Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #7

[human]

OK, maybe this is getting into Beverly's issues, but - her house? It's a house. She was dying. You can't take it with you, and we don't preserve houses as shrines. Either you leave the house to family who is taking care of the kids and have them move in - probably less disruptive to the kids, and maybe better since the house already had bedrooms for all of them and they could stay in the same schools and have the same friends in class and in the neighborhood - or you ask for the house to be sold. If she really wanted the house to go to her kids eventually, you can set up a life estate where her brother could live in the house until he passed and then it would go to the kids, or set up some kind of trust where everyone could live in the house until all the kids graduated high school and then they'd figure out what to do with it.

I don't know if "perhaps she saw him circling" is how she felt, I certainly hope not because if she was not trusting of Barry's offer to run the business for the benefit of the kids, and not trusting of her brother to raise the kids in the house where they were already growing up, I don't think that says as much about Barry and Wayne as much as it does about Beverly.

How soon did the mother die after the father? 17 days was it? I don’t think she was thinking much about details at that point , or perhaps someone was guiding her.

Interesting that the uncle helps out financially so much. I wonder if there is any animosity towards the sister that she did not find the family worthy.

 

[hudunit]

I thought I read earlier that Barry was encouraged to help the cousins by his mother and when she died he did not keep up contact as much.

 

[hudunit]

I have to admit that I am obsessed with this case.I see no reason to kill Honey except for revenge or to send a message.For this reason I feel it was an accidental MS.However I will eat crow if proven otherwise.Financially no one seems to gain anything by both of their deaths.There seems to be some thought that Apo may be destabilized with the death of its owners and vulnerable for takeover.Maybe the Iranians were mad at Barry for loaning money to someone they an embezzler but really why kill both.Same with Teva if they were involved.Why kill both.Revenge seems the motive and the cousin(s) are obvious suspects,but ....

 

[Grey-St]

Possibly, Beverly didn't view her brother through the same lens that you do?
I think, all these years later and without knowing ALL of the circumstances, we should not be second guessing the wishes of a dying mother.

I know next to nothing about her brother, but Im sure that if she thought he was suitable, she would have chosen him and, as you say, put aside the religious aspect.

All I read was that he was prepared to move into HER house and send the boys to UCC. Perhaps, she saw him as circling in the hopes of getting what would have been a large inheritance. Im basing that on something that said the boys got approx $300,000+ each as they came of age, so a significant amount of money.

And, obviously her chosen religion was seen to be very important to her to pass on to the children.

I respect that we don't know much about any of them, but I interpreted that information to mean Wayne wanted to keep the children together, keep them in their familiar home, and make sure they got a good private school education. It sounds like he loved them, and wanted to be their caregivers. Beverly had her reasons to want her children brought up with Jewish strangers. Those were her wishes and that's how the story unfolded. It is what it is.

 

[AllyJane]

I have to admit that I am obsessed with this case.I see no reason to kill Honey except for revenge or to send a message.For this reason I feel it was an accidental MS.However I will eat crow if proven otherwise.Financially no one seems to gain anything by both of their deaths.There seems to be some thought that Apo may be destabilized with the death of its owners and vulnerable for takeover.Maybe the Iranians were mad at Barry for loaning money to someone they an embezzler but really why kill both.Same with Teva if they were involved.Why kill both.Revenge seems the motive and the cousin(s) are obvious suspects,but ....

Firstly it has already been declared a targetted double murder by LE. I am not sure why you think they don't have evidence to prove this.

Remember KW said a few times that he hates both BS and HS.
Also if someone was interested in destroying or buying or changing ownership of Apotex then it may be a reason to kill HS too. It was a privately owned company owned by BS. It is very likely that if he were killed, then his majority of ownership might go to HS who would be unlikely to sell the company maybe wanting to keep it for the kids. Kill both HS and BS then their children are more likely to sell the company as none of them work in it. HS was a strong willed woman and while she may not be familiar with the day to day of running the company (Apotex has an executive team for that), she is no dummy and may want to keep it to continue BS's legacy.

We only have snippets of information so there could have been other threats to the Shermans that we are not aware of.

