Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #8

[JayFriend]

Story in Wall Street Journal.

After a Billionaire and His Wife Are Found Dead, Their Children Try to Crack the Case

<modnote: inserted correct link>

 

[Bravo]

I don't believe this was a staged murder/suicide. I don't believe one word from KW. Incredibly rude to speak ill of the dead. I do believe this was murder. IMO

 

[emmet]

I really do think they back away from their first near declaring it was m/s too quickly.

 

[1&2&3]

Is the Private Investigator still working for the family? It would be interesting to know if he is coming across leads.
With a man of Barry’s reputation and station in life, this may take a long time to solve, if it is ever solved. IMO.

The biggest question to me is why murder both Barry and Honey? What grievance did the person have with Honey?
IIRC, Honey had little to nothing to do running the business. With murdering them both, it seems to be a personal grudge/hate. The only ones that come to mind to fit this idea would the cousins first, one or more of the children, or another member of the family.

 

[Kerry Winter]

You are saying Barry had an assistant in this murder suicide who still lives and you know who this person is?

I’m strongly suggesting a theory which l believe that something happened in the hours between Honey and Barry’s deaths.
I also have reason to believe that there was a “clean up/staging” and my cousin didn’t act alone.
I don’t know who helped....but, have a VERY good idea.
Know this: Honey was dead and moved to the pool.

 

[Kerry Winter]

Still waiting for the audio recording of Barry murdering honey. And the article from a high profile US publication exposing the truth. Now there is an accomplice. Right.

The leak of the audio recording came from a reliable source and has been buried. The article will arrive....patience. It won’t be a fluff piece like yesterday’s Wall Street Journal.
I KNOW Honey died hrs before Barry. If you draw logical conclusions you would have to believe that the multiple murderers ordered in pizza and watched Netflix with my cousin before killing him....mind you, without a single defense wound!
Please.

 

[Tortoise]

I KNOW Honey died hrs before Barry.

Even medical examiners/forensic pathologists can't calculate time of death with that much accuracy, so I don't know where this information is coming from.

Case in point - Jason Rohde currently on trial for the murder of his wife Susan, cause of death ligature strangulation, in their hotel bathroom. Prosecution says he strangled her and staged a hanging, he says she committed suicide by hanging. Her body was discovered at just after 8am, pathologist attended scene at 1pm same day. Defence and prosecution pathologists disagree over time of death - the range put forward is 2:30am to 8am, even though one of the first people on the scene at 8:30am said she was clearly dead, and cold with blue lips.


Rigor mortis is variable, and there was significant delay between the Sherman's deaths and the discovery of their bodies :

"Starting between two and six hours following death...Rigor mortis then spreads to the other muscles, including the internal organs, within the next four to six hours. The onset of rigor mortis is affected by the individual's age, sex, physical condition, and muscular build."

Rigor mortis - Wikipedia

What is your source for the information that Honey died hours before Barry?

 

[JDG]

There is great variability in when Rigor sets in. If you die in hospital, they want to get your pillow(s) out from under you right away and get you 'flat' on the bed.
It may take time to remove the corpse from the room but they need the deceased to be flat asap.

 

[JayFriend]

Rigor mortis is variable, and there was significant delay between the Sherman's deaths and the discovery of their bodies :




What is your source for the information that Honey died hours before Barry?

I believe it was concluded here that Honey died first, various sources. There were also separate pictures of the bodies being removed. One appeared to be laying flat on the gurney while it seemed that the other had the knees bent. This would indicate different stages of rigor mortis.

 

[Tortoise]

I believe it was concluded here that Honey died first, various sources. There were also separate pictures of the bodies being removed. One appeared to be laying flat on the gurney while it seemed that the other had the knees bent. This would indicate different stages of rigor mortis.

I think you've mis-read the content of my post. Even if they were at different stages of rigor mortis it wouldn't give you a different time of death.

 

[Sillybilly]

Sorry folks, posts have been removed. You can't transcribe / direct quote from a subscription only article or from one that has been archived by another person on the web. It is a copyright violation and therefore against TOS.

You may paraphrase and include the link (in case someone else has a subscription or wants to pay for one). You can post the portion of the content that may be included in a search preview summary, but you cannot copy and paste or quote directly from the paywalled article itself.


Thank you.

 

[dotr]

I think you've mis-read the content of my post. Even if they were at different stages of rigor mortis it wouldn't give you a different time of death.

Either way, the result was the same. imo.
Private investigators believe Toronto billionaires Barry and Honey Sherman were murdered, source says | CBC News
WARNING: This story contains graphic descriptions that may be disturbing to readers"
"Their bodies were otherwise limp and their arms unbound when they were discovered, the source said"

 

[JayFriend]

I think you've mis-read the content of my post. Even if they were at different stages of rigor mortis it wouldn't give you a different time of death.

