Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #1

[taylorss]

Murder-suicide suspected in deaths of Toronto billionaire and wife

http://torontosun.com/news/local-news/much-loved-billionaire-couple-found-dead-in-north-york-mansion

They were found hanging side by side near their indoor pool.

It sounds consistent with his personality. He was described as a "ruthless" man, as are many extremely wealthy business executives. It comes with the territory. Perhaps he discovered he had a health problem or something and decided his wife shouldn't live after he died, spending all his money. JMO.

What a horrible person to abandon his young cousins after his uncle died, the one person who helped him become wealthy. Even worse that he fought his cousins in court to prevent them from getting a share of the business that their father helped found. Such unpleasant people are often unhappy when they retire, having devoted their entire life to work and obsession with building wealth. Once they stop working, they realize they have no life, few friends, little happiness.

BBM - where did you get that from??

He was still a student at the time, hardly in a position to adopt 4 boys under age 7! Plus he wasn’t wealthy then or even in the same business as the deceased uncle. It was only later that he got involved with his uncle’s former company and turned it into a source of great wealth. Plus the aunt’s will said that she didn’t want the 4 boys adopted by family.

Moreover he did everything he could for the 4 boys, buying them houses, supporting their families etc, until the troubled young men turned to drugs and turned on him, accusing him among other things of trying to control them by taking care of them financially. This is all from articles linked here about the deceased’s life.

As to the rest of your points, I agree that wealthy workaholics are often unpersonable, and the deceased’s writings seem to indicate a surprisingly grim outlook to accompany a life of such generosity and charity. But those speculative points are hardly victim friendly so probably best not dwelt on.

 

[eriluo]

The premature announcement of the bizarre murder/suicide theory made me think it’s a red herring. If LE really suspected that crazy scenario, seems like they’d investigate fully before announcing it.

Maybe LE actually has a good idea who the perp is and wants to make him think he got away with it, hoping his complacency will lead to actions that give himself away (blabbing, bragging, spending stolen $ if any etc).

There have been a few recent high profile cases of hidden-card tactics used successfully by LE (McStays, Laura Wallen).

My thoughts exactly!

 

[Twinkle]

Any thoughts on the possibility of Erotic asphyxiation?

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[Twinkle]

Extension cord from the garage. Six car underground parking garage, probably on the same level as the indoor pool.

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Yes, the garage is on the same level as the pool. I have looked at the floorplan.

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[Inthedetails]

Early local news reports said the police were considering the deaths a murder-suicide, which friends said amounted to character assassination.

“There is absolutely zero debate in my mind, this was a double homicide,” said Linda Frum, a senator in the Canadian Parliament and a close, longtime friend of the couple.

She added: “This idea that Barry would ever harm Honey — he adored her. That’s impossible. He was a gentle, good man.”

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/12/...to+news&btnG=&client=safari&channel=iphone_bm

The couple showed all the signs of an expanding, invested life. They were building a new home, helping plan their daughter’s wedding and celebrating the arrival of a third grandchild.

I haven't followed the case closely, but when I see men of this age committing suicide (if that is what this is), I think "financial ruin" or some sort of professional disgrace. Perhaps he was facing some downfall, and to protect himself and his wife from disgrace, decided on murder/suicide. I'm sure this has been discussed already, but that was the first thought that popped into my head.

However, it would be difficult to hoist a deceased or unconscious body into a noose. How did he do that, if he did?

I'm reading they were found by the pool. If the railing was close enough to the pool, all you'd have to do is make sure the body was hanging over the edge of the pool to be high enough to hang. How high was the railing?

jmopinion

 

[loveisthemovement]

I admit, the conspiracy theorist in me is popping up with this case. I have to wonder if wording and releasing COD as "ligature neck compression" is intentional. For me, it clears nothing up. It means they could have been strangled or they could have hung themselves. Still clear as mud.

 

[Inthedetails]

I admit, the conspiracy theorist in me is popping up with this case. I have to wonder if wording and releasing COD as "ligature neck compression" is intentional. For me, it clears nothing up. It means they could have been strangled or they could have hung themselves. Still clear as mud.

Tox reports might help.

One theory I have is that he drugged his wife, and that is how he was able to get her neck into a noose. (I'm assuming it was not double-suicide, but murder-suicide.)

If she has drugs in her system and he doesn't, that boosts the murder-suicide scenario.

jmo

 

[dotr]

Yes, I'm making some assumptions that may be unwarranted:
- that a house like that has external cameras and a sophisticated security alarm
- that after some 6 or so hours at the scene, they'd have got hold of and checked the external video and alarm data for entries/exits
- that when those comments were made to reporters, the intent was to reassure the neighbourhood there was no murderer on the loose, rather than to share details of the investigation. Actually, this one I'm fairly sure of, LE are keeping details very close to their chest, so it will be very frustrating to try to sleuth.

rbbm.
Totally agree considering the many recent break ins the neighbourhood. imo.
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/communit...reak-and-enters-in-bridle-path-area-1.3707243
December 5 2017

[h=1]Community meeting held after about 160 break-and-enters in Bridle Path area[/h]

“I think there are a lot of savvy burglars in our neighbourhood and they have found a way – probably watching when people are leaving, coming and going and they pick the right time,” he said.