 

[Grey-St]

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...nnector-with-best-rolodex-in-the-country.html

She’d shun expensive restaurants for meetings over a bagel or omelettes at United Bakers in Lawrence Plaza. She’d rent “some little putt-putt” car when the couple went down to Florida, Sinclair said. Honey would wave it off if prodded, saying she’d asked for the cheapest.

In the days before she died, Honey was in touch with many of her friends, chatting about Kaelen’s upcoming wedding and the new baby in the family. She sent a last congratulatory email to Aubrey on Dec. 12, about a donation he’d made.

She spoke to Sinclair that day to confirm dinner plans. Those plans never came to fruition.


As the Florida trip was coming - had the cheap little "putt-putt car" been delivered already ....? What if the murderers were some additional passengers knowing Sherman's usual procedure before vacation?

Wouldn't they be picking up the rental in Florida?

 

[Grey-St]

Im sure L Winter left quite a generous estate, what with insurance, a privately owned company (Empire) that AFAIK was doing well at the time of his death. I would think it would be at least a million each, if not more.

Im pretty sure the Winter parents had had discussions about how to prepare for the children, with Beverly being ill and without knowing he was going to have a sudden, unexpected death. If it were me, Id be asking about step parents, education, potential backup parents, religious teachings and how L Winter could 'handle' most eventualities with four little boys. Your own impending death forces those discussions and whatever Beverly decided would have been in agreement with L Winters stated wishes, IMO.

We only have the word of the disgruntled uncle Wayne and very unhappy Kerry Winter to go on, all these decades later.

I don't think Wayne sounded disgruntled. He spoke to how a conversation with BS made him feel uncomfortable and it stuck with him. He spoke to how he had desired to adopt the kids but Beverly had other plans. Wayne's behaviour and KW's behaviour seem like polar opposites. JMO.

 

[casesensitive]

Indeed that was my first thought, but I don't like to have tunnel vision, and want to leave the doors open to other possibilities. He was the obvious suspect from day one, way too obvious, if you know what I mean.
IMHO MOO JMHO

and then practically offers himself on a silver platter as prime suspect. The "bowling" comment was over the top. JMHO MOO
Perhaps I have watched too many mystery shows, where the obvious suspect turns out to be innocent.

:fishy:

Hazel, KW is a mystery to me as well, especially in light of his comments which made him even more suspect.

Apparently KW did not intend to make himself a prime suspect. If he is to be believed, in the Roy Green Show interview, he explains how his intent in speaking to the Fifth Estate, was to dispel the notion that Barry would never kill Honey in a murder/suicide. This was early on when the media ran the m/s theory from the undisclosed source, and the family went public to deny the possibility. It was at this time, and before any mention of both being murdered, that he gave the interview with the FE about BS wanting to hire a hit on HS.

KW also states that the other interview, in the cafe, was suppose to be "off the record" and certainly not included in the FE production. The producer (? I don't recognize his name) of the FE asked him if he ever had thoughts of killing Barry, and we all know how he responded to that question, including his fantasy of BS's decapitated head rolling across the Apotex parking lot.

Once the private investigation source claimed that they were murdered, KW couldn't understand why the FE would continue the documentary using his interview and theory that BS killed HS in a murder/suicide. Is he really that naive? IMO, he was left looking like a fool (that he is) and having to continue his Barry killed Honey theory to this day, despite LE's claim of a targeted double murder. Either that, or he truly believes that this is a cover up by LE, as he has claimed.

His burning desire to smear BS's reputation has backfired. Instead, he has drawn attention to himself as a truly viable suspect in many people's opinion, although the only one that counts is LE. His explanation as noted above, makes sense to me. He was doing all the blabbing while he thought it was a murder/suicide. To date, the Fifth Estate has not denied his assertions about the interviews.

https://omny.fm/shows/roy-green-show/kerry-winter-cousin-of-barry-sherman-says-toronto

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Wouldn't they be picking up the rental in Florida?

:shame:

 

[dotr]

:shame:

No shame, nice to have you on thread FromGermany!

 

[Grey-St]

:shame:

No worries!

 

[kay74]

OK Just got back from grocery shopping and the tabloid at the checkout "GLOBE" , front page cover showed BS & HS and said the killers were found through fingerprintst! I couldn't wait to get back on here. Hahaha. Never ever believe tabloids. What bs ( no pun intended).

