership.

I'm still of the accomplice side of the fence, or at least of the side of the fence where the motivator was much more than a patent disptue,, maybe the patent was a way to get someone motivated towards another goal altogether.

Normally I don't speculate on such matters and I watch the news and let the law do their thing without much question, and - like other new members - this is the first go at sleuthing for me. This time round the news didn't seem right or something just didn't sit right with me in this case, and now all the sleuthing has actually reinforced that inkling that prompted me to go a-looking in the first place, if this makes sense.

Makes total sense to me. I am of the same mindset as you, let LE do their work, typically they come up with exactly what happened. Take for instance the McCann case, there are no bodies there, but IMO, there is no question that something terrible has happened to them and that it was a random thing. They didn't have all these anomalies in their backgrounds, the business dealings that went bad, 15 or so opened/closed/never opened? businesses...interconnection with suspect. Something is for sure not right here...and its sticking out like a sore thumb...when that happens, people do sit up and take notice. IMO, to question the fate of the victims or the circumstances surrounding that fate, is not disrespectful or showing lack of compassion for them or their families. There's enough unanswered questions here that may make it possible for the defense to cast a 'reasonable doubt' on this case. If that happens, DG walks. Likely there would be an appeal, but unless some of this stuff is cleared up, the Prosecution could stand to lose their 2nd chance at convicting...and I believe that's all they get. After that, they can't charge DG again...that's Double Jeopardy. Case closed. Which would be a shame if in fact he did commit these murders. And, on the other hand, if something else is awry, that needs to come out as well. The way our justice system works sometimes, we may never, ever find out for sure. LE has a really big task at hand as far as finding those bodies or having irrefutable evidence that this is DG's doing and one I don't envy them.

 

[Krystine]

Don't self employed people have to pay taxes on a quarterly basis?

From the comments about bankruptcy, it sounds like a realtor would go bankrupt in a booming housing market if there was a failure to pay quarterly taxes, mismanagement of money, and the objective was to avoid paying debt. If the only problem was a failure to secure clients, then there shouldn't be any insurmountable costs - especially in a dual income household.

Yes, income tax and GST are submitted quarterly.
And yes, MANY agents ~ of either sex~ are married to the true bread winner.
Some companies now offer an income split which allows them to pay the company more out of each commission, and there is no monthly amount owing to the real estate company.
Back in "my" day, (80's- mid 2000's), the cost of doing business under the umbrella of the 'big company' cost me $2,000 per month, whether I made sales or not.
There was lots of pressure to produce, unless you were being financed by a working spouse. Some are just attracted to the endless lunches and the ego trip. JMOO of course.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

Alvin's son Allen stated that there has been no contact between the accused and the two intended murder victims for the last seven years. I posted the link a few days ago.

I didn't know that the sister of the accused had children ... no need to find a link ... it doesn't seem relevant.

Just because AL's son stated that there has been no contact between the accused and the two intended murder victims for the last 7 years does not make it fact. I've read the article several times regarding his statement but thank you very much for providing the link to that.
There are children, and if those children's father is AL(son), that makes AL(sr) and DG extended family by marriage. Common-law is considered marriage in Canada. Family typically will iron out differences eventually and if so, this would support the point I was trying to make that the statement of AL and DG not having any contact in 7 years may not be accurate. Which could also mean that they may have had recent business dealings that no one knows about, as I believe was mentioned before be a few other posters. If they have, that may also prove a motive for DG committing the crime. I will look into and find out if PG and AL do in fact have children together, just for interest's sake.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

Sorry, this is in response to Otto's post re: no prior year income, means no debt and no reason for bankruptcy.

There could still be debt...but maybe not in the form of income taxes. There are still credit cards, loans, etc. Plenty of companies out there that will give a self-employed person credit cards and loans based on the equity and asset of a home. A bankruptcy would also cover personal loans. I've spoken to a Trustee that has had the Hell's Angels listed in a bankruptcy as a debt. Its valid and its legal.

Not sure why we are questioning the bankruptcy? It happened...so there obviously was debt, or something legal (financially based: ie., premise lease, vehicle repo) KL needed to be protected from, which bankruptcy would also serve to make null and void (except in the case of any criminal activity, which doesn't appear to be the case).