 

[Snoop Sister]

I haven't followed the case closely, but when I see men of this age committing suicide (if that is what this is), I think "financial ruin" or some sort of professional disgrace. Perhaps he was facing some downfall, and to protect himself and his wife from disgrace, decided on murder/suicide. I'm sure this has been discussed already, but that was the first thought that popped into my head.

However, it would be difficult to hoist a deceased or unconscious body into a noose. How did he do that, if he did?

I'm reading they were found by the pool. If the railing was close enough to the pool, all you'd have to do is make sure the body was hanging over the edge of the pool to be high enough to hang. How high was the railing?
jmopinion

If you look back at pics in previous posts, you will see the rails around the pool. They were not hanging from the ceiling.

 

[Inthedetails]

rbbm.
Totally agree considering the many recent break ins the neighbourhood. imo.
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/communit...reak-and-enters-in-bridle-path-area-1.3707243
December 5 2017

I would go consider a break-in/botched burglary theory if the victims had been shot or strangled....but hanged? That takes a lot of physical effort to hang a body who doesn't want to be hanged. In this case, two bodies. Plus you need the rope and location to do it - which takes planning. I think too much time and effort is required for these deaths for it to be a burglary gone wrong. (Not that burglaries go right, but ykwim.)

jmo

 

[Inthedetails]

If you look back at pics in previous posts, you will see the rails around the pool. They were not hanging from the ceiling.

I will have to go back and look for the photos. If you have a link handy, please post. Off the top of your head, was the railing close to the pool? Was the water in the pool or was it empty?

jmo

 

[otto]

Tox reports might help.

One theory I have is that he drugged his wife, and that is how he was able to get her neck into a noose. (I'm assuming it was not double-suicide, but murder-suicide.)

If she has drugs in her system and he doesn't, that boosts the murder-suicide scenario.

jmo

As a murder suicide, she may have been killed first in another part of the house, and then moved and staged with a noose. Then he could have committed suicide right next to her with a noose.

I would expect that a man who can confront problems in a way that achieves billions of dollars should be able to solve a domestic problem without resorting to murder. The only point that would be unsolvable is that divorce was on the table, but we haven't heard anything along those lines at all.

 

[dotr]

https://globalnews.ca/news/3921922/homicide-police-barry-honey-sherman/

"Apotex founderBarry Sherman and his wife Honey were both killed by ligature neck compression and homicide detectives have now taken over the investigation into their deaths"

They died on Friday Dec. 15 and were found dead, hanging from a railing around the indoor pool in their home

Welcome to Ws SAMJ101!
Wondering if in fact the couple died on Friday, or that the bodies were found on Friday? RBBM.
Apparently they were not seen by anyone on Thursday.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/new...n-and-wife-as-murder-suicide/article37357096/

Mr. Feldman said family members had told him that Mr. Sherman had not been at work on Thursday, and that no one had heard from his wife that day, either

.

 

[buttonbaby]

Autopsy determines they both died from ligature neck strangulation:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5189885/Canadian-couple-died-neck-compression.html

 

[otto]

I will have to go back and look for the photos. If you have a link handy, please post. Off the top of your head, was the railing close to the pool? Was the water in the pool or was it empty?

jmo

The photo was posted yesterday. There was water in the pool and there was a cover. The railing is a normal handrail at something like forty inches height along the end of the lap pool.

 

[Inthedetails]

As a murder suicide, she may have been killed first in another part of the house, and then moved and staged with a noose. Then he could have committed suicide right next to her with a noose.

I would expect that a man who can confront problems in a way that achieves billions of dollars should be able to solve a domestic problem.

Yes, I'm thinking that is what happened, though I'm thinking he drugged her elsewhere in the house rather than killed her. Strangling her would take not only strength against her fighting back, but also a certain mindset to be able to do it. It's an intimate way to kill - looking in the face of your victim. I think he drugged her and then hanged her unconscious body....a much more "passive" way to kill her. And then he hanged himself and they likely died "together."

As for solving domestic problems, I think that is what he did. Not a good solution, but a decisive one.

Total speculation, jmopinion, thinking aloud.

 

[Inthedetails]

The photo was posted yesterday. There was water in the pool and there was a cover. The railing is a normal handrail at something like forty inches height along the end of the lap pool.

Well, if there was a cover on the pool when the bodies were found, that blows my theory that the bodies were hanging into the pool, whether empty or with water in it.

jmo

 

[dotr]

I will have to go back and look for the photos. If you have a link handy, please post. Off the top of your head, was the railing close to the pool? Was the water in the pool or was it empty?

jmo

https://globalnews.ca/news/3921034/suspicious-death-of-apotex-founder-barry-sherman-and-wife-honey/

Picture of the pool from the real estate listing for 50 Old Colony Road. Courtesy: Remax.ca

 

[Pamela_Brewer]

LIGATURE STRANGULATUON

IMO the bodies were staged after death.
This involves a 3rd party.
http://www.forensicpathologyonline.com/e-book/asphyxia/ligature-strangulation

MOO

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[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Welcome to Ws SAMJ101!
Wondering if in fact the couple died on Friday, or that the bodies were found on Friday? RBBM.
Apparently they were not seen by anyone on Thursday.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/new...n-and-wife-as-murder-suicide/article37357096/
.

The date the bodies were found is almost always used as the date of death, even if the deaths actually occurred much earlier.

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