I guess that's valid if died in different parts of the property with different temperatures, one was moved, the other wasn't.

 

[JDG]

I believe it was concluded here that Honey died first, various sources. There were also separate pictures of the bodies being removed. One appeared to be laying flat on the gurney while it seemed that the other had the knees bent. This would indicate different stages of rigor mortis.

By the time the bodies were removed, Rigor was probably past. It isn't a permanent state, it goes away after a number of hours. That 'body' that appeared to have 'knees bent' was probably the body with the attached 'belts/other sundry things that were used in the murder/set up of the bodies' atop the corpse.
Whatever was attached to the railing would have been placed onto one of the bodies and sent along to the coroners office for examination. The less its handled, the better.

 

[Kerry Winter]

Still waiting for the audio recording of Barry murdering honey. And the article from a high profile US publication exposing the truth. Now there is an accomplice. Right.

The leak of the audio recording came from a reliable source and has been buried. The article will arrive....patience. It won’t be a fluff piece like yesterday’s Wall Street Journal.

 

[MistyWaters]

The leak of the audio recording came from a reliable source and has been buried. The article will arrive....patience. It won’t be a fluff piece like yesterday’s Wall Street Journal.

Are you saying you believe an illegal recording device had been planted in the Sherman home? And it just happened to record the sounds of a murder/suicide? If so, what a coincidence. My question would be why would anyone plant a recording device other than with malicious intent?

 

[Tortoise]

Are you saying you believe an illegal recording device had been planted in the Sherman home? And it just happened to record the sounds of a murder/suicide? If so, what a coincidence. My question would be why would anyone plant a recording device other than with malicious intent?

I believe KW once stated (wtte) that he believes a figure with a jacket held over his head walked towards the camera and moved it so the action wouldn't be filmed, but forgot to turn the audio off.

 

[Arnie M]

Various clips from mainstream media .... anyone else see the contradictions ???

................................................................................


“My reaction was total disbelief,” Jonathon Sherman said. “Anyone who knew our father would tell you the same thing. Our dad was a pacifist and would have trouble squashing a bug.”

“You were like a lock and key,” Jonathon Sherman said of his parents at the service, “each pretty useless on your own. But together, you unlocked the world for yourselves, and for us, and for so many others.”

Some of Mr. Sherman’s rivals, especially those who had been targets of his lawsuits, said in interviews that the Apotex founder was aggressive and vindictive in his legal attacks—once personally delivering a court order to a competitor’s office.

Mr. Sherman wasn’t afraid to challenge government regulators. When Canada’s health ministry tightened policies for new drug applications in 2015, Apotex’s law firm served lawsuits to some of the ministry’s staff at their homes.

In a subsequent meeting with senior government officials, Mr. Sherman became so agitated he started swearing, people familiar with the meeting said.

“He got really upset when people did stupid things,” Mr. Kay said

 

[MistyWaters]

Various clips from mainstream media .... anyone else see the contradictions ???

................................................................................


“My reaction was total disbelief,” Jonathon Sherman said. “Anyone who knew our father would tell you the same thing. Our dad was a pacifist and would have trouble squashing a bug.”

“You were like a lock and key,” Jonathon Sherman said of his parents at the service, “each pretty useless on your own. But together, you unlocked the world for yourselves, and for us, and for so many others.”

Some of Mr. Sherman’s rivals, especially those who had been targets of his lawsuits, said in interviews that the Apotex founder was aggressive and vindictive in his legal attacks—once personally delivering a court order to a competitor’s office.

Mr. Sherman wasn’t afraid to challenge government regulators. When Canada’s health ministry tightened policies for new drug applications in 2015, Apotex’s law firm served lawsuits to some of the ministry’s staff at their homes.

In a subsequent meeting with senior government officials, Mr. Sherman became so agitated he started swearing, people familiar with the meeting said.

“He got really upset when people did stupid things,” Mr. Kay said

Every single one of us possess a multi-faceted personality, from aggressive to impatient to kind and loving. I don’t know anyone who is 100% always just the same, do you?

Nothing indicates an inkling of physical violence, as I recall it’s been mentioned Barry Sherman preferred to fight his battles in the courtroom, as he had every right to do. That his children treasured the memories of the father they knew, that’s to be expected as well. The contradictions you list merely prove he was human imo.

 

[Kerry Winter]

I believe KW once stated (wtte) that he believes a figure with a jacket held over his head walked towards the camera and moved it so the action wouldn't be filmed, but forgot to turn the audio off.

Very good.