 

[Krystine]

Houses in Consort are cheap - less than $100k, so four acres is probably worth very little.
I still don't really understand what four acres in the middle of nowhere has to do with anything. Is the land owned by one of the victims or the accused, or is it a piece of land that may be associated with someone with the same last name as the victims or the accused?

Houses may be cheap but top producing farmland, even acreage lots are very expensive. Beyond the reach of many young farmers, even with a huge loan.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

I'm having trouble understanding how DG would benefit from using a dead person's identity to obtain a bank account. We keep getting the notion that he was some unemployed recluse, but if that was all there was to the story then he would not need to do the identity theft. It made sense earlier when he was on the run and hiding, but why now?

IMO it would be beneficial to someone who wants to launder money and not pay taxes or tip off the govt.

So if he was still living the life of crime and laundering money, we would have to assume he obtained this money illegally. The possibilities are endless and I think secret business dealings with the Liknes clan is not too far out there in the realm of possibilities. We are only finding evidence that is published online but IMO that is only the 'tip of the iceberg' and the real truth is at the bottom of the iceberg, covered and hidden and voluminous and mighty.

I like how you think bakerlady!

It seems odd to me as well that he would use the same stolen identity that he was convicted of and served time for already. One would think that would be a huge red flag to LE as soon as it was even attempted. Having said that, maybe DG wanted to get caught? That's a definite possibility which leads me to my next question....why?

 

[Krystine]

In Alberta real estate circles, it is well known that realtors have let their monthly debt to their Agent (company they work for) slide for months, even years. In some cases, the realtor ended up signing his home over to the Agency, and renting it back.
It is very hard for some people to leave the life of RE, even when every fact tells them they should find other employment.

 

[goodasgold]

I'm having trouble understanding how DG would benefit from using a dead person's identity to obtain a bank account. We keep getting the notion that he was some unemployed recluse, but if that was all there was to the story then he would not need to do the identity theft. It made sense earlier when he was on the run and hiding, but why now?

IMO it would be beneficial to someone who wants to launder money and not pay taxes or tip off the govt.

So if he was still living the life of crime and laundering money, we would have to assume he obtained this money illegally. The possibilities are endless and I think secret business dealings with the Liknes clan is not too far out there in the realm of possibilities. We are only finding evidence that is published online but IMO that is only the 'tip of the iceberg' and the real truth is at the bottom of the iceberg, covered and hidden and voluminous and mighty.

It is like he wanted to get caught. You know the saying "do not judge a book by its cover" well maybe "do not judge a case by its news cover". Maybe a whole web of illegal activities led to this murder or disappearance.

 

[Deleted member 117120]

Alvin's son Allen stated that there has been no contact between the accused and the two intended murder victims for the last seven years. I posted the link a few days ago.

I didn't know that the sister of the accused had children ... no need to find a link ... it doesn't seem relevant.

Agreed, the children of PG are not relevant to this case [modsnip].

 

[LoisLane]

A Calgary Herald article has made it into Mexican news.

http://www.mexiconews.net/index.php/sid/224493215/scat/4b980140662cfc90

 

[LoisLane]

Also here is a recent news story of Canadians fleeing Canada to Panama... Obviously this gained International attention.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/05/27/arthur-porter-arrested-in-panama/

 

[Deleted member 117120]

http://www.kijiji.ca/o-posters-other-ads/56563739
I was cross referencing some photos with the KL kijiji ads today and found something odd imo.
As with a facebook page, a kijiji ad page has a password function to log on and amend or delete ads. I noted that several of the furniture item kijiji ads that were previously posted on KL's kijiji page have been removed but several ads still remain for sale. If memory serves me correctly, the items that have been removed from kijiji ads are:
dining/kitchen table and chairs
living room furniture on main level (cream striped colored couch and loveseat, coffee table)
large fern plant
foosball table
office furniture - desks

I realize this likely is not important on the face of it however what it does demonstrate to me is someone has the kijiji ad password and more to that the family is still actively trying to sell the remaining items if they did not remove the ads from kijiji at the time the others were deleted.