 

[Peace777]

OK Just got back from grocery shopping and the tabloid at the checkout "GLOBE" , front page cover showed BS & HS and said the killers were found through fingerprintst! I couldn't wait to get back on here. Hahaha. Never ever believe tabloids. What bs ( no pun intended).

Who did they name as the killers I wonder? How can they get away with such a headline, when the case isn't solved yet?

 

[north_west]

Firstly it has already been declared a targetted double murder by LE. I am not sure why you think they don't have evidence to prove this.

Remember KW said a few times that he hates both BS and HS.
Also if someone was interested in destroying or buying or changing ownership of Apotex then it may be a reason to kill HS too. It was a privately owned company owned by BS. It is very likely that if he were killed, then his majority of ownership might go to HS who would be unlikely to sell the company maybe wanting to keep it for the kids. Kill both HS and BS then their children are more likely to sell the company as none of them work in it. HS was a strong willed woman and while she may not be familiar with the day to day of running the company (Apotex has an executive team for that), she is no dummy and may want to keep it to continue BS's legacy.

We only have snippets of information so there could have been other threats to the Shermans that we are not aware of.

IMO if the plan required the killing of both victims, then the motive may have been to hasten an Initial Public Offering (IPO) of the company.

Do we know that BS owned all the company stock?

Those who stand to make a boatload of cash upon an IPO of Apotex include any private shareholders and the firm who underwrites the IPO (the underwriter fee can be substantial - anywhere from 1-7% of the capital raised).

 

[WINDSOR]

Who did BS have private (non-pharma) financial dealings with?

Could these, individuals feel betrayed, scammed, cheated, ripped-off by BS even if BS used the legal means to take advantage of the individual(s)?

Were any of these dealings with individuals who had links with another country?

These individuals want to continue to operate in North America in the future as investors with other partners, but want to let current and future partners know, do not to take advantage of them?

I can think of two or three entities already that fit the scenario, there are probably several more.

If I were an investigator on this case, I would check all the corporations and business entities that BS or HS (on paper) were involved in. Then I would see which ones involved a partnership where some partner/individual appears to have gotten the 'short end of the stick' so to speak.

Then I would focus on those who had the financial means and the desire to seek revenge on BS & HS. No doubt the TPS is doing this already.

 

[AddyFinch]

OK Just got back from grocery shopping and the tabloid at the checkout "GLOBE" , front page cover showed BS & HS and said the killers were found through fingerprintst! I couldn't wait to get back on here. Hahaha. Never ever believe tabloids. What bs ( no pun intended).

:drumroll:
I think they have the wrong country............

 

[Lexiintoronto]

OK Just got back from grocery shopping and the tabloid at the checkout "GLOBE" , front page cover showed BS & HS and said the killers were found through fingerprintst! I couldn't wait to get back on here. Hahaha. Never ever believe tabloids. What bs ( no pun intended).

'..lethal ex-employees of the Mossad spy agency...'

 

[AllyJane]

'..lethal ex-employees of the Mossad spy agency...'

Yes I am sure ex Mossad agents leave their fingerprints everywhere. /sarcasm IMO Love those tabloids

 

[kay74]

Who did they name as the killers I wonder? How can they get away with such a headline, when the case isn't solved yet?

That's what I was wondering! I couldn't read it because I was checking out and I don't want to buy a tabloid. They get away with this bs all the time.

 

[Grey-St]

Who did BS have private (non-pharma) financial dealings with?

Could these, individuals feel betrayed, scammed, cheated, ripped-off by BS even if BS used the legal means to take advantage of the individual(s)?

Were any of these dealings with individuals who had links with another country?

These individuals want to continue to operate in North America in the future as investors with other partners, but want to let current and future partners know, do not to take advantage of them?

I can think of two or three entities already that fit the scenario, there are probably several more.

If I were an investigator on this case, I would check all the corporations and business entities that BS or HS (on paper) were involved in. Then I would see which ones involved a partnership where some partner/individual appears to have gotten the 'short end of the stick' so to speak.

Then I would focus on those who had the financial means and the desire to seek revenge on BS & HS. No doubt the TPS is doing this already.

The possibilities are endless. I agree that they should be, and probably are, looking into all his business dealings. The condo development is one, the criminal fraudster he fronted money to and later sued is another.