I am thinking of the neighbor who was interviewed by msm and was brought into the home by the mover and stated that items were being taken into storage by the family. I surmise that the family is still actively trying to sell the items via kijiji if they are in storage. ??? I would say then that the items not removed from the kijiji ads are for sale and are sellable items. Please draw from that statement that imo the items for sale have no forensic content. And thus likely not involved in the crime scene. To my thinking then, leather set (still for sale on kijiji) being in the office would not be the crime scene and the same could be thought for the pull out couch in the basement (still for sale on kijiji). IMO the crime was in the bedroom as a matter of deduction.

Side note: the candle -cup cake holder many were wondering on WS if the family had put it outside the home for the memorial is still on the kijiji ads as a for sale item. I would assume by that it is in the family's possession.

As well, not sure if this ad was always there originally or whether it has recently been added but there is a kijiji ad for the sale of a Moving company website on KL's kijiji profile.

In summation, it is clear items have been removed from KL's kijiji profile since the estate sale advertisements and subsequent crimes have occurred.
To what end, and who updated and removed items is unclear.

 

[otto]

http://www.kijiji.ca/o-posters-other-ads/56563739
I was cross referencing some photos with the KL kijiji ads today and found something odd imo.
As with a facebook page, a kijiji ad page has a password function to log on and amend or delete ads. I noted that several of the furniture item kijiji ads that were previously posted on KL's kijiji page have been removed but several ads still remain for sale. If memory serves me correctly, the items that have been removed from kijiji ads are:
dining/kitchen table and chairs
living room furniture on main level (cream striped colored couch and loveseat, coffee table)
large fern plant
foosball table
office furniture - desks

I realize this likely is not important on the face of it however what it does demonstrate to me is someone has the kijiji ad password and more to that the family is still actively trying to sell the remaining items if they did not remove the ads from kijiji at the time the others were deleted.

I am thinking of the neighbor who was interviewed by msm and was brought into the home by the mover and stated that items were being taken into storage by the family. I surmise that the family is still actively trying to sell the items via kijiji if they are in storage. ??? I would say then that the items not removed from the kijiji ads are for sale and are sellable items. Please draw from that statement that imo the items for sale have no forensic content. And thus likely not involved in the crime scene. To my thinking then, leather set (still for sale on kijiji) being in the office would not be the crime scene. IMO it was in the bedroom as a matter of deduction.

Side note: the candle -cup cake holder many were wondering on WS if the family had put it outside the home for the memorial is still on the kijiji ads as a for sale item. I would assume by that it is in the family's possession.

As well, not sure if this ad was always there originally or whether it has recently been added but there is a kijiji ad for the sale of a Moving company website on KL's kijiji profile.

In summation, it is clear items have been removed from KL's kijiji profile since the estate sale advertisements and subsequent crimes have occurred.
To what end, and who updated and removed items is unclear.

Most likely their son helped them set up the kijiji ads. That would be my guess. The striped sofa was in the living room near the front entrance. I assumed that the sofa bed was in the second living room, so the crime didn't happen there, but I think it's on the same floor as the side exit. I assumed that the green leather sofa and loveseat were in the office. That would suggest that either the living/dining furniture was sold, or it was damaged during the murders.

 

[Deleted member 117120]

I was thinking perhaps JO was helping her mother with the kijiji ads and in turn the estate sale in general it seems. That would be my thought.
Agreed otto, the striped couch and loveseat were in the living room nearest the front door and since there were open curtains throughout the investigative process and LE had left the front door ajar on occasions, imo the crimes did not occur on the main level so either that set was sold or donated. The sofa bed based on the stair location and surrounding images, I had previously thought were in the lower basement area so agreed I don't believe the crime occurred there either since it is for sale still. The leather set was in the home office area according to the kijiji ad photos of the two desks and the leather furniture. Where in the home exactly that room is, I thought it was at the back of the home with the odd shaped windows as shown by the msm aerial view of the home previously posted and therefore if not removed from the kijiji ads and being for sale still then the crime did not occur there either.

 

[Krystine]

Houses in Consort are cheap - less than $100k, so four acres is probably worth very little.
I still don't really understand what four acres in the middle of nowhere has to do with anything. Is the land owned by one of the victims or the accused, or is it a piece of land that may be associated with someone with the same last name as the victims or the accused?

Otto, LoisLane,... I misread the 1.6 hectares of land as being 164 hectares, my mistake. You're right, 4 acres in or around Consort, AB. would likely not be a great investment.